Pilot and pax lucky to be alive

[CFR]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=9591 ... nPageNum=1

"Pilot and pax lucky to be alive after homemade helicopter crashes in Langley"

Of course aircraft design, pilot skill and training had nothing to do with it, thank goodness for luck!

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

[rigpiggy]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... -1.3778116

[Rockie]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=9591 ... nPageNum=1

"Pilot and pax lucky to be alive after homemade helicopter crashes in Langley"

Of course aircraft design, pilot skill and training had nothing to do with it, thank goodness for luck!

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

Actually...they're lucky to be alive.

[Heliian]

aircraft design, pilot skill and training had nothing to do with it

Homebuilt helicopter, weekend warrior, limited training. check.

[AirFrame]

Homebuilt helicopter, weekend warrior, limited training. check.

As someone who knows the owner/pilot, only the "Homebuilt Helicopter" part of that statement is true, although its relevance is questionable. If you knew him, you'd know his attention to detail, the amount of time he spent training before transitioning to flying this helicopter, and the amount of time he's put into becoming proficient on this helicopter... Time well spent, apparently... At least he was able to get the helicopter down with the passengers intact when things went sideways.

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

Ditto for some of the people posting here. Although I do think that there's always an element of luck in any emergency like this.

[Nark]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=9591 ... nPageNum=1

"Pilot and pax lucky to be alive after homemade helicopter crashes in Langley"

Of course aircraft design, pilot skill and training had nothing to do with it, thank goodness for luck!

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

Actually...they're lucky to be alive.

How do you figure?

Fancy tidbit of info for you: some/most/a lot of helicopters are designed in such ways that crashes are very survivable.
But you knew that.

[I WAS Pez]

Homebuilt helicopter, weekend warrior, limited training. check.

As someone who knows the owner/pilot, only the "Homebuilt Helicopter" part of that statement is true, although its relevance is questionable. If you knew him, you'd know his attention to detail, the amount of time he spent training before transitioning to flying this helicopter, and the amount of time he's put into becoming proficient on this helicopter... Time well spent, apparently... At least he was able to get the helicopter down with the passengers intact when things went sideways.

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

Ditto for some of the people posting here. Although I do think that there's always an element of luck in any emergency like this.

Glad to hear everyone is OK - and if the pilot was who I suspect it may have been (MJ?) then I second AirFrame's sentiments re: preparation and attention to detail.

In any event, the fact that everyone is OK is the really important bit.

[AirFrame]

Glad to hear everyone is OK - and if the pilot was who I suspect it may have been (MJ?) then I second AirFrame's sentiments re: preparation and attention to detail.

Not MJ... I think he only flies certified helicopters (Robinsons). I'm only aware of one Amateur-Built helicopter active in the lower mainland.

[I WAS Pez]

Thanks - and, just happy that everyone walked away.

[Old Dog Flying]

I also know the pilot and fully agree with Airframe..for once!

[Rockie]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=9591 ... nPageNum=1

"Pilot and pax lucky to be alive after homemade helicopter crashes in Langley"

Of course aircraft design, pilot skill and training had nothing to do with it, thank goodness for luck!

Boy the media are beginning to annoy me.

Actually...they're lucky to be alive.

How do you figure?

Fancy tidbit of info for you: some/most/a lot of helicopters are designed in such ways that crashes are very survivable.
But you knew that.

Helicopter crash with the machine laying on its side, and barely a scratch on them. Think of all the things that could have happened that didn't...no flying debris strikes, no ruptured fuel tank or fire, flying over relatively obstacle free terrain. The list goes on...

Kudos for whatever skill and inherent safety features were at play here, but denying the presence of luck - or if you prefer the absence of more bad luck is just not being realistic. "Chance" is an ever present factor in this game whether we like to admit it or not.

[Redneck_pilot86]

You create your own luck.

[BeaverDreamer]

I have watched this helicopter on training flights nearly every single day for the past couple months. I doubt training/currency was a factor here. Of course they are lucky to be alive. As is everyone who experiences a real forced landing. Sure, 99% of instances should be survivable but there are so many factors that can contribute to something going wrong.
The area around CYNJ (other than to the east) doesn't offer much for emergency landing areas even for helicopters, the pilot definitely did a good job; everybody walked away.

