Crewmember crossing US border with over 80 conviction.

[800man]

Hi. Bit of backstory and looking for some help:
Embarrassingly enough, I have an "Over 80" conviction from just under 5 years ago (Offense happened 7 years ago). No DUI- just had a few after work, happily went through a ride program, and was shocked to blow a .09. Guess losing 50 lbs in the prior months had that effect. Anyhow, irrelevent. Lesson learned.
Decided to lay off crossing the border to the States for 3 years until pardon could be granted. Just over two years ago (Just before the pardon could be applied) the waiting period was increased to 5 years. Jesus. Two more years of waiting.

So I'm eligible again in 6 months, finally. But have a problem and some questions...

I've been able to avoid a cross border job for a few years now, but as my career progresses, it's unavoidable now as I look at corporate gigs. Have some excellent options right now that I have to decide on, all involve regular cross border travel.

I know for a fact, and verified by the CBP website, that an over 80 conviction will NOT prevent entry. No problems, not worried about that.

My concern is that as soon as I tell customs about the conviction (Which they will surely ask) it will be entered in the US system, and thereafter I'll have to mention it, out loud, to customs every. single. time. I cross the border, with my Capt's, FO's, family members, friends, beside me, for the rest of my earthly existence, even after a pardon (now called record suspension) is issued here in Canada. Don't think I could handle that.

That brings me to not mentioning it on the grounds of it not denying me admissibility anyways till the pardon goes through... I don't think that's very smart. Does anyone know how often, as a crew member, you guys get a record check? Crossing the border probably 20 times over the next 6 months would likely happen? I have a feeling that could get me in a lot of hot water.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I realize I haven't really asked a concrete question, but just a rambling what-the-heck-should-I-do? And would I have to mention that conviction every time after they enter it?


Thanks.

[ahramin]

My concern is that as soon as I tell customs about the conviction (Which they will surely ask)

As a crew member I have never been asked anything by customs. Half the time I was flying corporate they completely ignored me (didn't even look at my passport), and the other half they wanted to see pilot's licence and passport. No questions. That was before 9/11 and now crew has to clear customs every time just like the passengers but still have never been asked anything by U.S. customs. So unless they already have it in their system or something (in which case it doesn't matter), I think your chances of being asked are very low.

[bizjets101]

Ummm good news and bad news

Bad news - USA doesn't recognize Canadian Pardons, they have your CPIC already and after your pardon - they will still see your conviction.

Good news - no reason not to visit USA - a single DUI is not grounds to deny entry to USA.

Might wanna read this; https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... i-offenses

[800man]

Thanks arhamin, that's interesting to hear. I used to cross by car regularly, and got asked if I'd "ever been arrested" pretty much every time, and it's not like I have a face tattoo or anything!

Bizjets, thanks, I already reviewed the website, as I mentioned. However I was under the impression that the US system won't have your Canadian criminal data unless they query it for any reason, then it's imported and stays in the US system permanently. However, if the first time they query your record is AFTER the pardon is granted, then nothing will show up and it's smooth sailing.

I'm just more worried about what crossings will be like in terms of admissions and embarrassment if I have to start now before the pardon is granted.

[cncpc]

If you have a Red Pass, then the US already knows all about you.

A Red Pass, although ostensibly only concerned with whether you are a threat to aviation security, can be denied for having a criminal record. An over 80 is not a "felony" down there, and believe it or not, many types of criminal offenses do not result in your being inadmissable in the US. Only crimes of moral turpitude. I don't know what those are, but its not all inclusive and 08 certainly isn't one of them.

Once you've presented your passport, if it mattered to them, the guy would know and wouldn't bother asking you. If it doesn't matter, then it doesn't matter.

[Gorgons]

Being asked anything easily verifiable by police and or customs is simply a truth test, a starting point. If you are untruthful about the 1st couple of questions your asked it would be considered an indicator you have bigger things to hide. So I wouldn't put much stock in being asked if you have ever been arrested, its simply one of the easiest verifiable questions they can ask.

[Siddley Hawker]

Only crimes of moral turpitude. I don't know what those are...

The transportation of young ladies across state lines for the purpose of producing paint thinner?

[altiplano]

Don't cross until you are pardoned.

Despite what is mentioned above your conviction is not on their system until you are there with passport scanned. Then they have it, it's theirs, and it won't disappear with a pardon in Canada. US doesn't recognise it... And d epending the way the wind blows you may have to get an exemption to cross in the future. So you really don't want that to get the conviction on their system. Get a pardon before you cross and it will never show up.

[Blueontop]

Don't cross until you are pardoned.

Despite what is mentioned above your conviction is not on their system until you are there with passport scanned. Then they have it, it's theirs, and it won't disappear with a pardon in Canada. US doesn't recognise it... And d epending the way the wind blows you may have to get an exemption to cross in the future. So you really don't want that to get the conviction on their system. Get a pardon before you cross and it will never show up.

