TC ATP to FAA

[JohnnyHotRocks]

I realize this topic comes up yearly and I am aware of the ATP CTP (waste of money) course that is now required. Just wondering if anyone has got any fresh insight lately into doing the conversion.
Thanks
John

[AnonPilot]

I think it would be best to convert to an FAA CPL license and then have a company pay for the ATP course. American carriers will do it as part of the initial ground school. If you're being hired by a Canadian company and doing a sim in the US you could ask them to make the course a part of the package potentially? You could also just pay for the course on your own, although I've heard it's expensive.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

It’s about $5000usd

[AnonPilot]

Yea, I had heard that. I think the CPL conversion is your best bet.

[Cessna 180]

You'll have to do the course, however you can have the course added to pretty well any Level D Sim course you do at flight safety or cae etc. It's not very expensive and from what I understand it doesn't matter if you do it with a canadian company. It's a good idea to add the high altitude course with the atp course. I was told at Flight Safety they would just charge $300 for it.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

The course is 30hrs of groundschool and 10 hrs of sim so not something that is easily added on to a five day recurrent unfortunately

[cdnpilot77]

It’s about $5000usd

$5k is at the low end. Some places (CAE) are closer to $8k. Plus a week of expenses and airline tickets

[cdnpilot77]

You'll have to do the course, however you can have the course added to pretty well any Level D Sim course you do at flight safety or cae etc. It's not very expensive and from what I understand it doesn't matter if you do it with a canadian company. It's a good idea to add the high altitude course with the atp course. I was told at Flight Safety they would just charge $300 for it.

I suspect someone was misinformed that gave you this information. If you don’t have a USA passport you must file a separate tsa training application. It can’t be run concurrently with a recurrent or initial, it is a completely separate training event. It has to be done on a >40k lb airplane sim and in the USA or a part142 training school. Canadian sim providers do not qualify for this.

[Cessna 180]

You'll have to do the course, however you can have the course added to pretty well any Level D Sim course you do at flight safety or cae etc. It's not very expensive and from what I understand it doesn't matter if you do it with a canadian company. It's a good idea to add the high altitude course with the atp course. I was told at Flight Safety they would just charge $300 for it.

I suspect someone was misinformed that gave you this information. If you don’t have a USA passport you must file a separate tsa training application. It can’t be run concurrently with a recurrent or initial, it is a completely separate training event. It has to be done on a >40k lb airplane sim and in the USA or a part142 training school. Canadian sim providers do not qualify for this.

I don't think you need training authorization since the a/c is less that 12501lbs (that I used) since flightsafety is a Part 142 school. from what I understand all the sim centers are part 142. this was right from the guys at flightsafety wichita. there were two people (americans) in my course that did their atp add-on and neither of them were doing full type rating courses (king air without a halo stc). neither had an faa ride at the end.

the only reason i could see you needing tsa authorization is if the specific center can't offer a cat 3 waiver (pretty much all the big sim centers can offer this) or if youre a national of a certain country.

[cdnpilot77]

I’m sorry, but you have been grossly misinformed by your training provider.

Read this: https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/med ... _CHG_1.pdf

Look specifically at section 19.

You cannot even walk into a >40,000lb simulator without a TSA authorization if you don’t hold a USA passport. A king air simulator does not qualify for the ATP-CTP program. There are also very strict guidelines that it is a completely stand alone course and has ground hour and simulator hour requirements. If they said it’s only $300, then possibly they are referring to the high altitude course alone. The ATP-CTP course will run $5k-$8k. It doesn’t matter which airplane you fly in real life, if you want the US ATP license, you MUST do this course in order to sit the ATP or ATP conversion exam.

Ps. An ATP add on in the USA is very different from obtaining an ATP license. That is their qualifying flight training for the ATP license. They would have already had to do the ATP-CTP program and written the exam. If they didn’t do a ride it’s likely because they operate part 91 which is similar to our 604, but they still have a lengthy oral exam and a check that is similar to our PCC. Unlike Canada, they have a checkride to obtain a full ATP. They can’t do any 135 flights or 121 flights without a full check ride to ATP standards, which every airline will provide to sign off the ATP. The one benefit of a conversion is that you don’t have to do the checkride just to obtain the ATP.

