The PM needs a new ride

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Mapleflt
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The PM needs a new ride

Post by Mapleflt » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:51 pm

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/pm-s-pl ... -1.4712296

I smell an shinny new Global 7000 in the works
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Old fella
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Old fella » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:57 pm

Indeed, time to unload that clunker.
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C.W.E.
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by C.W.E. » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:58 pm

Indeed, time to unload that clunker.
Or better still get rid of Mr. Dressup.
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goingnowherefast
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by goingnowherefast » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:03 pm

Globals would be cheaper to operate than an wide body twin jet.
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Capt. Underpants
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Capt. Underpants » Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:38 pm

C.W.E. wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:58 pm
Indeed, time to unload that clunker.
Or better still get rid of Mr. Dressup.
It doesn’t matter who’s in the office. Even if we did get rid of “him”, we should happily pay to provide safe, reliable and secure transportation for our PM.
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DadoBlade
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by DadoBlade » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:38 am

Actually, a Global 7500 would suit His Highness and His Sycophants perfectly, however, the entourage of media and support miscellany would require an additional aircraft, such as a second-hand Boeing 737-900ER once owned by a Middle-East potentate. Ultimately, a two (2) aircraft minimum is required to transport our PM, including his ego.
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bcflyer
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by bcflyer » Tue Dec 03, 2019 7:50 am

DadoBlade wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:38 am
Actually, a Global 7500 would suit His Highness and His Sycophants perfectly, however, the entourage of media and support miscellany would require an additional aircraft, such as a second-hand Boeing 737-900ER once owned by a Middle-East potentate. Ultimately, a two (2) aircraft minimum is required to transport our PM, including his ego.
When he is no longer the PM what would you suggest as secure transportation for the next leader of our country?
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Old fella » Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:30 am

bcflyer wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 7:50 am
DadoBlade wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:38 am
Actually, a Global 7500 would suit His Highness and His Sycophants perfectly, however, the entourage of media and support miscellany would require an additional aircraft, such as a second-hand Boeing 737-900ER once owned by a Middle-East potentate. Ultimately, a two (2) aircraft minimum is required to transport our PM, including his ego.
When he is no longer the PM what would you suggest as secure transportation for the next leader of our country?
Putting political partisanship aside on who has the keys to the PM’s office, long distance travel to various points thorought the world has always been an essential component of any sitting government. No, certainty not the lavish travel styles like some Middle East Sheik despots nor a comm platform like Air Force one but a long range type for security and communications for the sitting PM and his/her required associates. Having said that I suspect the G of C will continue to pour money into that aging junkster because spending money on new aircraft acquisition for PM travel is unpalatable similar to 24 Sussex Drive. It’s a shame in my view but that is how it goes here in Canada.
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Gannet167
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Gannet167 » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:50 am

A Global would be nice and a likely replacement for the ageing challenger fleet, down to 2 aircraft that are ADSB equipped and able to enter the US or Europe. Between training and maintenance, that leaves less than 2 a day on average for use, not accounting for unserviceability, on a fleet that at times has done a surprising amount of flying for various government departments worldwide.

Chretien only flew in Challengers, avoiding what he called the "flying Taj Mahal" that this aircraft was equipped as under Mulroney. That left the one vip 310 to be largely unused as it wasn't good at troop transport or cargo. I believe it was generally what people took up to fly circuits with while the rest of the fleet was being used operationally. Chretien also was a huge Bombardier fan, and helped see the struggling Challenger project to fruition when he was Minister of Industry before becoming PM. This meant Canada showed up to world summits in a short RJ and parked beside rows of vip 747s and 340s. It had the added benefit of no space for media to travel with him. In reality, the vip A310 "CC150 Polaris" looks like a 1970s Winnebago inside. It's nothing luxurious. Rows of extension cords line the cabin floor so people can have power for laptops etc.

The economics of repairing wrinkled skin on a 310 fuselage and an engine could suggest a write off and parting out of this 35+ year old hull. They may pay to repair it, given that procurement works as a glacial speed in Canada. In addition, any government purchasing new vip transport for itself faces difficult criticism for treating itself to opulence, regardless of if it's warranted.

The military Challengers were bought and forced on the military to help out struggling Canadair that was on the edge of bankruptcy. Some were used as "red air" in fighter training and electronic warfare. A few (after removing the gold plated lav sinks the original customer ordered and one rumoured to have a "Mecca meter" which always pointed to Mecca, should anyone need to know in which direction to pray) were removed, were converted to government Vip duty. The A310s were originally Wardair machines that were forced on the military after a notorious merger with a crown corporation. In both cases, a very nonstandard method of procurement that had a much easier spin for the public.

While new 330 combi and refuelers are needed, as are new Globals, with the current state of equipment in the Canadian Forces and RCAF, I think even Trudeau would have difficulty justifying a purchase for his needs.

