Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

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pelmet
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by pelmet »

rookiepilot wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:18 pm
pelmet wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:17 pm

Based on what I have seen here today...I suspect that all your ranting and raving on other threads(such as St. Catherines) was just pretend-to-care about those people with probably other motives in mind(lawsuits for financial gain?).
Keep going, its amusing.

You've been owned in this whole thread, dude. Keep going, popcorn is hot.
Ok, another example of me being "owned"....

https://generalaviationnews.com/2019/09 ... l-for-two/

Failure to secure fuel cap fatal for two
September 12, 2019 by General Aviation News Staff 9 Comments
After refueling the Beech C35, the pilot and the pilot-rated passenger took off to return to the pilot’s home airport.
During the initial climb, the airplane accelerated to about 67 knots and reached an altitude of about 170′ above ground level before it began to slow and lose altitude, consistent with a loss of engine power.
Although more than 2,300′ of relatively level grassy terrain suitable for an emergency landing remained ahead of the airplane, the pilot made a left turn back toward the departure end of the runway at the airport in Camden, Arkansas.
During the turn, the airplane entered a steep left spiral, hit the ground, and caught fire. Both people on board the plane died in the crash.
The airplane’s left main fuel tank cap was found on the left side of the runway about 1,000′ from the threshold and 4,500′ from the main wreckage. The cap’s locking lever was engaged, and it showed no fire or impact damage.
The fuel selector valve was found positioned to the right main fuel tank feed position.
Flight control continuity was confirmed, and no other preimpact anomalies were found.
According to the pilot operating handbook for the airplane, the fuel selector should be on the left main fuel tank for takeoff. It is likely that the left main fuel tank cap was not secured after the airplane was refueled and fell off the airplane’s left wing onto the runway during the takeoff. Without the cap in place, fuel escaped from the left main fuel tank and subsequently starved the engine of fuel during the climb, resulting in the power loss.
The pilot likely switched the fuel selector to the right main fuel tank in an attempt to restart the engine. When he tried to turn back to the airport, he failed to maintain a safe airspeed, and the airplane exceeded its critical angle of attack and entered an aerodynamic stall.
Probable cause: The pilot’s improper decision to return to the runway instead of landing straight ahead when the engine lost power and his failure to maintain adequate airspeed while maneuvering for an emergency landing, which resulted in an exceedance of the airplane’s critical angle of attack and an aerodynamic stall. Contributing to the accident was the pilot’s failure to properly secure the left main fuel tank cap after refueling, which resulted in a loss of engine power due to fuel starvation during the takeoff climb.
NTSB Identification: CEN17FA364
This September 2017 accident report is provided by the National Transportation Safety Board. Published as an educational tool, it is intended to help pilots learn from the misfortunes of others.


Thank god we have people like you for advice Rookie. Otherwise we would never get our bread buttered(and yes, I did see how you tried to be funny by adding the buttering of bread to your hilarious checklist before you deleted it as seen at 11:17 in this post below).....

viewtopic.php?f=118&t=136967&start=50#p1103077

Child.
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rookiepilot
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by rookiepilot »

Oh, Fatal accidents are never funny. No one is saying that.

Your analysis sure is, though.

Oh; and last I looked, this was the subject of this thread:


"An aircraft towbar was left on a runway by a pilot who had experienced a "close shave" driving to the airport, an investigators' report said.
The Cessna towbar fell onto the runway departing from London Southend Airport on 7 August.
Its pilot said he had been distracted during his pre-flight checks by an earlier near-miss between his motorcycle and a cyclist.
A plane that landed later ran over the towbar, but no damage was caused.


You've changed it to some expose' on fatal accidents, after you've been shown up.

Anything else?
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laminar
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by laminar »

Tow bars have always been a fear of mine with regards to this type of incident. My personal rule is a tow bar doesn't leave my hands. I pull it from a rack, move the plane, and take it back to the rack before my next task.
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pelmet
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by pelmet »

rookiepilot wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:40 pm
Oh, Fatal accidents are never funny.

Your analysis sure is, though.

Anything else?
Only a bit of curiosity about your accident. What happened and what can we learn from it?

This is a perfect forum for a detailed analysis. I could start a new thread if you prefer.
rookiepilot wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:40 pm
Oh, Fatal accidents are never funny. No one is saying that.

Your analysis sure is, though.

Oh; and last I looked, this was the subject of this thread:


"An aircraft towbar was left on a runway by a pilot who had experienced a "close shave" driving to the airport, an investigators' report said.
The Cessna towbar fell onto the runway departing from London Southend Airport on 7 August.
Its pilot said he had been distracted during his pre-flight checks by an earlier near-miss between his motorcycle and a cyclist.
A plane that landed later ran over the towbar, but no damage was caused.


