Flair Closes Call Center Because it's "Too Busy"

[Old fella]

While Flair has been around since 2005 - they have had multiple owners and multiple operating forms. They have not been a sched airline for all that time.

Fair enough. However they had 17 years exposure of some form in the industry so perhaps that may be insight in a way, who knows. I have no affiliation with any airline past or present, however being a glass half full dude just like to see the industry get back on even keel - as no doubt you feel same. Besides a bit of competition against the AC, WJ et al lot is good for us all.

By your leave

Cheers

[acpaleaks]

Flair is also paying a pretty reasonable wage for the first few years FO (compared to other Canadian 705 airlines) and just hired what, 80-100 pilots?

80 pilots at $75k a year (not even including benefit costs) is like $500,000 a month just in payroll and is likely higher as half of the pilots are making CA wage.

So again, you can only pad a company with investment dollars for so long before the trash starts to stink.

[boeingboy]

While Flair has been around since 2005 - they have had multiple owners and multiple operating forms. They have not been a sched airline for all that time.

Fair enough. However they had 7 years exposure of some form in the industry so perhaps that may be insight in a way, who knows. I have no affiliation with any airline past or present, however being a glass half full dude just like to see the industry get back on even keel - as no doubt you feel same. Besides a bit of competition against the AC, WJ et al lot is good for us all.

By your leave

Cheers

Absolutely. I agree 100%

[acpaleaks]

While Flair has been around since 2005 - they have had multiple owners and multiple operating forms. They have not been a sched airline for all that time.

Fair enough. However they had 7 years exposure of some form in the industry so perhaps that may be insight in a way, who knows. I have no affiliation with any airline past or present, however being a glass half full dude just like to see the industry get back on even keel - as no doubt you feel same. Besides a bit of competition against the AC, WJ et al lot is good for us all.

By your leave

Cheers

Agreed. Flair pays more than AC for years 1-3 IIRC. So maybe a bit of upward pressure on the dismal flat pay for our year 1-4 pilots would be nice.

[notwhoyouthinkIam]

Agreed. Flair pays more than AC for years 1-3 IIRC. So maybe a bit of upward pressure on the dismal flat pay for our year 1-4 pilots would be nice.

Air Canada pays shit because people want to work for AC based on their "prestige."

Flair knows that to attract talent, they need to pay.

[co-joe]

... - but they all have the same formula. ULCC's will not work.... ...

People here (mostly Westjet fans) keep saying this. I would suggest that the ULCC model has never been tried in Canada. Not an Airline In an Airline (Swoop/ Rouge), not a cheep fee structure by a new name every 6 months (AC's list could fill this page), an actual ULCC whos sole product is low fares based on low costs.

The global supposed ULCCs that have failed actually have far more in common with Westjet's mistakes as of late. Plus seats (that are mostly empty), wide bodies with 3 seating costs (most of the expensive ones which seem to always be empty), and the fickle highly competitive, mostly seasonal vacation markets which come and go. True ULCC has never been tried in Canada before today.

[Blue42]

... - but they all have the same formula. ULCC's will not work.... ...

People here (mostly Westjet fans) keep saying this. I would suggest that the ULCC model has never been tried in Canada. Not an Airline In an Airline (Swoop/ Rouge), not a cheep fee structure by a new name every 6 months (AC's list could fill this page), an actual ULCC whos sole product is low fares based on low costs.

The global supposed ULCCs that have failed actually have far more in common with Westjet's mistakes as of late. Plus seats (that are mostly empty), wide bodies with 3 seating costs (most of the expensive ones which seem to always be empty), and the fickle highly competitive, mostly seasonal vacation markets which come and go. True ULCC has never been tried in Canada before today.

Greyhound, Vistajet, Jetsgo……

[co-joe]

... - but they all have the same formula. ULCC's will not work.... ...

People here (mostly Westjet fans) keep saying this. I would suggest that the ULCC model has never been tried in Canada. Not an Airline In an Airline (Swoop/ Rouge), not a cheep fee structure by a new name every 6 months (AC's list could fill this page), an actual ULCC whos sole product is low fares based on low costs.

The global supposed ULCCs that have failed actually have far more in common with Westjet's mistakes as of late. Plus seats (that are mostly empty), wide bodies with 3 seating costs (most of the expensive ones which seem to always be empty), and the fickle highly competitive, mostly seasonal vacation markets which come and go. True ULCC has never been tried in Canada before today.

Greyhound, Vistajet, Jetsgo……

Greyhound flew the least fuel efficient most maintenance expensive aircraft in the country with KFC pilot's CBA, and maintenance costs, never heard of vistajet, and jetsgo flew 2 different types each without the range to serve a country this size in a 2 seat class configuration. There's far more to the successful ULCC business model than selling tickets for cheap.

