Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, North Shore
7 years of that? Can you say....Stockholm Syndrome? Sure..... I knew you could.Airborne28 wrote:Great writing cHange-!!! thanks for posting.
I can vouch for everything he said. Worked at CMA for 7 years, ramp to 3000 hr captain.
epiccHange- wrote: He's grabbing the yolk like an orangutan strangling a kitten.
no no. as in it took 3k to get that captains seat and then he stopped counting because I mean man.. now you're a 1900 captain making the big coin living in your aunts basement off 3rd in richmond!! Glory days my friends!!iflyforpie wrote:7 years of that? Can you say....Stockholm Syndrome? Sure..... I knew you could.Airborne28 wrote:Great writing cHange-!!! thanks for posting.
I can vouch for everything he said. Worked at CMA for 7 years, ramp to 3000 hr captain.
I hope that wasn't 3000TT..... otherwise that works out to four years of ramp and three years of the typical 1000+ hours per year they do.
Now where do I begin?Where should I begin? The aviation community is small, so I may seem vague, yet try to describe my and some other fantastically epic stories that would contradict most laws from labour Canada, as clear as possible. My goal is not to sewer the man at the top of the CMA food chain (even though, he has sewered numerous fine captains in his day, I'll touch on that later), but to pass on my stories, so for the right person, they aren't going to work every day hating themselves for joining, and can’t quit, cause they can't afford to walk away from the bond. Someone once told me if I included "in my opinion" then it isn't defamation, not that my intent is that, but rather give my 2 cents, so in my opinion;
I started off as a low timer; my interview was that of the same caliber of a NASA or Cathay interview. I assumed I would be training beside Chris Hadfield, doing space walks and flying inverted with maverick. The interview went well, as a walking encyclopedia I corrected both the CP and HR lady numerous times. The material that was used was from regs 10 years prior, cutting edge, progressive airline. I waited for several weeks until I received word about my spectacular offer. I was ecstatic! Join the ranks of NASA, off to space, bitches!
It felt like nine years of throwing bags, checking people in, doing this and that. Getting periodic updates on the low pilot program (which means once). But after two years (the wait now, is in excess of three years), I got the call!! Guess who is going to space? Nope, not me, got to do groundschool first. In three days from now. Holy F, good thing I've been studying every night after I tugged one out, thinking of the high life the pilots have. Over nighting in various hot spots of western Canada, banging babes.... off to g-school I go! Couldn't wait to meet the other awesome candidates that would be joining me in a jerk off circle talking about the 1900, daaaaaang!!
Roll up to the 7 star hotel in yvr, bums shooting up in parking lot. I tipped my hat, grabbed my package and gave them an air shot. Strolling up to the front desk, threw down my ID, and expected the presidential suit. Nope, just your standard two bedroom hotel room. Mini fridge - check, coffee maker - check, big leagues.
Take a look in the bathroom, and there was a guy taking a s**t. With the door open. Nice. Hey bud, how’s life? Turns out folks, CMA gives you a roommate in groundschool. And they don't tell you. Till you interrupt a dude, mid-wipe. Perfect. Study buddies. But wait! This is going to be a competitive groundschool? Best mark wins? Oh no, best mark gets their choice of base, if there is room. That’s right, you don't know where you'll be living in three weeks. Nope, not until you pass your ppc. And then if you’re lucky you get 5 days. Its okay, CMA pilots are balling, huge pay cheques, don't you worry about that mortgage in Vancouver, you are going to rent a hole in Calgary. We'll even fly you there. Via the milk run. Yep, you fly yvr to yyc in 9 hours air time. Your ass is going to be sore. Almost as sore as that time you got drunk in college... I strayed from the story. Back to the competition. Seniority only means anything four times in your career at CMA. This is the first time. Anyways, groundschool was good, contracted instructor, fun times. Of the 5 or 6, 2 didn’t make it. Pretty common story. Don't worry about getting paid, cause you ain't. Not till you get ppc'd. And I think the record is 6 weeks, we were lucky, longest guy took 4 weeks from start of ground school till he was signed off. We be making some huge money soon boys! Now for the ride, as a low timer, I hadn't flown anything except for my microsoft flight sim on my weekly