Private Air
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore
-
- Rank 1
- Posts: 45
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:13 pm
Private Air
Anyone know if they offer a schedule (was looking at their Hawker FO ad) or your days off were the days you didn’t fly?
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
I would be happy to answer this question.
Due to the nature of the owner flights, and a dedicated crew for the airplane, We don’t have a set schedule per se. I can assure you that we far exceed CARS minimums for days off. I can’t imagine a circumstance other than training, where the crew would be working (and I consider days sitting in Florida as working days) for more than 10-12 days per month, in a very busy month, as this airplane will likely have very little charter. Because it is a new type for the company though, we’re not sure exactly what to expect for charter hours. If it’s getting more than expected, the owner is amenable to hiring a third full time crew member to get a rotation. But, it the meantime, If you want specific days off, you request them and you almost assuredly get them. It has worked very well for us thus far. I actually can’t think of a time when requested days off has been denied.
With this particular owner, generally we have anywhere from 24hrs-3 weeks notice of upcoming trips. I can only think of 1 single time in 3 1/2 years flying for him, where we’ve done a same day trip for him nor will excessive same day charters occur. With the exception of 1 airplane in the company, we can probably count on 1 hand how many same day charters we do, across the fleet. This owner is extremely reasonable with his expectations and in his trust for crew decisions. We have never been pushed to fly in weather situations that are questionable (we stayed In Florida an extra night just this weekend due to weather) and he makes sure we are well taken care of on the road. Just FYI, I cut my foot on a rock in the sand this weekend when I jumped off a jet ski in Florida while YYZ was getting hammered by Ice....that’s how we roll.
Due to the nature of the owner flights, and a dedicated crew for the airplane, We don’t have a set schedule per se. I can assure you that we far exceed CARS minimums for days off. I can’t imagine a circumstance other than training, where the crew would be working (and I consider days sitting in Florida as working days) for more than 10-12 days per month, in a very busy month, as this airplane will likely have very little charter. Because it is a new type for the company though, we’re not sure exactly what to expect for charter hours. If it’s getting more than expected, the owner is amenable to hiring a third full time crew member to get a rotation. But, it the meantime, If you want specific days off, you request them and you almost assuredly get them. It has worked very well for us thus far. I actually can’t think of a time when requested days off has been denied.
With this particular owner, generally we have anywhere from 24hrs-3 weeks notice of upcoming trips. I can only think of 1 single time in 3 1/2 years flying for him, where we’ve done a same day trip for him nor will excessive same day charters occur. With the exception of 1 airplane in the company, we can probably count on 1 hand how many same day charters we do, across the fleet. This owner is extremely reasonable with his expectations and in his trust for crew decisions. We have never been pushed to fly in weather situations that are questionable (we stayed In Florida an extra night just this weekend due to weather) and he makes sure we are well taken care of on the road. Just FYI, I cut my foot on a rock in the sand this weekend when I jumped off a jet ski in Florida while YYZ was getting hammered by Ice....that’s how we roll.
-
- Rank 1
- Posts: 45
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:13 pm
Re: Private Air
Perhaps a more realistic way of asking would be.
How many days a month can I turn off my phone, start the day with a Baileys, and travel three hours away from base?
How many days in a row can I do the above?
How long in advance can I plan days I want to do the above?
How many days a month can I turn off my phone, start the day with a Baileys, and travel three hours away from base?
How many days in a row can I do the above?
How long in advance can I plan days I want to do the above?
-
- Rank 1
- Posts: 45
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:13 pm
Re: Private Air
Well that's exactly it. I mean, I have no doubts this is a great company, and a sweet gig (good pay too!) but not having a schedule and being "on call" all the time is not something I want to do.Otherwise, you are essentially always tied to the phone, can't really plan anything in life. It would probably be a great gig for a single young dude/girl though.Zaibatsu wrote: ↑Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:43 pm Perhaps a more realistic way of asking would be.