[Fanblade]

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... max-leases

Anyone know what's up with this

[notwhoyouthinkIam]

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... max-leases

Anyone know what's up with this

See this post:

"The airline currently owes 777 Partners $140 million, most of which is at an 18% interest rate."


https://biv-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/ ... nsion-plan

Lawsuit of the week: Shareholder takes aim at airline's expansion plan
FLAIR SHAREHOLDER CLAIMS COMPANY’S PLANS RAMMED THROUGH WITHOUT APPROVAL, POTENTIALLY PUTTING OPERATING LICENCE AT RISK
July 9, 2021, 12:05pm

A shareholder in Flair Airlines Ltd. is taking the low-cost carrier to court, claiming it’s wrongfully withholding key information about a significant expansion of the company’s fleet of aircraft announced in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic.


Prescott Strategic Investments LP by its general partner Prescott Strategic Investments Ltd. filed a petition in BC Supreme Court on June 18, naming Flair and Florida-based 777 Partners LLC, a “significant creditor” of the aviation firm, as respondents. Prescott, run by Canadian aviation industry veterans Jim Scott and Jerry Presley, claims in the court filing that the dispute was spurred by Flair’s management deciding to “aggressively expand its operations during a global pandemic” by signing leases on 13 new Boeing 737-8 airplanes with a subsidiary controlled by 777 Partners, also a Flair shareholder.

According to the petition, Flair’s fleet of three Boeing 737s was mostly grounded from September 2020 to April 2021, with the airline using only one for its Vancouver-Edmonton-Toronto route and its Vancouver-Calgary-Toronto route during that time. Prescott owns just under 68% of the airline’s voting shares, and had taken over the company’s management in 2018.

“Shortly after taking over management of Flair, Prescott’s partners became aware that Flair required an immediate infusion of funds in order to pay down a line of credit,” the petition states, a situation which saw 777 Partners sign on as an investor after being approached by Flair. The airline currently owes 777 Partners $140 million, most of which is at an 18% interest rate.


Prescott claims that the COVID-19 outbreak saw Canadian air travel drop by around 90% of pre-pandemic passenger numbers, causing other airlines such as WestJet (TSX:WJA) and Air Canada (TSX:AC) to scale back or halt expansion plans including cancelling orders for their new Boeing (NYSE:BA) 737-8s.

But Flair went the opposite way, announcing in January 2021 that it was leasing more than a dozen new planes for new routes at five Canadian airports, an announcement that “caused serious concerns for Prescott.” Flair hadn’t sought shareholder approval as required for the leases and expansion plans, Prescott claims.

“Because Flair had already begun selling tickets connected to the expanded services, Flair’s position was entrenched and any after-the-fact vote by shareholders would be futile,” the petition states.

Moreover, the company didn’t get approval for the leases from the Canadian Transportation Agency, raising “significant concern” about whether the leases would put the company under control of 777 Partners, which could lead to a finding that it wasn’t “controlled in fact” by Canadians as required by the Canada Transportation Act. Such a finding could strip the aviation firm of its licence to operate in Canada, Prescott claims. Meanwhile, directors of 777 Partners have allegedly threatened to call in Flair’s debt and put it into receivership if it doesn’t proceed with the leases and expansion plans, which Prescott claims are not in Flair’s best interest.

The petition seeks declarations that Flair’s affairs are “being conducted in a manner that is oppressive” to Prescott, and an order for Flair and 777 Partners to buy Prescott’s shares for $0.85 per share.

The petition’s factual basis has not been tested in court, and Flair and 777 Partners had not filed responses by press time.


Copyright © Business in Vancouver. All rights reserved.

But to put it simply: money and control.

[flyinhigh]

Greyhound, Vistajet, Jetsgo……

Greyhound was a joke, Vistajet is a corporate business jet company (not ULCC), and Jetsgo was run by Michel Leblanc (don't need to add anything else), I mean really who the hell is going to make money on $5 seat tickets running NON-RVSM MD80s?

[Blue42]

Greyhound, Vistajet, Jetsgo……

Greyhound was a joke, Vistajet is a corporate business jet company (not ULCC), and Jetsgo was run by Michel Leblanc (don't need to add anything else), I mean really who the hell is going to make money on $5 seat tickets running NON-RVSM MD80s?

Vistajet operated 1 or 2 B732s for a short time out to YYC. Didn’t last long

[boeingboy]

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[rooster]

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There he is again trolling the Flair forums LOL! Proved my point