transatlantic flight in 2 years. It was pounded into me that the big dog wasn't going to pay for more than 8 hours of training. If I wasn't ready, then F off. Also, as a low timer, I was always reminded that I was lucky, the low time program was in jeopardy, buuuuuuull s**t bra, there is no way anyone but a dumb low timer will work in yyc, yvr, yeg for $9. He'd go bankrupt paying people a fare wage. Again, sidetracked. Back to the training.... Pheuph, good thing I downloaded the 1900 onto my flight sim, this will be easy. Turns out, it wasn't. People don't want to be in key roles because they want to, it’s because they get paid that much more. It means duey can give him that superiority over the other guys, it means he can feed his ego. And of course, make a dent in his Prius payment. Usually it’s about the money. Cause when you get paid s**t, dirt sounds a lot better. My ride was in Calgary, which was good, because all my training was done in yvr. I like surprises. I hate parallel runways. However, the ride was amazing, the fellow was a CMA management guy, and wow, he knew that there isn't a healthy chance that half the low timers could pass with this kind of training. So he said, we have 3 hours, I have a list of s**t you need to do, and we'll keep doing them till you get it right. Fair enough? Yep. Sounds good. Unfortunately, that sort of common sense is long gone. Now, there is transport Canada standard. And CMA standard. We are talking NASA s**t folks. And if you fail as a low timer? Yep you guessed it, start at the bottom of the list. You thought you’d be captain in 3-4 years? You're looking at 7-8 mav. Don't F up.
Line indoc was good, flying around at mach 3, chasing babes. One of the captains used to love to take his FOs to the international side of yvr while wearing tunics and hats. He'd get a boner thinking of the people that were talking about him. I swear he'd jerk off to himself at night. People say that every company has one dick. CMA is no exception, for some reason, they have the best dicks in the country. And lots of them. Ego driven sobs. Guess what day it is today bitches? Pay day, back in the day, CMA was paying FOs a ton of dollars, every two weeks for a first year all star? $804! Boy band money! But as the fellow who started this thread said, it be better now. Too bad, cause living in poverty is F-ing fun! I've learned a little over the years, and one big one is, the big dog, nick named low cost. Is one cheap mofo, the corners that were cut were amazing. However, he'd probably splurge on a fancy big city lawyer.....
Now, good old CMA is head quartered strategically in the middle of nowhere. You need to talk to management? Hr? Call'em up! Ha! Keep dreaming mav, they never answer, you leave'em a message, they'll call you back. When? F it, they probably won't. The second time seniority means something, Vacation! That’s right, the zed fares! Goodness, let’s fly across the world and party like rockstars! Don't be changing your mind now, you can't do it yourself, nooooo sir, you need to fill out a pass request and wait 7-10 days. HQ wants to know where everyone is all the time, these guys are pro's! Let me give you a scenario, you are in yyc trying to get back to yvr. You booked on AC zed fares, the flights are packed, cause they cancelled one. S**t, now what? Hmmm reciprocal pilot agreement with another carrier? F That cowboy! No sir! You are paying full fare on wj. Haha better strap in Fabio, jump seat will never happen. Why? Cause it’s called the RECIPROCAL pilot agreement. Remember that time I suggested someone is cheap? Well, maybe someone is a good business man, maybe someone has the idea that instead of giving a seat out for free, then that person will pay full fare. F trying to boost morale, and pretend to be a real airline! That’s right! However, that may not be the reason that we don't have jumpseat, I actually asked hr that once. Maybe twice. Maybe three times. And the answer? Never the same. Yet all entertaining. Let me share.
"We don't have the correct computer program"
"It’s in the works"
"The 1900 doesn't have a jumpseat"
"Our company id's aren't controlled, old employees that didn't turn in their id's could travel on our name"
"Why"
And my favorite;
"It’s not fair to the other employees, pilots getting something extra" I watched an individual get upgraded and then was assigned a different base. He commuted for 11 months. It took him 11 months to get back to live with his wife and kid! He had to pay full fare going back to his assigned base every week. You are probably s***ing in your shorts saying that’s not fair. Company response, shouldn't have taken the upgrade. Don't go bankrupt son, we need you to work.
