Pitot Static Testing Overdue

[OntheNumbers]

Just noticed that my 2-year pitot static was due on Oct 26th, so it's no longer valid. Simple question - does the plane need to be grounded now until I get it done or is there some leeway?

I'm pretty sure I know the answer but we were hoping to go for a remembrance day flight tomorrow, it's a long weekend and my AME is off till Tuesday.

For some reason the pitot test was not sync'd up with the annual. It will be now, as I've scheduled the inspection for the 18th and will get the static test done at the same time.

I guess I'll be grounded until then.

[Edit] - Just found this:

Standard 625 APPENDIX C - Out of Phase Tasks and Equipment Maintenance Requirements
13. Altimetry Devices
(amended 2007/12/30; previous version)

(a) Altimeters and other Altimetry devices installed in aircraft operating under Instrument Flight Rules, or under visual flight rules in Class B and C Airspace or Class C and D Airspace that is designated as "Transponder Airspace" shall be calibrated at intervals not exceeding 24 months, to the parameters and tolerances outlined in Appendix B of Standard 571, or to equivalent standards acceptable to the Minister.

(amended 2007/12/30; previous version)
(b) For the purpose of this section, the term "altimetry devices" includes any air data computer, or other barometric device, providing a flight crew station, or an auto pilot, or automatic pressure altitude reporting system, or altitude alerting system with altitude data derived from static pressure.


Cheers

OTN

[Colonel Sanders]

See CAR 625 App C para (13) and (14).

[brownbear]

I condone nothing and safety is paramount.

But let's say you flew the plane. (its private registered?) do you think you would be checked?

You Probably you would not be. Honesty goes a long way in this industry. Your plane doesn't magically change on static and pitot leakage.

So whether you fly or not its morals...I doubt there is ramifications on legalities when you are not being ramped.. Unless you crash..

If there is a rule in place it is because of previous crashes. Play safe and do the right thing .

[Colonel Sanders]

"the rule" says (cut & pasted from above):

aircraft operating under Instrument Flight Rules, or under visual flight rules in Class B and C Airspace or Class C and D (transponder) Airspace

So if you operate VFR in class E or G airspace, OR in
C or D airspace which is NOT designated "transponder
airspace", you are still legal, according to that excerpt.

I don't understand why you would think your aircraft
was "grounded"?!

[Hornblower]

Probably because some officious AME told him so, or an overzealous TC inspector maybe. He could have a problem if he is positioned within a class C or a class D CZ that is specified as txponder airspace. Otherwise, to be legal, he would have to remove the txponder from the aircraft. and fly in non txponder airspace. At the end of the day, who is really watching ... the equipment is working who will know if he breaks a little rule. 99% of the time the equipment is tested as ok, and unless has had a problem, his equipment is extremely unlikely to have an issue; ATC will tell him soon enough he he does.

Go for it

[photofly]

CAR601.03:

601.03 Transponder airspace consists of

(a) all Class A, B and C airspace as specified in the Designated Airspace Handbook; and
(amended 2006/06/30; previous version)

(b) any Class D or E airspace specified as transponder airspace in the Designated Airspace Handbook.

Any class C control zone is transponder airspace by default. Only class D and E airspace needs to be additionally specified as such.

CAR625 Appendix C contains what looks like a typo when it says "or Class C and D Airspace that is designated as 'Transponder Airspace'", it would make more sense if it said "... Class D and E Airspace that is designated as ..."

Regardless, the DAH says:

3.1.5 TRANSPONDER AIRSPACE
3.1.5-1 Class A
All
3.1.5-2 Class B
All
3.1.5-3 Class C
All
3.1.5-4 Class D
.
.
.

That's for Edmondton FIR, but identically for all FIRs.

So every class C control zone is transponder airspace, both by being specified as such, and by default under CAR601.03.

Also (DAH M8) is all class E airspace above 10,000MSL within radar coverage. Plus various other bits of class E airspace around the country, and qulte a lot of class D control zones.

BUT

The way CAR625 Appendix C is written it appears to exclude the need for calibration of the altimetry equipment when in Class E transponder airspace (remember it says only C and D) - so by the strict word, you need a transponder in Class E transponder airspace but it doesn't have to be calibrated and nor does your altimeter.

[Colonel Sanders]

What a great question for the PPL written exam!

Useless, conflicting and incomprehensible. Perfect.

[photofly]

What a great question for the PPL written exam!

Useless, conflicting and incomprehensible. Perfect.

I do my best.

[Hornblower]

BUT

The way CAR625 Appendix C is written it appears to exclude the need for calibration of the altimetry equipment when in Class E transponder airspace (remember it says only C and D) - so by the strict word, you need a transponder in Class E transponder airspace but it doesn't have to be calibrated and nor does your altimeter.

You've misread it. The txponder has to be tested no matter where or how high you fly. The altimeter is subject to the Class C and D airspace requirements. So to answer the OP's question, he is legal to go if his aircraft is based outside a class C control zone, or outside (or underneath) a class D CZ or terminal area, and he actually removes the offending txponder from the aircraft. Class B airspace would not likely be an issue for him.

