Encore ALPA vote??

[NewCommercialPilot]

Interesting developments at Jazz ALPA. It's possible I have been proven wrong on the DOH policy issue. We will see.

[mbav8r]

I guess Jazz doesn't care about constitution either as Jimmy2 and Jean-Pierre have stated.

http://flyjazz.mediaroom.com/index.php? ... tem=122663

Good find.

The Encore guys need to realize that they're in a win-win situation right now. If all goes well they eventually go to WJ. If things go sour they apply at AC and pretty much have a job there. Rumour has it some 14 WJE captains have AC medicals booked.

Wow, that would be quite the ground school, can't imagine AC giving a crap if they took all 14 for one PIT course!

[Bede]

We did it to Jazz (and bragged about it) and now AC is about to return the favor.

[Jean-Pierre]

Minimum 12 month hiring freeze at Mainline now I hear. I hope no one was counting on a quick flow.

[Air.Field]

Minimum 12 month hiring freeze at Mainline now I hear. I hope no one was counting on a quick flow.

I don't believe that with the widebody expansion and ULCC

[DaveP]

[Bede]

Minimum 12 month hiring freeze at Mainline now I hear. I hope no one was counting on a quick flow.

I'm pretty sure that's false... Is this from any reliable source?

[Dry Guy]

Was Mainline ground school set for October cancelled? Why?

[JTrain]

Was Mainline ground school set for October cancelled? Why?

Because they had hired sufficient people!

A normal WJ newhire class would be 8-10 folks. 12 would have been considered large back in the day. There had been several large classes throughout 2017. As in 16 or so. They even squeezed the sim break time to squeeze another session worth of productivity out of our simulators (the dreaded 'E' slot, from 22h00 to 0200 - still better than the graveyard 0100-0600 that I have done in some previous jobs). This had the effect of getting more people on line sooner. And when they took a look at things a month or two ago, they realized they were ahead of where they wanted to be. So they are taking a pause. It is not the end of the world. Encore folks will flow a couple months later, and off-the-street hires will still be joining us, just two months later.

DaveP should be updating us with the 2018 plan sometime in the next month or so. FWIW, whenever those numbers come out, the last few years we always end up exceeding them. And with 787 training starting and several MAX deliveries, it should be a busy year in the WJ training world.

[Dry Guy]

Seems like the board is being cleared for ULCC training to ramp up. What percentage of ULCC pilots will be off the street hires? I imagine bringing people over from Westjet or Encore would cost the parent company double, as they have to pay to train their replacement.

[Dangerous Goods]

Minimum 12 month hiring freeze at Mainline now I hear. I hope no one was counting on a quick flow.

I'm being told there is some truth to this rumour. I haven't heard a timeline though and it's not because we're "all caught up" on mainline hiring. It's a ripple effect caused by Encore staffing issues. (Reliable source)

[jjj]

Seems like the board is being cleared for ULCC training to ramp up. What percentage of ULCC pilots will be off the street hires? I imagine bringing people over from Westjet or Encore would cost the parent company double, as they have to pay to train their replacement.

The Union has started contract negotiations with the company. One of the things mentioned was all Westjet flying (ULCC, Encore, Westjet) must be done by WestJet pilots. If those talks fail and the company ramps up the ULCC off the street - those pilots will be in a silo. They will not have stock options or an ESP program. They will not be on our seniority list and they will not have our representation. If they ever manage to make it over to the mainline - we will have a nice spot for them at the bottom of the list after all the encore peeps. No hard feelings - just BOTL.

Enjoy.

JJJ

[NewCommercialPilot]

They will not have stock options or an ESP program.

Has the company already announced the pay package for the ULCC pilots?

[littlebird]

Lol no. He's just being salty.

[Alcoholism]

They will not have stock options or an ESP program.

Has the company already announced the pay package for the ULCC pilots?

The year is soon 2018. And with the new ULCC soon to launch, pilots everywhere will climb over their dead kin to fly a worn out high density 737-600 for LS 70k RS 50k. Because, afterall, it's a friken jet!!! How cool is that! "If I drink more of this kool aid, it'll advance my career in an unknown way... because cool it's a jet!!!" "I don't care about aviation in Canada, I don't care about the guy sitting next to me, because it's a friken jet!!!"

[flyinhigh]

The year is soon 2018. And with the new ULCC soon to launch, pilots everywhere will climb over their dead kin to fly a worn out high density 737-600 for LS 70k RS 50k. Because, afterall, it's a friken jet!!! How cool is that! "If I drink more of this kool aid, it'll advance my career in an unknown way... because cool it's a jet!!!" "I don't care about aviation in Canada, I don't care about the guy sitting next to me, because it's a friken jet!!!"

This on top of a post under the Encore card drive topic. Wow you must be a pleasure to sit beside in a aircraft.

I am curious though, you mention 70 and 50K. Are you one of those management types that you bashed in the other thread to already have the pay structure?

Yes, I get the sarcasm.

[Cat Driver]

I think what he/she is getting at is there would be no shortage of pilots willing to fly a jet for even lower pay, because it is a jet.

[North Shore]

I kinda wonder where all of these magical 737 captains are going to come from? I get the sense that most people with decent time are already sitting in a comfortable seat - with a career progression via PML or 'flow' to a 737 or bigger. Why would any of them move? What's the upside? Better WAWCON?

[skybaron]

There is a problem with Encore WAWCON? You would never know that talking to any Encore pilot. Things are perfect there from what I understand.

Makes sense then that Encores most experienced pilots decide to quickly move over to the 737 for less than half their salary. I also understand that their CP and others have secured their mainline spot, but still work at Encore (without a paycut).

If all this is true, then it just highlights the desperate need for a unified voice.

Curious where you got your numbers/what your math skills are like.

Encore captain = 68,000 / yr
WJ FO = 55,000 / yr

Encore = 218 days of work per year.
WestJet = 182 days of work per year.

Encore = $311 / day.
WestJet $302 / day.

If you want to factor in the ESP, I take home more money as an FO on at WJ then I ever did left seat at encore.

It's never ideal to take a pay cut, but its not like wj is the only airline in North America it happens at.

Sad but true.

Decent companies out there are seeing the writing on the wall, and are attempting to retain their professionals with increases in WAWCON. PASCO, for one, has made some of these positive WAWCON changes, and we hope to see this spread. (PASCO - Six figure $$ CPT salary plus confirmed commuting - is a good start for positive changes for our people in the 704 side)

What are the 705 (Especially WJ and AC) operations doing? They're still trying to sell you that the year is 2001...