NIGHT TIME

[Illya Kuryakin]

I've preached this before. Just another of my misguided rants:
If you're between you PPL and CPL, you have to build time. DO IT AT NIGHT! You have to do a 300? mile cross country. DO IT AT NIGHT!! You have to build time. Make your 300 mile cross country 1500 plus miles! I took a 150 to the Bahamas from Toronto!
You will thank me later. We have two guys who can't get an ATPL because they do t have enough night time. DO IT IN THE DARK!
End of rant.
Illya

[C-GKNT]

At 1,500TT I had 101.2 hours night PIC...many of those would not have occurred "naturally" if it wasn't for the ATPL requirement.

Excellent advise, not a misguided rant.

Glenn

[swixtt]

In a single? In remote BC?

[lazyeight]

I've preached this before. Just another of my misguided rants:
If you're between you PPL and CPL, you have to build time. DO IT AT NIGHT! You have to do a 300? mile cross country. DO IT AT NIGHT!! You have to build time. Make your 300 mile cross country 1500 plus miles! I took a 150 to the Bahamas from Toronto!
You will thank me later. We have two guys who can't get an ATPL because they do t have enough night time. DO IT IN THE DARK!
End of rant.
Illya

I can't agree with you more. I made the mistake of doing very little night flying in school and really kicked myself when it came time to apply for my ATPL. Renting an aircraft when you've been getting paid to fly for a while really is a kick in the balls.

[lazyeight]

At 1,500TT I had 101.2 hours night PIC...many of those would not have occurred "naturally" if it wasn't for the ATPL requirement.

Excellent advise, not a misguided rant.

Glenn

You don't need 100 night PIC? It's 100 night of which 25 must be night XC PIC. 75 of it can be in the right seat.

[C-GKNT]

At 1,500TT I had 101.2 hours night PIC...many of those would not have occurred "naturally" if it wasn't for the ATPL requirement.

Excellent advise, not a misguided rant.

Glenn

You don't need 100 night PIC? It's 100 night of which 25 must be night XC PIC. 75 of it can be in the right seat.

True, but I have zero co-pilot time. Paid for all of my flying myself...if I had skipped the CPL flight test, I would have qualified for a private ATPL as you only need to have the training required for a CPL not the actual license

Glenn

[Adam Oke]

Good advice. I would also add to do as much instrument time as possible when ever you have an instructor with you.

[PilotDAR]

Yup! Back decades ago, as a newly minted PPL, I desired a checkout to fly the club's Cardinal RG at the time. This was their fastest aircraft, so I had to qualify on it! The request was apparently unheard of of less than 100 TT PPLs. So, I was told it would be a 5 hour checkout. Sure, what did I care, I was flying it in either case. So I flew 1.5 of circuits and training area, and my instructor approved. So, to fill the remaining 3.5 hours, I asked of my instructor, and he agreed, a night cross country under the hood. I logged the remaining checkout time, plus, night and hood time. The CFI expressed dis satisfaction at my innovation of multi purposing the time, but he agreed that I'd done it, so it was logged, and I was checked out.

Yes, get the night time, as much as you can. Fly an aircraft you're confident in. Avoid flight out of reference to the ground (lights) until you're really sharp on instruments. (Remember JFK Jr.)

That said, I did kinda cheat myself out of a better checkout in the Cardinal. When I do five hours of checkout, the last thing it will be is cross country, hood time or night, it'll be circuits, forced approaches and other emergencies. But that's what decades of flying does to your thinking!

[DanWEC]

For the purposes of a license, TC won't allow double dipping of night and instrument time, and also, dual night with an instructor doesn't count worth balls. Needs to be SIC or PIC exclusively, unfortunately.

[Illya Kuryakin]

In a single? In remote BC?

Expecting a little common sense to kick in here.
Illya

[trey kule]

For the purposes of a license, TC won't allow double dipping of night and instrument time, and also, dual night with an instructor doesn't count worth balls. Needs to be SIC or PIC exclusively, unfortunately.

True...but...and this is a big but.....l

If you do IFR training at night, you CAN log the non instrument portion as night towards your night rating...
For example. 1.5 hrs flight time (logged at night) can be credited at .3 night and 1.2 instrument towards a night rating.
The student deals with walkaround, weather, taxxing at night and a night take off and landing.,.better experience than just doing circuits.
And, the student saves a hour or two of dual compared to doing the IF in daylight on their rating costs.
Win-win for a student.
I can not say for certain, but I would think that the whole flight should be usable as night time towards the ATPL as it has been properly logged as night time.
This distinction between logging night time, and crediting it towards ratings seems to confuse some instructors .

Expecting a little common sense to kick in here.
Illya

C'mon, you know better than than to expect that.

[DanWEC]

Trey, you're right, you can log it towards your night rating, but that's generally not the issue. That .3 is dual night, not PIC or SIC, and therefore cannot be counted towards the night req's on your ATPL, with is usually the issue with people being short on.

[trey kule]

So dual night is not countable towards your ATPL? But right seat time is.....
I am not familiar with Canadian licensing requirements , but that seems a bit odd if correct.
Not to say odd when it comes to some regulations is unusual.
Btw. I am not doubting your interpretation.

[photofly]

100 hours night flight as PIC or co-pilot is required. "Dual" time is neither.

[DanWEC]

That's correct. It's a completely non-sensical requirement.
Dual time at least generally guarantees that you're flying, albeit under the supervision of an instructor, but experiencing first hand the illusions, etc associated with the flight. As a SIC, you're also under the supervision of the capt, but you could well be the PNF for all of your night time depending on how the legs work out. How does running checklists and talking on the radio at night prepare you for night flight better than flying dual? F'ing stupid if you ask me.