A I said before, no one is really watching him, and private owners are not really under TC's scrutiny (with the exception of the Colonel), so even if you are based in a control zone or fly in C or D txponder airspace I wouldn't worry about it ... just go flying and enjoy yourself. There is no safety risk related to such a minor violation.

[photofly]

BUT

The way CAR625 Appendix C is written it appears to exclude the need for calibration of the altimetry equipment when in Class E transponder airspace (remember it says only C and D) - so by the strict word, you need a transponder in Class E transponder airspace but it doesn't have to be calibrated and nor does your altimeter.

You've misread it. The txponder has to be tested no matter where or how high you fly.

Go on then, explain to me how you get that interpretation, out of this:

a) Altimeters and other Altimetry devices installed in aircraft operating under Instrument Flight Rules, or under visual flight rules in Class B and C Airspace or Class C and D Airspace that is designated as "Transponder Airspace" shall be calibrated at intervals not exceeding 24 months

EDIT: I see. Para.14 applies to transponders but not to altimeters, and para 14 doesn't say anything about transponder airspace.

[Hornblower]

Right on brother!

[Colonel Sanders]

I'm not sure how removing transponders from
VFR aircraft after 24 months makes them safer,
but oh well. I don't see the "big picture".

This wouldn't be an issue except for the ridiculous
prices in Canada. $2000 for a pitot/static check
around here. Given that the average private aircraft
flies 35 hours (pre-recession statistic - I think it's
much lower than that), TC is imposing a $2000/35x2
or $29/hr tax on VFR aircraft in Canada, with their
"everything is specialized maintenance" policy, and
then people give up on trying to maintain an AMO -
I know many that have disappeared around here
because they couldn't keep up with the paper.

My friends in the USA get their VFR transponder/encoder
checks for $50.

Notice any difference?

PS You think the homebuilders are doing the $2000
check every 2 years? And they're flying through the
same airspace.

[photofly]

I'm sure it's a lot less around here; some small hundred $$$. There's a man at YTZ with a very snazzy test set equipped with suckers to go over pitot and static ports and a 1090MHz antenna on a tripod. Takes about an hour of labour plus a charge for the gear.

Principle applies though.

My friends in the USA get their VFR transponder/encoder
checks for $50.

I am/was under the impression that every kind of maintenance except an annual inspection can be done by an A&P/IA as well as an AME - doesn't that apply to altimetry calibration too? In which case, it's something to do on a trip to the US.

[Colonel Sanders]

some small hundred $$$

I wish. TC has shut down all the avionics AMO's
around here. People either fly to Dorval or Kitchener.

By the time you count the gas for the round trip,
plus the airport fees, plus the NavCan fees, plus
the test, plus the taxes, it always seems to tally
up around $2,000.

[AOW]

I'm not sure how removing transponders from
VFR aircraft after 24 months makes them safer,
but oh well. I don't see the "big picture".

You can probably get away with pulling the breaker and placarding it INOP, but purists will have you pull it from the panel.

How hard would it be (for private VFR aircraft at least) to just ask atc what altitude they're showing, and confirm that it matches their altimeter. If it doesn't, turn off mode c and get it fixed!

[Old Dog Flying]

On my last bi-annual inspection I was told that the altimeter had to be pull out for calibration and my request to be there to advise the apprentice avionics tech was denied.

The tech somehow removed the altimeter and in the process scratched my windshield on both left and right sides, damaged the pitot static line drain, and left the windshield defrost scat hose hanging over the controls under the glareshield and the clamp for the scat was left on the controls..again out of sight out of mind!.

Needless to say I was a bit unhappy and refused to pay the $350.00 bill.

I won but still had to work my magic to take the scratches out of the windshield. This whole thing is a bloody rip-off.

Barney

[Hornblower]

I'm not sure how removing transponders from
VFR aircraft after 24 months makes them safer,
...
PS You think the homebuilders are doing the $2000
check every 2 years? And they're flying through the
same airspace.

Simply because the rule refers to "any transponder ... where installed" I agree that logically you should just be allowed to leave it off, but where TC is involved, logic does not always apply.

And actually homebuilders are required to follow the same rules, and would also be in violation if they did not comply with appendix C. Like private owners of certified aircraft they shouldn't be too worried about getting nabbed by TC though.

There are a bunch of other really asinine requirements for maintenance in appendix C that don't really apply in the modern age of high tech ... don't get me started on those ridiculous compass swings or ELT checks of ELTs that have their own built in self testing capabilities ... sheesh! A waste of money, and as in Old Dog's case actually detract from safety.

[twotter]

Barney,

Next time bring it up to my shop and we can do it for you...

Dale

[twotter]

Hornblower, what airport are you at??? My TC buddies want to know so they can get their quota... LOL...

[Old Dog Flying]

Hi Dale, it has been a while since last heard from you. Where do you wrench these days..still at YPK?

Barney