[Nark]

Actually...they're lucky to be alive.

How do you figure?

Fancy tidbit of info for you: some/most/a lot of helicopters are designed in such ways that crashes are very survivable.
But you knew that.

Helicopter crash with the machine laying on its side, and barely a scratch on them. Think of all the things that could have happened that didn't...no flying debris strikes, no ruptured fuel tank or fire, flying over relatively obstacle free terrain. The list goes on...

Kudos for whatever skill and inherent safety features were at play here, but denying the presence of luck - or if you prefer the absence of more bad luck is just not being realistic. "Chance" is an ever present factor in this game whether we like to admit it or not.

I fly an updated version of a 1972 designed helicopter. Chances are extremely high that a helicopter will roll over upon an "unplanned" landing. Things like the seat, skids (struts) etc... are designed to take the majority of the energy upon impact.
The fuel tank (I don't know this specific helicopter) is designed to be self sealing in the event of a crash.

Many helicopters are designed to take extreme vertical and longitudinal forces. Lateral forces offer very little protection.

Again, luck has a significantly less impact on the survivability than you think.
As mentioned, skill and currency played a very large factor in this crash survival.

[Zaibatsu]

Lots of the rotating components are in a plane away from the occupants as well. Not good for close spectators, but rotor blades shearing off will go flying outward from the hub, not inward to the cabin. Rather unlike an uncontained fan or turbine failure or any prop failure on airplanes with wing mounted engines.

[Rockie]

I fly an updated version of a 1972 designed helicopter.

You fly a combat helicopter do you not?

Again, luck has a significantly less impact on the survivability than you think.
As mentioned, skill and currency played a very large factor in this crash survival.

I neither disagree or agree with your last statement, I just prefer to read the investigation report before making a pronouncement on how much skill played a factor in surviving this crash.

Skill, training and judgement are things you can control, luck has to do with things you cannot control such as the timing of an engine failure, or the fact the engine failed to begin with. The Hudson river landing demonstrated great skill and coolness under pressure, but what if it happened out over the water on a blustery day in Boston, or over a large forested area, or at 200 feet on Sully's approach to LGW instead of his departure? Lucky it didn't...right?

Luck, or lack of it has much more to do with what we do than you think. I can name several instances where blind, dumb luck saved my bacon in situations I had no actual control over.

You create your own luck.

There are pilots who mistake luck for skill.

[CFR]

Depending on what a preliminary examination finds it is unlikely there will be a detailed investigation or any investigation report but at some point we may hear what took place and indeed it may turn out to be a combination of things (accidents usually are).

My original post was not intended to declare skill led to the successful result, it was only to point out that the media had already attributed survival to luck alone. This bugs me almost as much as the opposite situation where an out of control aircraft randomly crashes between buildings and they label the pilot a hero for avoiding houses!

Ah well, I guess a headline needs to be sensational to attract readers or viewers and there's only so many ways to spice it up. I guess that's why all buses that go off the road "plunge".

[AirFrame]

The pilot has given a detailed description of events to the TSB, and I expect as others have mentioned that they won't investigate further unless they're having a slow week. Amateur-Built accidents are understandably the lowest priority on their list, although having "helicopter" there does raise their interest a little bit.

Still, after the power loss that precipitated the autorotation, it's not really any different from any other helicopter autorotation... You hope and train for the best, but unplanned ones sometimes don't work out as perfectly as you'd hope.

[Nark]

Airframe,

Why kind if helo was this? Rotorway?
After watching a British dude build one (Discovery Wings, on YouTube) it looks very challenging, beyond what an RV would take.

I've only flown helicopters with tons of inertia in the blades (TH-67,OH58, UH60), nothing squirly like a Robby.

Rockie,

Much like the jet engine, many advents from military construction have made their way to civilian applications.

[Rockie]

My original post was not intended to declare skill led to the successful result, it was only to point out that the media had already attributed survival to luck alone.

Did they say their survival was attributed to luck alone? Did they imply it? I think you're being overly sensitive here, they simply said the occupants are lucky to be alive to which most people including me would think "yup...they are".


Nark

Are you comparing this machine's crash survival ability and all around robustness favourably with a Blackhawk?