[Outlaw58]

when you consider what it was like to get an ATP in the US pre 2016, ...talk about the pendulum swinging the other way!

58

[JohnnyHotRocks]

Thanks for that info.
Once you get the US conversion, is it now an actual FAA ATP, or is it forever linked to the TC license? If someone was to be hired by an American company, could you add a type to the FAA atp by doing an FAA type ride?

[cdnpilot77]

All your types carry over in both directions with paperwork....just not things like CFI or Float Endorsement (that’s an actual rating for the FAA), those are done independently. Although with proper proof of experience, I’ve heard of the FAA signing off on a float rating too. You could do an fAA ride With an FAA license at that point if you want and then get the rating added to your TC license at a later date. One important thing to remember is that you need to keep both Canadian and US medicals current.

One quick edit: in some aircraft their type ratings have different classifications. For example the Cessna 500, 550, 560 etc are all individual type in Canada. In the us they are classified all as the c500 series.

[cdnpilot77]

One thing that I’m not sure of is whether or not it’s required to get the license verification through Oklahoma City before you do the ATP-CTP course. I don’t believe you need to, but better look into that.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

Thanks. You are a wealth of knowledge!

[Whiskey25]

You should get the licence verification letter started as you never know how long the wheels of bureaucracy will take to turn in your favour.

I will be taking the CTP in August and below is the syllabus I was given. I've been told you won't get choice as to which sim, as it is based on availability, but I'm sure if you are a regular customer or also conducting other training you may have some influence.

ATPCTP Rev Footprint Nov 21 2014.pdf

(21.57 KiB) Downloaded 45 times

[JohnnyHotRocks]

Thanks
Unbelievable that thousands of hours in a transport category jet as PIC counts as nothing towards the conversion

[Whiskey25]

You also have to get your FAA radio licence and this isn't written anywhere.

FAA Radio License: ($60)
A. Do this concurrently with the Verification. It is simply an Internet exercise (no tests) only titles, addresses & a payment.

Go to http://wireless.fcc.gov/uls/index.htm?job=home

Click under New Users – REGISTER

On the new page that appears Click Again REGISTER (&receive your FRN)

Select appropriate registration types

Fill in the fields as required. On the next page your FRN number will be displayed.
Write this down or print for future reference.

Go to http://wireless.fcc.gov/index.htm?&job=forms_and_fees and beside form 605 under the column ONLINE FILING click the hyperlink ULS

Enter your number here along with your password you submitted in the previous steps.

Step 9 - The following page will have an option to Apply for a new license. Click here.

Step 10 - This will take you to a page on which you must select the radio service for which you will be applying. Scroll down the list until you reach ( RR-Recruited Operator ). Continue

Step 11 - On the Applicant Questions page leave everything as is. It should say Regular on type and No you’re not exempt from application fees or license fees. Continue

Step 12 - Address located outside the U.S. check appropriate field. Continue.

Step 13 - Fill out your information for you license on this page. Continue

Step 14 - Click that you are eligible for employment in the U.S. Continue

Step 15 - Check that all your information is accurate and then continue.

Step 16 - Agree to all the above statements then Continue.

Step 17 - Give your electronic signature by filling in the boxes. Continue

Step 18 - Print your application and continue to Form 159

Step 19 - Fill in your FRN number and password and Continue

Step 20 - On form 159 you can either pay credit card or if you select to view form 159 you can mail in a payment. Select your choice and proceed.

Step 21 - The following page you will be able to print form 159 after your credit card has been approved.

This is the completion of you FCC Radio Telephone Operators Permit Application.
You should receive you license in the mail with in 2 to 3 weeks.

[JohnnyHotRocks]

I thought radio licence was part and parcel of an atp?

[JohnnyHotRocks]

After more research I see that you do indeed need an faa radio license to operate N registered internationally
Thanks for pointing that one out!