taildragger checkouts

[mike53]

Hi.I am looking to talk with a member here that goes by the moniker, l_reason,.In reading posts I ran across one where it is mentioned that he gives Taildragger checkouts.I live 30 miles from the London Airport and if it is possible I would like to talk with him about same.Thanks.
Mike

[Adam Oke]

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=6380

Shoot him a PM. Nothing but good things to say about him. Have fun!

[mike53]

Thanks.I have now done so.

[Hedley]

Enjoy your training with I_Reason - he's a good stick and instructor! You will learn a lot from him and his Luscombe

[warbirdpilot7]

It's good to see some people are still interested in using the rudder pedals, other then a place to put up your feet.

I did my tailwheel conversion in Brampton on their Supercub. Good aircraft, but it may be too much of a hike for you in the London area. The Luscombe is a good choice.

If you like old classic airplanes, this is the way to go. I did my checkout on the PA18, towed gliders in the PA25 Pawnee and then "graduated" to warbird flying. Have fun man!!

[mike53]

Unfortunately he has not responded to my e-mail so I will wait and see what happens.
It is too bad there are hardly any taildraggers for rent.There are more interesting taildraggers out there that I would love to fly over tri-gear planes.I understand insurance is the problem .It would be interesting to see the statistics on trigear landing mishaps compared to taildragger landing mishaps.
St thomas flight school fly's a fleet canuk for taildragger checkouts but will not rent it for solo and at $65/hr for the instructor I consider them too expensive but then I'm retired and live on a fairly fixed pension.I would gladly pay if I new I could then go out and rent the plane for solo enjoyment.
If I had the chance before I died to fly a warbird I would feel like I died and went to heaven
Count your blessings.

[Hedley]

he has not responded to my e-mail

Really? I've seen I_Reason logged in here lately - maybe send him a PM here instead. Possibly an old email address?

there are hardly any taildraggers for rent

There were a few, but their aircraft are being repaired

If I had the chance before I died to fly a warbird I would feel like I died and went to heaven

What's your definition of "warbird"? I'm lucky enough to regularly fly PT-19 "Cornell", PT-22 Ryan, PT-17 Stearman, AT-6 "Harvard", Beech 18 and L39, but I'm not sure how many of them strictly qualify as "warbird".

[cgzro]

Vintage Wings has a number of BCATP trainers that you can fly with an instructor. So if you want to go up in a Tiger Moth, Fleet Finch, Harvard or Cornell its more than possible for a few hundred bucks .. well the Harvard is a bit more than that. Likewise a flight in a P40 is possible for .. well I believe another zero is required.

So its certainly possible to get a flight in an old warbird and even take the stick but a few bucks are required to get there. Either that or come volunteer for a summer helping rebuild one and the rides are free.
We regularly fly these planes and the general goal is that the second seat should be occupied unless the flight is a test of some kind.

Peter

[Hedley]

Another option is Florida.

I have flown T-6's (think Harvard) in both St Augustine and Kissimmee. They made great sounds, but they are built like tanks, and as a result weigh a substantial amount.

I also flew the P-51D (actually it's a TF-51) there - cost around USD$1500 about 20 years ago. It makes great sounds, and it was fast, but it was actually somewhat disappointing in that I just didn't find it as much fun to fly as some other, more modern airplanes. Surprisingly easy to take off and land. The NLF wing was quite interesting in the stall.

If you have your heart set on warbirds, you shouldn't find it too difficult to get up in a Harvard/T-6/SNJ and a P-51D/TF-51.

[homebuiltpilot]

I am a self taught tail wheel pilot. I built a Sonex 7 plus yrs ago and even did the first flight. I exited the runway only once and that was at 2 hrs on the plane. It probably wasn't the smartest thing I've ever done. I enjoy the tail wheel . You have to concentrate a lot more but it is a blast.

[mike53]

I guess I would have to say any WWll fighter fits my definition of a war bird.My favorite ,the Corsair followed by the Spitfire and the P51.I see Vintage Wings has the P40 for hire for 2 grand for 20 minutes.Steep but once in a lifetime ,well worth the money I think.
With Remembrance day coming up shortly also time to pay respect to those that didn't do it for the fun of it, some paying the ultimate price . Something to think about when we think we need more stuff.

[ScudRunner]

I know him and just sent him a text to come on here and look for this thread.
should be in touch with you soon.
cheers
..

PS: to everyone about to start learing to fly, if you can learn on a taildragger every plane you fly after is a peice of cake.

[l_reason]

Mike53 check your mail.

Thanks ..

[Hedley]

to everyone about to start learing to fly, if you can learn on a taildragger every plane you fly after is a peice of cake

+100

I teach my own ab initio students on tailwheel. When I was teaching my son to fly, I forbid him to fly a nosewheel aircraft - but he could fly any tailwheel aircraft at the airport that he could get his hands on

I_reason took the kid up for a flight (in the right seat) of his Luscombe, and the kid didn't have any trouble landing it, I am told, and the Luscombe is an honest tailwheel aircraft.

Primacy. Teach it right the first time. That's what a tailwheel aircraft teaches you - that you cannot put your feet on the floor!

Someone that learns to fly on a nosewheel aircraft learns from hour zero that they don't have to use their feet, and that's a bad lesson to learn, and a difficult lesson to unlearn - see Primacy. Remember, under stress, people do not rise to the occasion, they sink to their lowest level of training, which is to not use the rudders.

If I had my way, everyone would do their first 10 hours (or so) and solo in a piper cub on a grass strip. Their stick & rudder skills, developed from hour zero, would last a lifetime.

http://i.imgur.com/p6IrI.jpg

[AirFrame]

With Remembrance day coming up shortly also time to pay respect to those that didn't do it for the fun of it, some paying the ultimate price . Something to think about when we think we need more stuff.

