The Return to Normal?

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altiplano
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by altiplano »

There may be a link to the whole situation, but if it's the virus itself, it's not established yet. And how do you reconcile that not all the kids had the virus or antibody?

You like to work on facts, don't you?
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mbav8r
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by mbav8r »

“Coronavirus may be more dangerous in children than first realised. Increasing support is linking the notorious virus with an influx of youngsters sent to intensive care.

Experts looked into eight cases of children who had been admitted to intensive care at Evelina London Children's Hospital in mid-April”
“Symptoms associated with Kawasaki disease, a rare blood vessel disorder, have appeared to cluster in COVID-19 hot spots, including New York City and the United Kingdom, and now, some Montreal doctors are seeing slightly more cases, too.“
“Four kids tested positive for the novel coronavirus, and 11 patients tested negative. Out of the negative patients, six children’s blood work showed they had antibodies to the virus, suggesting they may have previously had exposure to the virus“
“Mount Sinai Hospital has confirmed reports of new and unusual COVID-19 illness in pediatric patients“

So, with that, the FACT we don’t know yet, how many children are you willing to sacrifice, would you let your children be the guinea pig?
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mbav8r
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by mbav8r »

“The new coronavirus appears to be causing sudden strokes in adults in their 30s and 40s who are not otherwise terribly ill, doctors reported Wednesday.

They said patients may be unwilling to call 911 because they have heard hospitals are overwhelmed by coronavirus cases.
There's growing evidence that Covid-19 infection can cause the blood to clot in unusual ways, and stroke would be an expected consequence of that
"Our report shows a seven-fold increase in incidence of sudden stroke in young patients during the past two weeks. Most of these patients have no past medical history and were at home with either mild symptoms (or in two cases, no symptoms) of Covid," he added.”
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ikarus
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by ikarus »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 6:41 am RippleRock, agreed fully. All I see is a number of media reports questioning if there is a link.

I watched for two years as Rachel Maddow of MSNBC and the rest of the MSM questioned a link between Trump and Russia, and we all know how that turned out.
Yes. but no one cares about that right now, so MSM now has another gem to exploit to their audience.
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Rockie
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by Rockie »

For those wanting to isolate the vulnerable and open the rest wide open consider this. The White House is the most protected place from Covid 19 in the world with daily testing of everybody working there, and mandatory testing for anybody getting within a mile of President Moron or Vice-President sycophantic idiot. Yet, two staff people right next to each of them tested positive. You are smoking a virulent strain of dope if you think people can be totally isolated from this.
ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 6:41 am I watched for two years as Rachel Maddow of MSNBC and the rest of the MSM questioned a link between Trump and Russia, and we all know how that turned out.
Since you brought it up:

1. Multiple indictments and prison sentences.
2. Multiple documented improper communications between the Trump circle and Russian government officials and agents.
3. Multiple documented examples of obstruction of justice.
4. Massive political coverup by the Republicans.
5. Complete corruption of the US Justice Department to serve DJT. Not the American people, not the constitution, not even the presidency...just Trump.
6. The end of American democracy, the American constitution and the rule of law.
ikarus wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 5:37 am But obviously some one has other interests. To collapse the economy and make the middle class even more obsolete and the super rich, richer!
It's in no one's interest to collapse the economy so maybe stop believing every crackpot conspiracy theory you read from the Alex Jone's of the internet. However collapsing the economy is almost a certainty if this virus is not dealt with properly and decisively. Sticking one's head up their ass and pretending it won't continue to wreak havoc will only make the economic pain more pronounced and long lasting. Same with not following medical science recommendations. The question everyone should be asking governments at every level is what is the plan for the degree of testing and tracing health officials say is necessary? So far the plan just seems to be let people get infected.

To that end, there are reported Covid 19 infection parties in the US northwest where uninfected people deliberately mingle with infected people. Kind of like the chicken pox parties parents of young children used to have. For the herd immunity crowd you might want to take a road trip out there to join in the fun.
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780Pilot
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by 780Pilot »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 5:12 am Quebec has 2928 (as of May 11) deaths due to COVID-19 and zero of them are people under 30, 2.2% are older than 30 and less than 60 years of age, and 90.8% are 70 or older, most of whom were in long term care facilities or retirement homes.

We now know who is at risk. Take the measures to isolate them and let the rest of us go back to work.
Agreed. People gotta get back to work. Who do you think pays for their CPP? The working population.
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goldeneagle
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by goldeneagle »

780Pilot wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 8:00 am Agreed. People gotta get back to work. Who do you think pays for their CPP? The working population.
Actually, cpp benefits are paid out from the investment fund which has accumulated over the years from contributions. CPP assests can cover it's obligations going forward, without contributions from workers, but then those workers not contributing today, wont have anything to draw from later.

Me thinks you are confusing the CPP we have in Canada with the Social Security they have in the USA. In the USA, government has spent all the SS funding, so payments to have to come from general revenue. Our governments cannot spend the CPP kitty, so future obligations are covered.
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mbav8r
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by mbav8r »

780Pilot wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 8:00 am
ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 5:12 am Quebec has 2928 (as of May 11) deaths due to COVID-19 and zero of them are people under 30, 2.2% are older than 30 and less than 60 years of age, and 90.8% are 70 or older, most of whom were in long term care facilities or retirement homes.

We now know who is at risk. Take the measures to isolate them and let the rest of us go back to work.
Agreed. People gotta get back to work. Who do you think pays for their CPP? The working population.
I’m out, the expression “you can’t fix stupid” comes to mind
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flashheart
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by flashheart »

I think it is comical that anyone who has doubts about this crackdown on our society and if it is proportional to what was necessary as being "deniers" or "stupid"

Well numbers are easy to interpret

I'm in BC and we have had ZERO deaths to anyone under 19.

