Special VFR question

[socsbrian]

Hello all, got a question about SVFR.
In the AIM, it says SVFR applies within a control zone.
When it says control zone, does it also include controlled airspace? Or just the vicinity of the airport?
E.g. I requested SVFR to depart from a class C controlled airport, while on route in a controlled airspace, the ceiling and vis drop, can I just stay clear of clouds, and maintain 1 mile vis because I got authorization to depart SVFR already?

Scenario 2: Coming back to a class C controlled airport for landing. Circuit altitude is 2000ASL, cloud base sitting at 1900ASL, vis is 2 mile, will I be able to request SVFR even I won't be able to maintain published circuit altitude?

Thanks

[gustind]

SVFR is only applicable to control zones and does not extend into other classes of controlled airspace. That includes Class C, D and E control zones in Canada.

Answer to scenario 1 is that you must maintain VFR as required by law. Scenario 2 is a yes.

[photofly]

SVFR applies only in a control zone. There's no legal way to fly VFR in less than three miles visibility in controlled airspace other than in a control zone.

I requested SVFR to depart from a class C controlled airport, while on route in a controlled airspace, the ceiling and vis drop, can I just stay clear of clouds, and maintain 1 mile vis because I got authorization to depart SVFR already?

You'd have exit the control zone directly into uncontrolled (class G) airspace after leaving the control zone. That might mean flying at a low altitude, depending on where you are.

Think of the purpose of SVFR as being to enable you to begin or end a flight, otherwise entirely in uncontrolled airspace, at an airport where a control zone exists and controlled airspace therefore extends to ground level, and when the weather doesn't meet VFR conditions for flight in that control zone.

Scenario 2: Coming back to a class C controlled airport for landing. Circuit altitude is 2000ASL, cloud base sitting at 1900ASL, vis is 2 mile, will I be able to request SVFR even I won't be able to maintain published circuit altitude?

Other than at a certified airport where a circuit altitude is specifically published in the CFS, there is no requirement to maintain any particular circuit altitude. The VFR requirement to remain 500 feet above the ground(*) is removed when you are granted permission to fly SVFR. You can therefore enter the control zone from uncontrolled airspace and fly your circuit at 50' agl with a cloud base of 100' agl under SVFR if you wish.

(*) The 500 agl rule doesn't apply when "taking off or landing". I don't know any jurisprudence on whether a downwind counts as "taking off or landing".

[angry inch]

There’s a decent SVFR article in this copy of the Aviation Safety Newsletter....

https://tc.canada.ca/sites/default/file ... 3_2012.pdf

[Aviatard]

The VFR requirement to remain 500 feet above the ground(*) is removed when you are granted permission to fly SVFR. You can therefore enter the control zone from uncontrolled airspace and fly your circuit at 50' agl with a cloud base of 100' agl under SVFR if you wish.

I don’t see where the SVFR rule removes that 500 AGL requirement.

602.117 (1) Despite paragraph 602.114(b), an aircraft may be operated in special VFR flight within a control zone if

(a) weather conditions preclude compliance with paragraph 602.114(b);

(b) flight visibility is not less than

(i) one mile, where the aircraft is not a helicopter, or

(ii) one-half mile, where the aircraft is a helicopter;

(c) the aircraft is operated clear of cloud and with visual reference to the surface at all times; and

(d) authorization to do so has been requested and obtained from the appropriate air traffic control unit.

What am I missing?

[photofly]

That's based on my interpretation of TC AIM RAC Table 2.3 Special VFR Weather Minima, which omits the column for "DIstance AGL" that appears in Table 2.2 (VFR Weather Minima), implying that there is no "distance AGL" weather minimum under Special VFR, and the text of 2.7.3 which reads

Where authorization is obtained from the appropriate ATC unit, a pilot-in-command may operate an aircraft within a control zone, in IFR weather conditions without compliance with the IFR, where flight visibility and, when reported, ground visibility are not less than:
(a) 1 mile for aircraft other than helicopters; and (b) 1/2 mile for helicopters.

without mentioning an AGL limit.

I've never cross-referred those tables to the relevant CAR section before, but it sort-of doesn't match the interpretation of the CARs, and I would agree the CARs should take precedence. On the other hand you could say that since 602.117 begins "Despite paragraph 602.114(b)" that only (b) of 602.114 is exempted by SVFR, but clearly 602.114(d)(i) is, and therefore there is no way to argue that 602.114(d)(ii) is not also exempted.

To be honest I've always thought that the 500' agl limit in a control zone was a strange constraint to group with weather minima as it has nothing to do with the weather.