How many days a month can I turn off my phone, start the day with a Baileys, and travel three hours away from base?
How many days in a row can I do the above?
How long in advance can I plan days I want to do the above?
Best of luck to whoever gets it
- schnitzel2k3
- Rank (9)
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 11:17 pm
Re: Private Air
Most will do the drinking on the road with their drinking buddy when schedule permits - you know the plane's generally not going anywhere for the next 2 or 3 days. Once she's chocked and you get the all ok from dispatch, you are now on duty rest, have at'er. If I remember correctly cdn
It sounds like this particular owner is open to increasing the flying on the jet (midsize Hawkers are usually pretty busy - they fit a great niche and price point - just suck for luggage), which if that's the case would be great to get a third crew member on there. That's the way all jets should be run on this side, the 2 pilot scheme while on the surface is cost effective, causes revolving doors with crews as they get tired of waiting by the phone.
If having days off is important so you can crack the Bailey's or Jack at 9am, charter management/corporate probably isn't for you. I've always found (while never having flown for Private Air myself) that with companies like this, you start to see the patterns in bookings and clients. Still doesn't mean you can bust out the liquor if you are running on a 2 hour on call.
S.
, you guys have a pretty good on the road compensation system. Correct me if I am wrong, no per diems, but the crews have a generous allowance for both activities and meals well in excess of standard per diems at most places IIRC. I can't remember if that's at Private or prior to the acquisition at Algonquin.
It sounds like this particular owner is open to increasing the flying on the jet (midsize Hawkers are usually pretty busy - they fit a great niche and price point - just suck for luggage), which if that's the case would be great to get a third crew member on there. That's the way all jets should be run on this side, the 2 pilot scheme while on the surface is cost effective, causes revolving doors with crews as they get tired of waiting by the phone.
If having days off is important so you can crack the Bailey's or Jack at 9am, charter management/corporate probably isn't for you. I've always found (while never having flown for Private Air myself) that with companies like this, you start to see the patterns in bookings and clients. Still doesn't mean you can bust out the liquor if you are running on a 2 hour on call.
S.
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
Like anything, it takes some time getting used too. Generally if you stay sober until dinner time, you’re not going to have an issue. On weekends/evenings, if we happen to get a call for a charter and you’ve already had a drink....guess what, we don’t do the charter, but lets be reasonable adults. I’ve never let this job stop me from living my life with my wife and kids. I have 3 that are 5yrs old and younger. I routinely enjoy their t-ball, swimming, hockey, gymnastics etc and haven’t missed a birthday, Christmas or major milestone yet and often visit the in laws out of town at their house or trailer or go to friends cottages in Muskoka or Lake Huron. I drop the kids off at the bus most mornings and pick them up to play road hockey most afternoons, I don’t need to have a drink to enjoy what life brings, so that aspect has never been an issue for me personally. The owner is also reasonable as said above. He will literally call and ask if it’s ok if we go tomorrow or something like that. If there are extenuating circumstances and he can’t go, it’s never the end of his world.
Schnitzel is correct, we don’t pay per diems, but the allowable expenses are very generous and allows us to have very enjoyable days away.
As also said above, it ain’t for everyone. If you want to be able to plan every minute of every day, this gig ain’t for you and I think that goes with just about every job at the North end. We don’t have a lot of turnover unless airplanes are sold. I have been with the company 5yrs and started when we had 2 airplanes at Algonquin Airlink. As Private Air, we now have about 17 airplanes all around Canada. We’re headed in the right direction and look forward to meeting the next one to join us.
Schnitzel is correct, we don’t pay per diems, but the allowable expenses are very generous and allows us to have very enjoyable days away.