I suspect i'd be as disappointed with a ride in a P-51 as the earlier poster... I've been up in a Harvard twice, and while the aerobatics were fun, they weren't really any better than in any other aerobatic airplane i've been in.

If you want to pay respect to those who went before, a good way is to get some formation training. Flying formation is a great way to hone your precision flying skills, and offering to do a flypast over your local Cenotaph on Remembrance Day is rarely turned down. It looks awesome from the ground, and brings tears to the eyes of many vets.

[mike53]

AirFrame wrote:
I suspect i'd be as disappointed with a ride in a P-51 as the earlier poster...

I'm speechless
When I was at Oshkosh and 3 Mustangs did a low fly-by the sound of of those Merlins alone gave me goosebumps.To each his own.
Mike

[warbirdpilot7]

If you get bored of flying, then doing a tailwheel conversion is probably the best way to get back into it. I hope you do find a suitable club/owner and have fun. If you do it on the Supercub, get used to heel brakes. Not the best system. I also belive the Burlington club hasa PA18 for checkouts. If you do get this done, and want to rent the airplane, limit yourself to light winds(or winds almost down the runway) at first. X-winds and gusty conditions are something you need to work up to. I would have to think that the flying club will make a go/no-go decision for you anyway.

I regularly fly a PT26 Cornell and Chipmunk.....When I went in the P-51 and sat in a Spitfire, it is unreal as to how similar the sightlines are to my Chipmunk...It is called a "mini spitfire" for good reason. The Gipsy Major can have a mind of her own, when it comes to starting(especially when its cold outside). And the brakes, well thats its only downfall. You have a handle in the left side of the cockpit, that you pull aft for braking pressure and taxing/turning. With a non-steerable tailwheel, you use differential braking to turn. To turn left, pull the handle, and use left rudder, and so on.

Sometimes in gusty winds, you run out of braking authority to turn.

[Hedley]

disappointed with a ride in a P-51

At the risk of being burned at the stake for heresy ... keep in mind that the P-51 was designed in 90 days, 70 years ago, without any computers or wind tunnels. It can be pretty hard to live up to decades and decades of hype.

Don't get me wrong, the sound of the WWII warbirds is fantastic, and gosh are they fast, but they're awfully crude compared to what we fly today, and some of them just aren't a whole lot of fun to fly, and the maintenance, oh Lord the maintenance ....

It would be fascinating to do a comparison between:

1) P-51, Spitfire, Hurricane (on one hand), and

2) MX2, Zivko Edge, SU-26/29 (modern monoplanes)

I may be hated for saying this, but we've made a lot of progress in aviation in 70 years.

I also may be wrong, but I think the aircraft in group #2 might be a whole lot more fun to fly and capable of far more maneuvers (you don't see too many WWII warbirds being tumbled at airshows these days) and far easier to live with wrt maintenance and parts.

Group #1 are museum pieces, to be loved and cherished and fussed over and flown on nice days. High maintenance supermodels in their 70's.

I regularly fly a PT26 Cornell

I hope the wood in your center section is ok! I find the PT-19/26 does a wonderful wheel landing (possibly more heresy). Do you wheel or 3-pt your Cornell?

If you get bored of flying, then doing a tailwheel conversion is probably the best way to get back into it

Heh. I was doing some tailwheel training yesterday, and the student was doing very well with the crosswind - he dropped the left wing, a little right rudder to stay straight, which he maintained during the flare. He established the landing attitude and touched down beautifully on the left main and the tailwheel at the same time - sort of a 2-pt landing As he slowed down, aileron progressively all the way over into the wind, keeping the downwind main in the air as long as possible, and spoiling lift on the upwind wing with the up aileron, and creating maximum adverse yaw on the downwind wing with the down aileron, to oppose weathervaning during the rollout as we slowed down and the rudder lost effectiveness.

I did a quick demo for him - I side-slipped and touched down only on the upwind main. Full aileron over, a little forward stick and some power on. Tailwheel never touched, and we drove down the runway only on the upwind main. Great fun!

[mike53]

MX2 Max speed 230kt
top speed level flight 210kt
Engine 250-380 hp

P51D Max speed 437kt
Cruise 325 kt
climb to 20000ft 7.3 min
Engine 1490 hp

Modern aircraft are great but just like having to choose between a 2010 Shelby Cobra and a 1966 Shelby Cobra I would choose the 66 every time just as I would choose any plane from group 1 every time.Maybe its an age thing I'm 57 .As can be gathered from the above it's not a fair comparison.1490hp trumps 380hp.Now if we grew the MX2 to the size of the P51 and slapped 1200hp on the front I've no doubt the P51 would suffer by comparison.

[Hedley]

It would be interesting to take a group of pilots and have them fly both, and ask them which they enjoyed flying more. I know what my answer would be

Another interesting (and objective) test would be to take the P-51D through a Red Bull Air Race track. Could it do it faster than the MX2?

Don't get me wrong, the P-51/Spitfire/Hurricane are legendary airplanes. But they're awfully old - they were NEVER intended to be flying after all these decades, ask anyone who maintains one - and pretty crude, and not as much fun to fly as some other, more modern aircraft. They weren't designed to be enjoyable to fly - rather, to carry out a particular, ancient mission. An example would be the incredible stick force for the ailerons of the P-51D.

If you don't believe me, fly (and maintain) both and make up your own mind!

A couple years back, I was at OSH, and all the P-51's were flying in this big circle. Kinda boring. The only guy who flew aerobatics in a P-51 (or any warbird) was my buddy Freddy Cabanas, who put on a great show - Bob Hoover complimented him on his vertical roll afterwards - but oddly enough, the rest of the P-51 drivers (who don't do aerobatics) greatly resented him. I'm not sure I understand what's going on there.