If it was fuel exhaustion I’m sure it’ll still take two years for us to hear about it.
The TSB has to be sure of their findings before they release them.
Just imagine if you or I ran a business that was as inefficient as the TSB.
The taxpayers should refuse to fund any organisation that is as inefficient and vague in their findings as that one.
If it was fuel exhaustion, it will be a Class 5 occurrence and out in a matter of months, just like the dozens of Class 5 reports they release every year from accidents as a result of uncreative stupidity.
Liftdump wrote: ↑Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:18 pm
i would think if you just sumped the tanks the answer would be evident in under a minute.
Just because there is no fuel in the tanks after the landing, doesn't mean there was not enough fuel in the tanks at take-off.
While unlikely, fuel leaks, engines burning/leaking more fuel, fuel lines that break etc are all possible causes and should be investigated before publicly accusing the pilots of leaving without enough fuel.
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As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
It's been a while since this NOTAM was issued but, make me wonder if the AVGAS issue played a hand here.
CYHQ
180001 CYHQ NATIONAL
CYHQ POTENTIAL QUALITY ISSUE OF FUEL 100LL (JET A NOT AFFECTED)
DISTRIBUTED BY IMPERIAL OIL (EXTENT UNKNOWN)
VERIFY LOCALLY FOR AVBL
1802160008 TIL APRX 1802231800
ditar wrote: ↑Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:25 pm
I’ve never flown a Navajo so I have no experience with it. How reliable/accurate are the fuel gauges?
Accurate enough. Loss of fuel pressure due to fuel starvation looks awfully like a fuel pump failure. Forgot to transfer back to the main tanks? Misidentified emptying the aux tanks as a fuel pump failure and shut them both down? Mere speculation.
Agree, it's a definitely a possibililty ("mere speculation") that ample supply remains in there, s o m e w h e r e .
You must keep the faith that the experts in T.C. and the TSB will find it if it is there, remember it is only a few days since it happened and there are so many places that fuel could be they have not had sufficient time to find it yet.
Agree, it's a definitely a possibililty ("mere speculation") that ample supply remains in there, s o m e w h e r e .
You must keep the faith that the experts in T.C. and the TSB will find it if it is there, remember it is only a few days since it happened and there are so many places that fuel could be they have not had sufficient time to find it yet.
I think they left it somewhere in Medicine Hat.
If it did run out of gas, how out of the Situational Awareness loop are you that you press on and attempt to make it over a populated city rather than put it down in a field, or one of the small strips along the way before both quit? Just a thought.
trey kule wrote: ↑Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:43 pm
I cannot tell from the pictures. Are the fuel caps all on?
That could explain a big fuel loss
Not that they could not have been put on afterwards...
There is a picture in one of the news articles with the TSB taking a photo of the gas cap and filler opening. The tab on the cap was up so it's a possibility.
pdw wrote: ↑Sun Apr 29, 2018 10:26 am
Although, it's not impossible that someone took a quick look (at any time after that landing) just to check how dry, and not necessarily a pilot.
There's another photo from the Herald that shows the TSB opening up the cap.
The chances of 2 independent systems failing at the exact time are very slim. Most common causes are fuel starvation, or fuel contamination i.e. jet fuel. Both unacceptable mistakes you can eliminate through discipline.
I also highly doubt all 4 fuel pumps would fail at the same time.
The lack of information on something as simple as determining if this airplane ran out of fuel is typical of aviation in Canada.
If you ignore these accidents the public will soon forget and there will be no real effort made to protect the paying public from exposure to such preventable accidents.
That crew were just plain lucky no one was killed.
If they ran out of fuel they should be charged with negligent operation of an airplane carrying paying passengers at the very least....and T.C. should be included in the charge for failure to ensure the safety of the flying public..
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Last edited by C.W.E. on Sun Apr 29, 2018 3:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