Zero

I am not worried about my children in regards to Covid-19. Way bigger fish to fry. Vehicles, bikes and bathtubs are much more of a danger for them.
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mbav8r
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by mbav8r »

flashheart wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 10:46 am I think it is comical that anyone who has doubts about this crackdown on our society and if it is proportional to what was necessary as being "deniers" or "stupid"

Well numbers are easy to interpret

I'm in BC and we have had ZERO deaths to anyone under 19.

Zero

I am not worried about my children in regards to Covid-19. Way bigger fish to fry. Vehicles, bikes and bathtubs are much more of a danger for them.
B.C has been hailed as having one of the better responses and buy in, how many deaths under 19 had they not responded? Do you know? Can you acknowledge it most certainly would have been worse?
Also, there is more to Canada or North America than B.C, are the residents of B.C some how more resistant to covid?
And, I don’t think people are stupid because they deny, it’s because the comprehension of the situation lacks intelligence, they keep quoting numbers that are based on the strong measures as if that means anything at all about opening the economy, we simply don’t know for sure.
If in a month Quebec has an influx of children with multi organ inflammatory disease based on them opening schools today, we’ll know more but if only 20% of the children go back to school, we will know less, see how that works.
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ALPApolicy
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by ALPApolicy »

As of May 8, Italy had recorded 28,000 deaths of which 3 were children between under the age of 10 (no comorbidity mentioned), and zero deaths from age 10-19. 95.0% of the deaths were of people aged 60 or older.

This virus doesn’t kill young people. Of course there is the very, very rare exception to the rule.
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ALPApolicy
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by ALPApolicy »

“In the UK, they calculate that those under the age of 65 have faced the same risk over the past few months from coronavirus as they would have faced from driving 185 miles a day - the equivalent of commuting from Swindon to London.”

In Germany, there have been 7260 deaths reported as of today, with one being a child under 9 years of age. Another (one) child death was between 10 and 19, and 7 adults between the age of 20 and 29 died.

95.5% of the Covid-19 deaths in Germany were of people aged 60 or older.

Let’s go back to work and find ways to keep our elders safe.
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'97 Tercel
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by '97 Tercel »

But that goes against the narrative!

This thread will be shut down in a couple pages anyway..
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Rockie
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by Rockie »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:04 pm find ways to keep our elders safe.
So easy to say.

Does anyone know the pro-rated value of a person's life over 65? How much does it depreciate for every year above that?
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rxl
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by rxl »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:04 pm “In the UK, they calculate that those under the age of 65 have faced the same risk over the past few months from coronavirus as they would have faced from driving 185 miles a day - the equivalent of commuting from Swindon to London.”

In Germany, there have been 7260 deaths reported as of today, with one being a child under 9 years of age. Another (one) child death was between 10 and 19, and 7 adults between the age of 20 and 29 died.

95.5% of the Covid-19 deaths in Germany were of people aged 60 or older.

Let’s go back to work and find ways to keep our elders safe.
There are an awful lot of highly productive people over the age of 60 in the workforce who need and want to work. How do you suggest that we deal with them?
On a cautious and gradual basis we are going back to work. Just as it should be.
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ALPApolicy
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by ALPApolicy »

Rockie wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:12 pm
ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:04 pm find ways to keep our elders safe.
So easy to say.

Does anyone know the pro-rated value of a person's life over 65? How much does it depreciate for every year above that?
Well, for starters, take responsibility for your own health. Isolate. Wash your hands. Don’t become obese. Don’t smoke. Wear a mask outside.

I’m not sure what you feel you or any of us are owed. A zero risk life?

“Coronavirus risk for young is 'staggeringly low‘, says UK’s top statistician.”
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Rockie
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by Rockie »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:24 pm
Rockie wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:12 pm
ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:04 pm find ways to keep our elders safe.
So easy to say.

Does anyone know the pro-rated value of a person's life over 65? How much does it depreciate for every year above that?
Well, for starters, take responsibility for your own health. Isolate. Wash your hands. Don’t become obese. Don’t smoke. Wear a mask outside.

I’m not sure what you feel you or any of us are owed. A zero risk life?

“Coronavirus risk for young is 'staggeringly low‘, says UK’s top statistician.”
That's not what I asked.
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ALPApolicy
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by ALPApolicy »

Why is it that it has been so easy to send our young to an early grave in times of war, including through mandatory conscription against their will, with those unwilling being branded as cowards, yet when we seek to allow our young to have a healthy economic future by subjecting our elders to a modest increase in risk, there is foul play alleged?

The aforementioned UK top statistician says that Coronavirus risk of dying very nearly replicates the age adjusted risk of dying of any cause.

Says Prof David Spiegelhalter: “So, roughly speaking, we might say that getting COVID-19 is like packing a year’s worth of risk into a week or two. Which is why it’s important to spread out the infections to avoid the NHS being overwhelmed.”

https://medium.com/wintoncentre/how-muc ... 39118e1196
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Rockie
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by Rockie »

Still not what I asked.
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goldeneagle
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Re: The Return to Normal?

Post by goldeneagle »

ALPApolicy wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 12:04 pm Let’s go back to work and find ways to keep our elders safe.
Most care homes in Ontario and Quebec have been in isolation since before the pandemic became serious. So tell us, how well has 'keeping our elders safe' worked out in that part of the country so far ?
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