Upgrades, Pass fail ratio for upgrades? Take a guess Houdini, if you guessed half, you are bang on. Some of these bros have 3k on the 1900, and are getting tanked? Remember, CMA doesn't pay for top notch trainers, noooo sir, these fellas have their own criteria, he doesn't like the way you smell, doesn't like your accent. You are F-ed mister. Now, let’s think about AC or WJ, what is there fail rate? Oh wait, change+ might not like that comparison. Let’s try sunwest and north cariboo with a splash of air georgian. Point is, training dollars are spent in absurd ways, and you are stuck for an extra year in the penalty box. Penalty box you ask? Oh yes, let’s give you a cherry of an example. 4k captain, charter to some rustic vacation hole gets a master warning light on landing. Cabin Door. Hang on to your nut sack! Oh wait. We just landed. Perfect. Let’s call up dispatch, homies. 'Sorry fellas, can't fly. Got a light.' A conversation with the Kiwi and guess who is in the penalty box. That’s right, the captain that made the decision not to go. A safety orientated decision. His punishment. No more charters. 4 months. Who cares you ask? CMA has 'charter pay' to convince pilots that we are like the other players. An extra $75 per charter. Huge dollars for a guy eating kd 4 times a week. He averaged 10 charters a month. Pull out your calculator point dexter, you are looking at a weeks’ worth of hookers and blow.
The company moral for everyone is in the tube, McDonald night shift workers have a better outlook then the CMA staff. And the pilots are the worst, they are treated by management with no respect, the company is always trying to F you without any lube. 13 hour day? "Hey we need you to reposition the a/c" you try piping up and say hell no, duty time bitches!! Then they throw you a faceful of unforeseen! Wtf? Are you high? Any discrepancy with dispatch? They say 'oh let me grab the CP, you can talk to him' perfect, then I'll be talking to the CP/owner/VP/CASO. Splendid, that guy can fire me! S******t better throw some gas in that bird! I’m oughta here!! Relationship with maintenance? Ahhh yes, some of my good friends were in maintenance. Smartest guys in the room, you bring them a snag, first question, is it in the book? Hells no? Perfect! Early night boys!! And talk about low morale, second lowest in the company. There was a time when the mtc boys pooled all their pop can money and such and bought a pool table, for after work and such, had it for two weeks in the mtc break room, boys were happy, laughter was heard. Low cost walks though the hanger one day. Sorry fellas, no room for fun. Lose it hombre. Now, change+ is thinking that this is all made up and bull, but I'm going to remind everyone, that smithers is nick named 'moon base alpha' cause of its proximity to reality. Things aren't the same there as the cow town and china town.
Ahhhh yes vacation, fairly standard bidding process, seniority based, no one goes on vacation at the same time, why? Cause they don't have enough staff! You need a day off, call in sick! Their sick day program is amazing, worse than your local corner store! They are changing it, their response for the last 10 years.... but don't you worry about that. We are talking vaca, let’s say you asked for a week or 2 in March. You don't find out, till Feb 25th. When the rosters come out. You'd think they would post a vacation schedule, but that doesn’t hit the mean streets till at least may. Yes sir, they are 'too busy' to give a s**t about you sweetheart. Now, let’s think of the logistical nightmare we have on our hands. You might be going on holiday with one of your super model girlfriends, but you can't commit, cause some fat blonde in smithers can't make up a friggin schedule. So you play it off as you are doing a last minute deal on itravel2000. But guess what Christopher Columbus, you picked spring break! You'll be lucky to get a week in mexico city! Its okay, we have zed fares. Go to the airport, look at the departure board and mail in your request. 7-10 days. Fml,
you want to get married? Don't tell smithers, they have a great reputation for forgetting about weddings. 'Sorry sugar tits, we can't get married in two weeks, rosters came out, I’m working, can we reschedule? But, good news, I only work four days during our honeymoon' that has happened to 3 of my bros, Three different outcomes; one guy did a shift trade, simple. One guy called in sick, and the other guy quit. But, since they needed him, they just gave him his days off. Added stress around your wedding is fun, lowers the blood pressure.
And then we have the direct entries, now, not everyone was an f-ing retard. But oh so many. And up to 6 months ago, first year 1900 captain, $40k. Guess what kind of applicants you'll be looking at? Just right gems. Oh wow, just right dangerous. Throw them with a new low timer, and you've got the blind leading the deaf.