^
+1

[LousyFisherman]

If it is an indictable conviction it is in CPIC and US Immigration already knows about. US Customs does not care.
If it is a summary conviction then it is not shared with US Immigration because US immigration stopped
believing in Canadian pardons (early 1980s I believe) and so Canada stopped sharing "trivial" criminal convictions with them.

If you are unsure visit a US consul/embassy and ask them whether you will be accepted into the US

The only thing I will agree on with the previous posters is DO NOT LIE TO US IMMIGRATION. You can refuse to
answer and be sent back, but once you lie, you have committed an indictable offence. The usual question is "Have
you ever been arrested?"

Magical passports that automagically extract information from multiple databases around the world.
Go fly planes people, it is obvious you know nothing about IT Systems

YMMV
LF

[boogs82]

Just a minor point.... DUI and Over 80 are basically the same thing in Canada. While the conviction isn't treated the same way in court (different wordings) the stigma attached to it, the way the insurance companies treat it and the penalties that apply are all the same.

As for how this applies when crossing into the USA, they can essentially deny you entry because they feel like it so I certainly wouldn't hide anything from them. IF they ask the question "Have you every been arrested?" and it's asked that way, you'd basically still have to answer yes. The pardon simply eliminates the CPIC (Canadian Police Information Centre) record which shows a Criminal Conviction in court. It doesn't eliminate the Arrest Report and all of the other paperwork that went along with it after you were arrested.

[800man]

The conviction was a summary conviction, since there were no aggravating factors and I have no other criminal record.

Now, LF- does this mean this wouldn't pop up during a routine customs check at all?

I need to get some factual information here, I suppose a good place to start would be an Immigration Lawyer? I like the idea of contacting the US embassy, but I assume I'd just be told to divulge everything at the border no matter what- might be pointless to ask. Does anyone have any contact suggestions?

Everything I've googled seems to be from pardon services and lawyer websites that want to scare you into buying expensive things, so I'm not sure of the credibility.

Thanks for the help thus far.

Cheers.

[boogs82]

The information I've provided you is factual. I work in the "industry". If you want to spend money on an immigration lawyer, that's fine as well. But I can assure you 100% that the pardon eliminates the criminal record, but doesn't eliminate the arrest report, suspension notices, etc. An impaired/over 80 conviction likely won't stop you from getting into the USA. But basically the way things work at the border is they look at any records and compare it to what would be a similar offence in the USA. If they determine that it's comparable and serious, then they will deny admission. The offences that will usually automatically have you denied revolve around violent offences and drug stuff for the most part.

[LousyFisherman]

The conviction was a summary conviction, since there were no aggravating factors and I have no other criminal record.

Now, LF- does this mean this wouldn't pop up during a routine customs check at all?

I need to get some factual information here, I suppose a good place to start would be an Immigration Lawyer? I like the idea of contacting the US embassy, but I assume I'd just be told to divulge everything at the border no matter what- might be pointless to ask. Does anyone have any contact suggestions?

Everything I've googled seems to be from pardon services and lawyer websites that want to scare you into buying expensive things, so I'm not sure of the credibility.

Thanks for the help thus far.

Cheers.

Stop confusing customs and immigration, they are different.
Go talk to the embassy/consulate.
Listen to boogs82
Stop making life difficult for yourself

Sigh.....
LF

Who has no convictions but was considered a terrorist threat for 12 years. Last time I went across the border
they only asked me where I was going and why. I think I've lost my rep

[800man]

LF

Who has no convictions but was considered a terrorist threat for 12 years. Last time I went across the border
they only asked me where I was going and why. I think I've lost my rep

That happens when you walk into a flight school and ask how to take off and fly, but are unconcerned with landing....

Thanks for the help.

[Meddler]

You guys must all look very suspicious. I've never been asked if I've been arrested. I've been asked how I'm related to the people I'm with, when I left various countries, where when and why I'm going in the states in great detail,(as a previous poster said, their main goal is to see if you re story makes sense) what I do for a living, once I was asked straight up if I had any pot. (I was having a bad hair day).
I suppose if I had been arrested it would be an easy question. most customs guards aren't complete assholes tho, so I doubt it would be an every time thing when your employer, kids, etc are right there. One would hope..

[North Shore]

Never had a problem going into the States...all of my border hassles have come when I`ve tried to get back into Canada. Man, does CBSA get their panties in a bunch over the minutiae of your day..

[boogs82]

THIS! Sorry..Couldn't find an up arrow smiley....but WOW CBSA loves to dig.

[co-joe]

I keep thinking the OP has over 80 convictions! Whoa man you should be locked up or sent to the gallows or something.

Over 80? Never heard of it. You mean over 0.08 as in a blood alcohol level of 8%? A blood alcohol level of 80 is something Rob Ford couldn't even achieve.

[boogs82]

We're in Canada. It's Over 80. As in 80 milligrams of alcohol per 100 millilitres of blood. Blood Alcohol Level of 0.08 is also correct, but it's more of an American thing.