Here she is when nearly new, back in 1988, without the Aeroflot paint job it now has.
https://www.airliners.net/photo/Wardair ... bath8IUz9X
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pelmet
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by pelmet » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:13 pm

"During the tow tractor change, while no tractor was attached, the aircraft started moving forward and over the chocks. Attempts to stop the aircraft by the tow crew were unsuccessful."

I would be curious to know more about these chocks if the aircraft actually did go over them.

The last time I saw one of these ex-Wardair A-310's hit a hangar was out in Vancouver during an engine run. Can't find a picture of that incident anymore.
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North Shore
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by North Shore » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:16 pm

Interesting, that....how does a jet that size just move forward despite "the chocks being in place and the parking brake on." Or did someone f@@k up, and now they're arse covering?

Also, despite cries from various quarters about the 'MSM' and their 'left-wing bias', you'll note the bias in linking the plane to Mr. Trudeau, rather than to the Prime Ministership or the Government in general.

Lastly,the whole argument for business aviation is that the CEO's time is too valuable to be wasted on sitting in airport waiting room rather than getting on with their trips and discussing business privately in their own aeroplane. As a country, we should get off the pot, and buy two, three, or four Globals for routine executive transport. Perhaps, for larger events (G7 conferences, and the like) we could charter from Air Canada, and thus save the cost of having a wide-body tucked away in a hangar somewhere, waiting for the PM's call..
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TG
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by TG » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:35 pm

Speaking about old clunker, I've been told in the past that a DC-8 would stay on its chocks no problem during a full run up.
But engines Off and a little bit of momentum would be enough to make it jump them.

Probably the same with an A-310 or any aircraft this size and mass...
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Gannet167
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Gannet167 » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:12 pm

Thousands of wide body aircraft are parked and towed everyday. This is a very very rare occurrence. The parking brake doesn't miraculously fail, AND at the same time the aircraft jumps the chocks. Two separate independent failures (very reliable brake system, AND somehow also rolled over chocks) on the same day, same time, on flat surface, widebody aircraft rolls by itself with enough momentum to damage it that badly? Yeeaaahhh. Laws of physics were suspended momentarily there. Or, maybe the tug pulled it.
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Capt. Underpants
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Capt. Underpants » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:15 pm

The parking brake is only as good as the hydraulic accumulator pressure. If that's gone (which can happen for more than one reason), then the parking brake control is nothing more than a switch connected to nothing.
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pelmet
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by pelmet » Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:49 pm

This is why I am interested in the chocks, such as size and how far from the wheels they were placed.
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goingnowherefast
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by goingnowherefast » Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:12 pm

The Transat 310s might not survive the merger. Great way to get some spare aircraft and parts for the RCAF. Not sure anyone else would want a wide body that old.
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ahramin
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by ahramin » Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:01 pm

The Transat 310s are gone irrespective of the merger.

Also they can be bought for less the scrap value, but then the RCAF would need to put the manpower into scrapping them.
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Gannet167
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Gannet167 » Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:22 pm

If the full force of the RCAF were put behind purchasing AT's 310s them right now, it would take several years of bureaucratic bungling to secure the deal and likely cost as much as new 350s. But all other things being equal, probably be a smart move if it could be done.
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Alav
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Alav » Wed Dec 04, 2019 1:14 pm

Since it'll be operated by the RCAF...

Lets get a the PM a smokin deal on a 737max :)
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goingnowherefast
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by goingnowherefast » Wed Dec 04, 2019 1:50 pm

The Canadian Government withdrew from the Super Hornet because Boeing was suing over the C-Series. Same problem with the max. ACJ320 series might be worth a look. Certantly cheaper to operate than a A310, and the 321 isn't too much smaller. Could even sell it to the voters as "extravagant twin isle jet being replaced by a frugal single isle"
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pelmet
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by pelmet » Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:36 pm

Now his back-up plane is broken and they have commandeered the Airbus being used by our GG to tour Europe. Can't they both just come back to Canada on the travel service of their hero....the Greta Express. Hypocrites…..

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/tr ... london-u-k
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by pilotbzh » Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:01 am

A hand full of A220’s could be a good alternative...
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Mapleflt
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Mapleflt » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:07 am

Absolutely, good ride for the press gallery
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Gannet167
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Re: The PM needs a new ride

Post by Gannet167 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 11:26 am

The C Series had all the hallmarks of a new plane for the government. Manufactured in the right province, new type, struggling to get orders and get the project going into profitability, manufacturer in financial trouble, threat of high paying jobs being lost (it's like the Canadair Challenger, all over again) but then it became the very successful Airbus 220 and the excuse to buy it is gone.

A Global makes sense on many levels and is what several heads of state use. It would have the speed, range, small footprint and easily complete the Vip, military medevac and light utility cargo transport that current Challengers do. They're not dedicated Vip machines.

There will also be a need for a larger machine that has more capacity, and that fleet will likely have to hold double duty as a strategic airlifter doing troop and cargo transport and likely refuelling as well. The government is not going to buy a single widebody fleet just for Vip.
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