Flair Hiring B737 FO's

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a380super
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by a380super »

So back to the base assignement...i understand that a new hire who applies to flair doesnt really known where he/ she is gonnna be based? ( as it depends on availibility and seniority..).
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imjustlurking
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by imjustlurking »

a380super wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 5:00 pm So back to the base assignement...i understand that a new hire who applies to flair doesnt really known where he/ she is gonnna be based? ( as it depends on availibility and seniority..).
Welcome to airline life.
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flying4dollars
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by flying4dollars »

a380super wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 5:00 pm So back to the base assignement...i understand that a new hire who applies to flair doesnt really known where he/ she is gonnna be based? ( as it depends on availibility and seniority..).
Correct. It's based on positions open/opening at a given base. I believe the next set of aircraft to be delivered will be between Toronto, Vancouver and Edmonton. The bids go internally first and once those positions have been filled, whatever is open will be awarded to new hires based on their seniority.
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by Old fella »

Good news for those look to get back in aviation.Globe and Mail Business section had a very good article today on Flair expansion(Canada and US), article behind a paywall so can’t link it. Theme from reading is Flair has a handle on where they want to go- excerpts:

“……That’s why Flair’s expansion move is so interesting, Erickson added, in that it takes advantage of a period in time when both Air Canada and WestJet are struggling to rebuild in the wake of a global pandemic that decimated their revenues and forced both airlines to lay off large portions of their work force.

“The timing of this tells me these guys (Flair) are shrewd operators,” he said. “There’s an opportunity here, as both Air Canada and WestJet are struggling to get up and going again.”

Flair has also done a good job of “stepping around” the major airlines, Erickson said, by flying into secondary airports. For example, Flair flies to Hollywood-Burbank, Calif., instead of Los Angeles International Airport, and Phoenix-Mesa instead of the much larger Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport.

“Everything I see from them tells me someone is really thinking. There’s definitely a plan here,” Erickson said. “There is a possibility this could turn into a pretty significant airline.”
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palebird
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by palebird »

Nothing against Flair. But sidestepping major airports by startups or ULCC's is not new or innovative. Has been done for many years. Think Abbotsford, Mirabel, Hamilton, Ottawa, etc. Not to mention the USA. Same old same old.
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imjustlurking
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by imjustlurking »

palebird wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:28 pm Nothing against Flair. But sidestepping major airports by startups or ULCC's is not new or innovative. Has been done for many years. Think Abbotsford, Mirabel, Hamilton, Ottawa, etc. Not to mention the USA. Same old same old.
They've been squeezed out of the major airports, so they are attempting a Ryanair style route network.
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by GRK2 »

imjustlurking wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:55 pm
palebird wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:28 pm Nothing against Flair. But sidestepping major airports by startups or ULCC's is not new or innovative. Has been done for many years. Think Abbotsford, Mirabel, Hamilton, Ottawa, etc. Not to mention the USA. Same old same old.
They've been squeezed out of the major airports, so they are attempting a Ryanair style route network.
Squeezed out how? I see CYVR CYEG CYYC CYYZ CYUL...are those not major airports? Oh and KLAS if you're looking south of the border. Isn't Ft. Lauderdale on the route plans, Denver? Looks pretty major to me. Standard ULCC with a mix. The smaller airfields in the USA are easy to get in and out of, the traffic levels at these places make it economical and quick to turn a MAX. A Ryan Air style network is the proverbial ULCC model, and it's the same as Easyjet and Wizzair. No squeezing, just ULCC business. Stop hoping for failure would ya? It's about time us Canadians had better choices.
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imjustlurking
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by imjustlurking »

GRK2 wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 5:22 pm
imjustlurking wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:55 pm
palebird wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:28 pm Nothing against Flair. But sidestepping major airports by startups or ULCC's is not new or innovative. Has been done for many years. Think Abbotsford, Mirabel, Hamilton, Ottawa, etc. Not to mention the USA. Same old same old.
They've been squeezed out of the major airports, so they are attempting a Ryanair style route network.
Squeezed out how? I see CYVR CYEG CYYC CYYZ CYUL...are those not major airports? Oh and KLAS if you're looking south of the border. Isn't Ft. Lauderdale on the route plans, Denver? Looks pretty major to me. Standard ULCC with a mix. The smaller airfields in the USA are easy to get in and out of, the traffic levels at these places make it economical and quick to turn a MAX. A Ryan Air style network is the proverbial ULCC model, and it's the same as Easyjet and Wizzair. No squeezing, just ULCC business. Stop hoping for failure would ya? It's about time us Canadians had better choices.
Enjoy your choices.
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SMD
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by SMD »

#yourjustjurking
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imjustlurking
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by imjustlurking »

SMD wrote: Tue Oct 19, 2021 6:20 pm #yourjustjurking
I realized that I had no reason to argue with you. I hope that you get what you want.
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boeingboy
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by boeingboy »

A Ryan Air style network is the proverbial ULCC model, and it's the same as Easyjet and Wizzair. No squeezing, just ULCC business.
This is nothing like Ryanair or Easyjet. True ULCC business does not work here...
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GRK2
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by GRK2 »

boeingboy wrote: Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:31 pm
A Ryan Air style network is the proverbial ULCC model, and it's the same as Easyjet and Wizzair. No squeezing, just ULCC business.
This is nothing like Ryanair or Easyjet. True ULCC business does not work here...
If you're referring to the "LCC in a Company" like Swoop? You might be right. No one in Canada has actually tried a true stand alone ULCC with the right equipment, basings and business plan. The Calgary Crowd was headed in the right direction so many years ago but had a change of plans along the way. All those others that were part of Canadian or Air Canada or the plethora of failed "CHARTER" companies fell by the wayside because of costs or 911 or huge holes in bank accounts... (LeBlanc or Lecky et al comes to mind here.)