As also said above, it ain’t for everyone. If you want to be able to plan every minute of every day, this gig ain’t for you and I think that goes with just about every job at the North end. We don’t have a lot of turnover unless airplanes are sold. I have been with the company 5yrs and started when we had 2 airplanes at Algonquin Airlink. As Private Air, we now have about 17 airplanes all around Canada. We’re headed in the right direction and look forward to meeting the next one to join us.
Re: Private Air
Is this still Frank Kelner's company or did he sell it off and only runs Northstar now?
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
No, it is no longer Franks company nor is he involved in the operation
Re: Private Air
Does Private air still operate there Falcon 20.I haven't seen it around for some time.
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
Negative....it was parked for a while for a major inspection and has been subsequently sold.
-
- Rank 1
- Posts: 45
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:13 pm
Re: Private Air
cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
- schnitzel2k3
- Rank (9)
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 11:17 pm
Re: Private Air
I've heard the stories and I would take your system over per diems any day of the week.cdnpilot77 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:52 am Schnitzel is correct, we don’t pay per diems, but the allowable expenses are very generous and allows us to have very enjoyable days away.
Too bad more operators don't do this.
S.
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
It varies depending on charter and owner needs....I think I had about 75 hotel nights last year. However, some of those were day rooms. I would say an average to a busy month is 5-6 overnights, maybe as high as 10 but as I said, earlier I can’t imagine too many scenarios where we’re away 10 or more nights in a month. I also had some months with 1 or none. Initial training is 15 days and recurrent is 5 days so those months are more time but otherwise it’s pretty darn civilized.Torresdenochea wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:46 am cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
Edit: I should add, I also flew other airplanes within the company and had a full initial course to attend in 2017 so that contributed to my nights away.
Last edited by cdnpilot77 on Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:11 am, edited 2 times in total.
- schnitzel2k3
- Rank (9)
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 11:17 pm
Re: Private Air
Some times you just have to dive right in and see, who knows you might just like it.Torresdenochea wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:46 am cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
S.
-
- Rank 1
- Posts: 45
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:13 pm
Re: Private Air
Yep, just wanted to make a comparison with Regionals. I think 8-10 nights a month you are away anyway and fly a lot more.
- cdnpilot77
- Rank 10
- Posts: 2467
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:24 pm
Re: Private Air
I have to be honest.....I love it! I didn’t get into aviation just to burn jet fuel. I got into it for the entire experience, see things, do things and just happened to have a passion for all things airplanes too. We get all of that!schnitzel2k3 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:09 amSome times you just have to dive right in and see, who knows you might just like it.Torresdenochea wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:46 am cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
S.
- schnitzel2k3
- Rank (9)
- Posts: 1456
- Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 11:17 pm
Re: Private Air
I'm the same way. I had a fork in the road a few years back between airlines and private and don't regret my decision one bit.cdnpilot77 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:19 amI have to be honest.....I love it! I didn’t get into aviation just to burn jet fuel. I got into it for the entire experience, see things, do things and just happened to have a passion for all things airplanes too. We get all of that!schnitzel2k3 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:09 amSome times you just have to dive right in and see, who knows you might just like it.Torresdenochea wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:46 am cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
S.
You meet great people, have control over lots of aspects of your life, which most people lose in larger companies but don't realise they do.
S.
Re: Private Air
Geez, you guys are making this sound like quite the lifestyle my wife could could support..cdnpilot77 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:19 amI have to be honest.....I love it! I didn’t get into aviation just to burn jet fuel. I got into it for the entire experience, see things, do things and just happened to have a passion for all things airplanes too. We get all of that!schnitzel2k3 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:09 amSome times you just have to dive right in and see, who knows you might just like it.Torresdenochea wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 6:46 am cdnpilot77;
How many overnights (layover periods) would you say you typically do in a month?
S.
Anyone looking for Ottawa based crew?
-
- Rank 5
- Posts: 340
- Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:59 am
Re: Private Air
The salary in the job ad, 60k, is that the pay for FO or does it go up once they are experienced on the plane and alternating left seat every other leg, like the ad mentions.