A Twist on Medical

[CBRRider]

Hey guys,

So I am wanting to get into this career and ofcourse I need my class 1 medical. Yes I know this is a case with karma coming back to bite you, but no one is perfect when they are young.

Now I am as healthy as a cheetah, with perfect vision, never in my life touched drugs or alcohol. That said, I had a horrible job in my past, and to just get away without resigning as per a suggestion on reddit, I would go to my family doctor and tell him I had 'debilitating migraines' just to get sick notes to get off of work for a couple of months.

Ofcourse there were no debilitating migraines, but ofcourse the problem now is the notes my family doctor made in his computer.

So I know one of the questions in the medical is about migraines. I know you have to tell the truth, and the truth is if I said no I don't have migraine problems that is the truth. I would not be lying to the Tc examiner, but would they ever see my medical records my family doctor makes?

[Jetking]

Yes, thats right! You don't have to lie but I will give you advise on a positive note that migranes are curable and its just a psychological problem. If you live healthy, active and stressfree life(with no addiction to alcohol, drung things) you should be fine in few months. If it is a major problem then consult your family doctor or specialist and tell them your intention about going to flight training, you will have a better idea.

Good luck n keep it fit!!

[GoinVertical]

Say "No" on the aviation medical.

If it ever comes back to bite you (which I really really really doubt it will, assuming your Aviation Medical Examiner isn't at the same practise as your GP) say that the migraines ended as soon as you left that job. Must have been caused by that job. Or admit you lied. But I doubt you'll ever hear anything.

[digits_]

You would be in trouble if you lie on your aviation medical. As far as I know there are no questions as "did you ever lie about an illness" or "did you ever fake an illness". So you say "no", you never had migraines, assuming that is the truth.

Did your family doctor ever found out you lied to him?

[CBRRider]

Thanks you guys.

My family doctor is not at the same practice as the aviation doctor. No my family doctor never found out I was lying to his face to get sick notes off of work. I lied saying I had migraines to get two months off one time, I lied saying my neck muscles locked up giving me stiff neck and would walk into the doctors office pretending I couldn't move my head from side to side giving me 4 months off another time, all nice suggestions from fellow redditiors. He would even prescribe me things such as muscle relaxants (which of course I never actually went and picked up or purchased).

You would be in trouble if you lie on your aviation medical. As far as I know there are no questions as "did you ever lie about an illness" or "did you ever fake an illness".

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by this.

[JAHinYYC]

Coincidentally I had this exact discussion with my Aviation Doctor during my last medical in November.

I had just started medication for blood pressure and was concerned about its impact on my ability to hold a Category One for my ATPL.

My Dr told me a story about an applicant who came in for his first medical and completed the standard screening questions regarding mental illness and taking prescription medicines to treat the same.

It seems that the applicant said, "No" when asked about history of mental illness and medication.

My Doctor didn't need very long to review the applicant's centralized computer health record (maintained by the province) to see the medication and treatment previously described. The medical was denied.

No, the Aviation Doctor was not part of the guys family practice. Its 2020 and all of your health info (including prescriptions written and never filled (believe me I asked) is likely to be stored in a central database

Moral of the story - be up front with the details...all the details. You may be able to work through the issues...

Not to sound like your dad, but you made a choice back in the day. Lying about what you said then isn't going to make it any better.

[GoinVertical]

I've never been to a CAME that's asked for my provincial health card. Your mileage may vary.

[photofly]

My Doctor didn't need very long to review the applicant's centralized computer health record (maintained by the province) to see the medication and treatment previously described. The medical was denied.

Ontario doesn't have a centralized health record. Alberta does, I think, is that where this story took place? Most provinces don't.

I've never been to a CAME that's asked for my provincial health card. Your mileage may vary.

Me neither. And it wouldn't help them very much, because every healthcare provider in Ontario maintains their own records, so the CAME would have to contact, with your express consent, your family doctor and everywhere else you've had treatment.

Now, the consent thing is interesting: by applying for a medical you give consent for TC to request copies of your records from your various healthcare providers, but, aside from your family doctor you don't have to tell TC who those healthcare providers are (until they explicitly ask.)

Even then, you don't provide consent for your CAME to get those records, so they would not be provided to him/her.

[photofly]

double post

[CBRRider]

[digits_]

Thanks you guys.

My family doctor is not at the same practice as the aviation doctor. No my family doctor never found out I was lying to his face to get sick notes off of work. I lied saying I had migraines to get two months off one time, I lied saying my neck muscles locked up giving me stiff neck and would walk into the doctors office pretending I couldn't move my head from side to side giving me 4 months off another time, all nice suggestions from fellow redditiors. He would even prescribe me things such as muscle relaxants (which of course I never actually went and picked up or purchased).

You would be in trouble if you lie on your aviation medical. As far as I know there are no questions as "did you ever lie about an illness" or "did you ever fake an illness".

Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by this.

Your aviation doctor will not ask "did you ever lie to your family doctor". He doesn't/shouldn't care, as long as you don't lie to him.