As a gravity defying low timer, I got to sit to the right of an individual who spent 3000 hours in the friggin circuit. He sir, is CMA captain material, we are talking grade a alberta beef. Every question imaginable from the ground up, BOOM! He has the answer. A walking, talking, none drinking, vegan virgin. Oh s**t fellas, we are talking maverick material. But! When you get this fella outside 5 miles from a control zone, we are looking at a new man. He's grabbing the yolk like an orangutan strangling a kitten. He's looking to cancel ifr when its 400 ovc at 2 miles going into some s**t hole with an ndb alpha. Easy there monkey man! But, you get what you pay for. The stories I have would literally fill a novel. Some funny, some romantic, all true. A lot unbelievable. But! The job gets done, and no one cares how. The phone call will always be 'why didn't you go' never, 'why did you go?' This place is licensed as a 704 705 operation. Yet, run worse than buffalo joe's place. The company has built its operation on the backs of their employees. It’s over 25 years old now. And only now are they are claiming big changes? Desperate times call for desperate measures.
What I’m trying to say, CMA has always claimed they are changing, they are adapting. I was there for 8 years, saw nothing for the better change. It’s a race for the bottom, CMA has bagged that one. They want retention, good luck. Get new management. Smithers is the puppeteer, you are the puppet, cowboy. Good luck. Don't stand up too straight, you show management you have a back bone, you are f-d. I watched numerous fellas go for interviews at ac, wj and how would an airline that pride themselves on being a feeder to the big leagues work with you here? Give you a hand? Ohhhh wait, no sir. Captain Kangaroo doesn't like to hire people. Too expensive! You need a day off, you call in sick! You need a reference? F*******k that!! You need to use changes+ or some other manager, but wait! They need someone in charge. What are you going to do? That fella has sewered more folks then not, and think about, it would only make sense, the part owner has a choice to avoid another training bill. Saving himself a few dollars, giving himself a pat on the back, avoiding the painful NASA like interview process. This place is run by two child-like folks, the pilots have no real chief pilot, and terrible moral. The answer would be to unionize, or get new management. I was there for too long, and watched it make myself and many other people worse off, mentally and ethically. It is a perfect scenario for disaster. The great thing about CMA was the time, 100hour months more often than not, in and out in 3 -4 years, perfect for the folks headed to ac and wj. Now, the flying has dried up, AC flying has been gone for almost 2 years, charters are sparse and I sure hope encore takes a huge chunk of their flying. I do have a grudge with CMA, they do not treat their employees with respect. If change is in the air, it’s been a long time coming. Have super low expectations going in there, and you'll still be disappointed. As for the other two times seniority matters, they don't.
xsbank wrote:As any successful company knows, it takes years of hard work to build up a good reputation and that can be lost in an instance, then it takes years of hard work to get it back. Its also way easier to keep a happy customer than to get a new one or get one you pissed off, back.
Blowing smoke is pointless, pilots are the most cynical bunch on the planet. Pay, working conditions, respect are all what its about. Provide that and you get a loyal, happy workforce. Screw 'em and who will operate your aircraft?
Change+, your copy sounds like the guys who write those great stock tips, guaranteed to make you rich, just sign here and we'll tell you the name of the stock.
It really is a pity that the company has maintained such a reputation for so long. xsbank, I strongly agree with you. I also believe it takes a long time to get a good reputation up only to lose it at a standstill. And every effort to reverse the path of a reputation will be speculated as invalid or a lie until the positive effect is made.kilpicki wrote:minus change I don't normally read long rambles but yours held me spellbound. plus change I think its time to cut and run as I dont think many people believe a word your saying.
Low timers are the ones who should be treated as valued employees because they are your future.As for low timers being dime and a dozen, it's the truth.
Thanks Cat for your input.Is it motivating to hear that? No. Should the mentality change? Yes. Will it change? Yes.
wow.... just wow.+cHange wrote: As for low timers being dime and a dozen, it's the truth.
Great post, and right on the money. CMA treats its employees with zero respect. The bad reputation they have is well deserved.cHange- wrote:truths
I'm lovin' the political answers. If he's truly not in Management or HR, he should be...Jack In The Box wrote:I chuckle at how many first time posters there are in this thread (including the OP).
Good, because no one else will.I get a boner when people look at me in uniform.
|
|
Use AvCanada's information at your own risk!
We reserve the right to remove any messages that we deem unacceptable.
When you post a message, your IP is logged and may be provided to concerned parties where unethical or illegal
behavior is apparent.
All rights reserved.
