Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

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CpnCrunch
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by CpnCrunch »

rookiepilot wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:35 pm A good rule is no turns below 1000.
IFR departures are no turns below 400ft, and VFR circuits typically you don't turn until 500ft. 400-500ft seems reasonable if the pilot knows what the AI is for. If not, they probably shouldn't be flying at night.
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rookiepilot
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by rookiepilot »

CpnCrunch wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:41 pm
rookiepilot wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:35 pm A good rule is no turns below 1000.
IFR departures are no turns below 400ft, and VFR circuits typically you don't turn until 500ft. 400-500ft seems reasonable if the pilot knows what the AI is for. If not, they probably shouldn't be flying at night.
To me that would depend on experience, terrain around airport, conditions. I'd be cautious turning too early from an unfamiliar airport
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Broken Slinky
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by Broken Slinky »

rookiepilot wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:22 pmThis is true. Even not so far north. Night flying over parts of eastern Ontario on a hazy night, over water, in and around Algonquin, are effectively IMC. There have been fatal accidents from those who disrespected the difference, including a recent departure from Parry Sound.

Make sure someone teaches you black hole effect.
100% agree. There's lots of runways close to Toronto that will present black hole effect even during 100% clear nights. Goderich, Midland, Pelee Island, Wiarton and Tobermory can very absent of light depending on the take off direction.
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SuperchargedRS
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by SuperchargedRS »

Not being able to fly at night as a licensed pilot is just crazy to me, it would be nice if one of these days they just combined the night and VFR ontop into the basic PPL.
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geneticistx
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by geneticistx »

I want to bubble this thread back to the top...
I've read the CARs, and there is no specification that the "dual hours" have to be done with an instructor, just that the rating has to be signed off by an instructor or AP once they are confident the individual is capable/safe/etc. The solos have to be signed out, is my understanding, but, correct me, please, can the duals and the cross-country be done with someone else who is PIC with a Night Rating who would, by definition - by CARs, be PIC?
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AuxBatOn
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by AuxBatOn »

There sure is a rule saying it needs to be with a flight instructor. 425.21.

(4) A person who conducts flight training toward the issuance of a night rating shall have a flight instructor rating for the category of aircraft used for the training.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by geneticistx »

i stand very corrected.
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photofly
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by photofly »

425.21(4):
A person who conducts flight training toward the issuance of a night rating shall have a flight instructor rating for the category of aircraft used for the training.
lol - beat me to it.
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FishermanIvan
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by FishermanIvan »

Broken Slinky wrote: Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:04 pm
rookiepilot wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:22 pmThis is true. Even not so far north. Night flying over parts of eastern Ontario on a hazy night, over water, in and around Algonquin, are effectively IMC. There have been fatal accidents from those who disrespected the difference, including a recent departure from Parry Sound.

Make sure someone teaches you black hole effect.
100% agree. There's lots of runways close to Toronto that will present black hole effect even during 100% clear nights. Goderich, Midland, Pelee Island, Wiarton and Tobermory can very absent of light depending on the take off direction.
Agree as well. Strangely enough, I always found YTZ off runway 26 or 24 with a left turn out over the lake was freaky as well. All that nice bright city disappears under the nose and it is just BLACK. Your eyes go inside the airplane pretty quickly.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by FreelanceInstructor »

geneticistx wrote: Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:06 pm I want to bubble this thread back to the top...
I've read the CARs, and there is no specification that the "dual hours" have to be done with an instructor, just that the rating has to be signed off by an instructor or AP once they are confident the individual is capable/safe/etc. The solos have to be signed out, is my understanding, but, correct me, please, can the duals and the cross-country be done with someone else who is PIC with a Night Rating who would, by definition - by CARs, be PIC?
DIVISION XII - NIGHT RATING
421.42 Requirements
(1) Private Pilot Licence - Aeroplane
(a) Experience
An applicant for a night rating shall have acquired in aeroplanes a minimum of 20 hours of pilot flight time which shall include a minimum of:

(i) 10 hours of night flight time including a minimum of:
(A) 5 hours dual flight time, including 2 hours of cross-country flight time,
(B) 5 hours solo flight time, including 10 takeoffs, circuits and landings, and
(ii) 10 hours dual instrument time

400.01
dual instruction flight time means the flight time during which a person is receiving flight instruction from a person qualified in accordance with section 425.21 of the Personnel Licensing and Training Standards respecting Flight Training; (temps d’instruction de vol en double commande)

425.21(4)
(4) A person who conducts flight training toward the issuance of a night rating shall have a flight instructor rating for the category of aircraft used for the training
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geneticistx
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by geneticistx »

It is thus, also, assumed that the training has to be done in either an aircraft from an FTU or an aircraft in which the student is on the C of R.
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photofly
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by photofly »

That’s not correct.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by geneticistx »

photofly, can you elaborate on this please? If i purchase hobbs time on an aircraft, can i get my night rating in that plane?
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by photofly »

If the instructor is not connected to the aircraft. Since your instructor will be PIC, you should discuss this with the person hiring you the plane.
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geneticistx
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by geneticistx »

ah, right. thankfully, many smrter people here than i
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by AuxBatOn »

geneticistx wrote: Sun May 06, 2018 9:40 pm ah, right. thankfully, many smrter people here than i
Not smarter. Just people who can read.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by CpnCrunch »

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trey kule
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by trey kule »

Its always interesting how much risk people will accept. The night rating is great for learning how to land and take off in the dark. And around cities on a nice night.

But I really believe if you are going to start blasting off across the country at night you should hold an IF rating. Weather can be sneaky, and that beautiful starlit night can quickly become virtually IMC. Unlike the US airports can be far apart.
The IF rating is your insurance policy.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by photofly »

An autopilot is handy, too.
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Re: Night Rating - You Should Think About It!

Post by trey kule »

Single pilot IFR w/o an autopilot? Above my pay grade.
But yes, night VFR with an autopilot would be nice. And an icing course.

Just my opinion. Been there on many occassions where a night VMC flight became, for all intense purposes, IMC.
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