I did notice the wording might be problematic though. The question is "Has the applicant ever had or been treated for any of the following conditions?"
Guess you'd have to say yes, as you have been treated for migraines. Although it could get philosophical: if you never followed your treatment, have you ever really been treated? Hmmmm

[photofly]

Of course a more interesting questions is what kind of pilot someone who would lie to his doctor and employer to skive off work for months on end would make.

[digits_]

Of course a more interesting questions is what kind of pilot someone who would lie to his doctor and employer to skive off work for months on end would make.

But it was a suggestion on reddit

[CBRRider]

Of course a more interesting questions is what kind of pilot someone who would lie to his doctor and employer to skive off work for months on end would make.

Ahh I knew it would come to this. Thank you for everyone else prior who were understanding.

If you knew how horrible and morally corrupt my bosses were and the harassment I was subjected to, I have no doubt that I have the moral high ground here. At the end of the day, you have to take care of and protect yourself and right or wrong this is the methodology that I employed.

[photofly]

I have the moral high ground here. At the end of the day, you have to take care of and protect yourself and right or wrong this is the methodology that I employed.

Bravo. You’ll fit right in.

[200Above]

I lost my medical for 6 month due to migraine(s). Told my aviation doctor, he told me not to fly for the time being. I was at a respectable 705 company and I was removed from my flying with pay. Long story. Did MRI, CT Scan, saw a Neurologist- everything came back negative. Neurologist diagnosed me with Migraines with Aura. I was told I'd never fly again.

Aviation Dr convinced RAMO at TC to give me a restricted medical. So I eventually was given a restricted medical. Didn't bother me, I'm scared of flying by myself anyways. Went for my yearly medical a year later, and I was asked if I had any migraines - No (I found my trigger). When I went to put the sticker in my booklet, I realized I was given an Unrestricted Medical. I damn near had a migraine.

Since then, I was hired at WJ and also passed my Air Canada medical (and subsequent hiring process ) with no issues. Little extra paperwork.

Everyone knows I had migraines, including TC and my employers. I also have to answer "yes" to "Have you ever been declined a Medical Certificate" every time.

[photofly]

Here are some more inconvenient factoids for the OP to include in his or her calculus:

Section 6.5(2) of the Aeronautics Act compels you to tell your family doctor (every doctor who examines you, in fact) that you hold (for instance) a Student Pilot Permit. Section 6.5(1) compels that doctor to tell the minister, if he or she feels you have a condition that is likely to constitute a hazard to aviation safety. (Not sure if a deficit of moral probity counts as one of those, but let's stick to the story about migraines, shall we?)

So perhaps you'll want to look for a new family doctor. Of course, a new doctor is going to suggest they get a copy of your existing medical records from your old family doctor. I guess you can always refuse to give consent for your old doctor to give your new doctor your records:

"Hi, new doctor, I've just qualified as a pilot, no you can't see my old records, and no, I don't want to say why."

Here's the bit I don't understand: you had no difficulty lying to your doctor for your own benefit, because you hold the moral high ground over your turd-like former employer. But there isn't a pilot in Canada who doesn't believe they hold the moral high ground over the minister and his delegates, who are universally reviled for their incompetence, venality and general turd-like nature. So why wouldn't you be happy to lie to the Minister too? After all, you have to take care of and protect yourself!

[digits_]

Hmmmmm.... sounds like someone has completed their journey to the dark side... Don't you think you are being a little bit harsh here? He lied, but I have the impression he's trying to do the right thing with his aviation medical. That should not be discouraged.

[CBRRider]

Hmmmmm.... sounds like someone has completed their journey to the dark side... Don't you think you are being a little bit harsh here? He lied, but I have the impression he's trying to do the right thing with his aviation medical. That should not be discouraged.

Thank you.

You know, I have no problem saying to the medical examiner, no I have never had any migraines, but I would report to my family doctor numerous times that I did have severe migraines and neck muscle spasms in order to get away from a toxic workplace. You can do all the MRI you want because I am in perfect health.

I am just concerned if transport Canada will deny me because I come clean. If the doctor sends you to do an MRI or if any of you were referred to further testing, do you have to pay for that or is it covered by provincial health care?

[photofly]

the doctor sends you to do an MRI or if any of you were referred to further testing, do you have to pay for that or is it covered by provincial health care?

The doctor doesn't send you for an MRI. The doctor will deny you the medical, and send your file to TC. About three years later, someone from TC medical branch will request a report from a neurologist of your choosing. You will pay for the neurology consultation, the MRIs and the neurologists report.

About nine months after that, TC will ask for more reports.

And so it goes on.

Don't you think you are being a little bit harsh here? He lied, but I have the impression he's trying to do the right thing with his aviation medical. That should not be discouraged.

The right thing is to 'fess up to his doctor, and his employer, and pay back the money he took from his employer or provincial insurance while keeping his job when he should have lost it. Lying a second time by saying he was never treated for migraine is now just expediency and has nothing to do with "the right thing".

The only reason he's asking here, is because he wants to chart the way out of this mess with the least probability of getting caught. I have nothing against the poor chap, but let's not kid ourselves.

As Sir Walter Scott wrote:

"Oh, what a tangled web we weave
When first we practise to deceive!"