You've changed it to some expose' on fatal accidents, after you've been shown up.
The only thing I have been shown is the complete incompetence of many posters, including you. I give multiple examples of fatal accidents that would have been prevented by a couple of simple procedures(each lasting only a few seconds) and several of you latch onto calling it more checklists and simply making extremely juvenile responses. It is a true explanation of why accidents continue to happen...the thought process of so many.
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Last edited by pelmet on Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

7ECA
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by 7ECA »

North Shore wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:22 am
Morning Checklist #1, Rev 1

Reason for amendment: Insert 'Butter: APPLY'

Coffee start Button: DEPRESS
Toaster ENGAGE
Coffee: POUR
Cream: AS DESIRED
Toast: REMOVE
Butter: APPLY
Jam: APPLY
You'll need an additional revision, you've forgotten the 3-Ss. Important part of any morning routine.

Oh dear, and you've forgotten anything about getting dressed and making sure your epaulettes are shiny, and you've neglected the wearing of an appropriately large watch... :lol:
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C-GGGQ
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by C-GGGQ »

7ECA wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:52 pm
North Shore wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:22 am
Morning Checklist #1, Rev 1

Reason for amendment: Insert 'Butter: APPLY'

Coffee start Button: DEPRESS
Toaster ENGAGE
Coffee: POUR
Cream: AS DESIRED
Toast: REMOVE
Butter: APPLY
Jam: APPLY
You'll need an additional revision, you've forgotten the 3-Ss. Important part of any morning routine.

Oh dear, and you've forgotten anything about getting dressed and making sure your epaulettes are shiny, and you've neglected the wearing of an appropriately large watch... :lol:
That's only morning checklist #1
Please refer to morning chelist #2-6 for those steps
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7ECA
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by 7ECA »

C-GGGQ wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 8:31 pm
That's only morning checklist #1
Please refer to morning checklist #2-6 for those steps
Darn, I guess I forgot to add to my silent checks a check to check if I had checked if there were any additional checklists for the morning...

Might need to add those little coloured sticky tabs to the checklist. :)
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pelmet
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by pelmet »

Another example of how a quick final check would have prevented the circumstances leading up to a fatal accident. A bit more difficult to do on floats but still can be done fairly easily. Pilot forgot the gas cap.

https://tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-reports/ ... 8p0108.pdf

"Following this accident, Fort Langley Air Ltd. made several changes to its training program. These changes included the following: • increased awareness and training on fuelling procedures and the importance of confirming that fuel caps are replaced after fuelling;"

Kinda like I said.....throughout the thread.
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Last edited by pelmet on Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

PanEuropean
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by PanEuropean »

laminar wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:01 pm
My personal rule is a tow bar doesn't leave my hands. I pull it from a rack, move the plane, and take it back to the rack before my next task.
My personal rule is that I always put some other operator's name on my towbar. :mrgreen:
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PA32pilot
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by PA32pilot »

Did that oil fill cap snap down? Trust your gut feeling and taxi back. Better to suffer some embarrassment than suffer through a whole flight,or worse.
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iflyforpie
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by iflyforpie »

You don’t need a fancy checklist. It’s called a walkaround.

Look at every surface of the aircraft and the area around the aircraft for abnormalities. If the systems that are in place have been implemented properly (flags, high vis markings, ground icing training, norms, etc) you aren’t going to miss anything and you don’t need to write a new checklist for every different plane or situation.

Most others are satisfied by actually following the manufacturer’s checklists (which already include all of the killer items) and improvements over the years which added layers of technology rather than more checklists (takeoff config warning, EGPWS, etc).
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Geez did I say that....? Or just think it....?

pelmet
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by pelmet »

iflyforpie wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:14 am
You don’t need a fancy checklist. It’s called a walkaround.

Look at every surface of the aircraft and the area around the aircraft for abnormalities. If the systems that are in place have been implemented properly (flags, high vis markings, ground icing training, norms, etc) you aren’t going to miss anything and you don’t need to write a new checklist for every different plane or situation.

Most others are satisfied by actually following the manufacturer’s checklists (which already include all of the killer items) and improvements over the years which added layers of technology rather than more checklists (takeoff config warning, EGPWS, etc).
You don't need any checklist. I doubt that Fort Langley Air has any new checklist. They have a procedure to check fuel caps after fueling. After all, fuelling likely happens thousands of times per year AFTER the walkaround is complete, which makes a thorough walkaround kind of useless for ensuring the caps are back on in those cases. Just like several other items which I suggest checking. Takes less time than I spent on this post. This pilot would be alive if he had done what I suggest, and he may well have done the world's most thorough walkaround.
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Last edited by pelmet on Wed Mar 25, 2020 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jakeandelwood
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Re: Pilot leaves towbar on runway??

Post by jakeandelwood »

My final check before getting in is tow bar, fuel caps, baggage door, oil cap and dipstick, takes 15 seconds. Other than the oil cap and dipstick which I just feel is important to double check any of the other things could become a problem again between your pre flight check and take off if you fuel up before take off. Yes and I check my gear at least 2 more times after the pre landing checklist.
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