So like I asked above, what's the problem with waiting to see if it works? Is it personal or is it causing you to face some sort of personal loss?

Tranquillo...
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by co-joe »

aerosexual wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 10:02 am It's nice to see management engaged in a positive way on this forum.

How are the contract negotiations coming along? I hope captain pay in the new contract will reflect the experience levels that Flair hopes to attain and continue to attract.
Currently running with interim MEC, next step is to elect permanent members.
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by co-joe »

RoAF-Mig21 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 2:06 pm Is there a maximum age limit for pilots (CAPT/FO) being hired?
I've met at least one new hire who was approaching forced retirement/ seat change at their old airline, 68th birthday is the CBA limit for the left seat right now.
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by Airbrake »

co-joe wrote: Sun Oct 31, 2021 2:10 pm
RoAF-Mig21 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 2:06 pm Is there a maximum age limit for pilots (CAPT/FO) being hired?
I've met at least one new hire who was approaching forced retirement/ seat change at their old airline, 68th birthday is the CBA limit for the left seat right now.
How is the company accommodating the >65 with their flights increasing into the US?
Are they currently building them domestic only pairings?
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tbaylx
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by tbaylx »

Airbrake wrote: Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:03 am
co-joe wrote: Sun Oct 31, 2021 2:10 pm
RoAF-Mig21 wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 2:06 pm Is there a maximum age limit for pilots (CAPT/FO) being hired?
I've met at least one new hire who was approaching forced retirement/ seat change at their old airline, 68th birthday is the CBA limit for the left seat right now.
How is the company accommodating the >65 with their flights increasing into the US?
Are they currently building them domestic only pairings?
Yes, domestic only pairings for 65+
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by ndarcy »

tbaylx wrote: Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:44 am
bdriver90 wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:43 am
Canuck1988 wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:32 am

I’ve got to say, it really is nice to have some transparent information on current experience of flight crews, bases, upgrade times, and an in depth look at what kind of experience you are looking for and what kind of experience we would be competing with in the hiring process. Also hiring timelines.

Thanks for answering questions, appreciate it.
What are the chances for a Canadian citizen with an ATPL, 2500 hrs half jet and half heavy turboprop? I know the experience has priority but what is the point of taking a 10,000 Capt on the right seat, some more experienced than the captains. Sometimes not a good idea to have two captains in the flight deck. Plus some of us younger guys are planning to grow with the company!
It’s unlikely we’ll be considering 2500 hours until mid to late next year. The point in hiring 10000+ hour former jet captains as FOs is that they can upgrade on day 1 or whenever we need them. We quadrupled in size this year and are going to double again next year. We need a solid core of experience in the left seat to support that growth and we’re lucky enough to have it available right now.

No one is sitting as an FO longer than 3-8 months right now. As that upgrade time begins to extend then we begin hiring lower time pilots that we can develop and train internally over a period of a few years so they’ll be excellent, safe captains when ready.

We are beginning to mix in some lower experienced pilots (5000tt and fo only jet time) with our hiring in order to stagger out the experience levels and that will continue to drop in 2022-23
In the 2500 hour scenario above, if that was all military time (Canadian), would it help the applicant's competitiveness?
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by indieadventurer »

ndarcy wrote: Tue Nov 02, 2021 10:13 pm In the 2500 hour scenario above, if that was all military time (Canadian), would it help the applicant's competitiveness?
Yes, military time is looked at differently. Not just at Flair.
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tbaylx
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by tbaylx »

ndarcy wrote: Tue Nov 02, 2021 10:13 pm
tbaylx wrote: Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:44 am
bdriver90 wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:43 am

What are the chances for a Canadian citizen with an ATPL, 2500 hrs half jet and half heavy turboprop? I know the experience has priority but what is the point of taking a 10,000 Capt on the right seat, some more experienced than the captains. Sometimes not a good idea to have two captains in the flight deck. Plus some of us younger guys are planning to grow with the company!
It’s unlikely we’ll be considering 2500 hours until mid to late next year. The point in hiring 10000+ hour former jet captains as FOs is that they can upgrade on day 1 or whenever we need them. We quadrupled in size this year and are going to double again next year. We need a solid core of experience in the left seat to support that growth and we’re lucky enough to have it available right now.

No one is sitting as an FO longer than 3-8 months right now. As that upgrade time begins to extend then we begin hiring lower time pilots that we can develop and train internally over a period of a few years so they’ll be excellent, safe captains when ready.

We are beginning to mix in some lower experienced pilots (5000tt and fo only jet time) with our hiring in order to stagger out the experience levels and that will continue to drop in 2022-23
In the 2500 hour scenario above, if that was all military time (Canadian), would it help the applicant's competitiveness?
Yes, we've hired a few military pilots recently that had more than the minimum 2500 hours but less than their civilian colleagues. It's taken into consideration and we hire based on other skills other than just total flight time
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Re: Flair Hiring B737 FO's

Post by CaptainKirk »

Now that Flair is estimated to hire more than 100 pilots in the next 12 months.

Here is the salary breakdown.

[YouTube] https://youtu.be/5fQjrIxoNjE[/YouTube]
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