50th Anniversary
No sense clicking the link if you happen to be one of the people who believes it never really happened.

Moderators: North Shore, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, I WAS Birddog
I think it is even sadder than that. It's our ability to pay for the liability that is holding us back.I have the impression that too many subcontractors are just too afraid to develop something at a normal cost, which makes liability and lawyer costs go up too much.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:56 pm It’s sad that it’s no longer the limits of technology that hold us back, but the ability to pay for it.
That was a bright spot in the Cold War where nations competed with technological advances and scientific achievements rather than finding new and creative ways to kill everyone on the planet.
Not so fast, cowboy. The only reason anyone went into space was to prove to the other side that since this side's missile technology was reliable and accurate enough to send people to the moon that it would have absolutely no difficulty reliably delivering an armada of thermonuclear warheads to Moscow.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:56 pm
That was a bright spot in the Cold War where nations competed with technological advances and scientific achievements rather than finding new and creative ways to kill everyone on the planet.
iflyforpie wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:56 pm It’s sad that it’s no longer the limits of technology that hold us back, but the ability to pay for it.
That was a bright spot in the Cold War where nations competed with technological advances and scientific achievements rather than finding new and creative ways to kill everyone on the planet.
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Technological advancements are always a byproduct of war, but the bottom line is the technology is meant to harm whether in offence or defence. It's nice if the technology can be used for a good thing after the war is done. It's sad how it's war that motivates countries to create something that's a technological marvel, look at the Avrow Arrow. When was the last time this country did something like that?
No. It's not the lack of ability to pay for it, it's the lack of will to pay for it.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:56 pm It’s sad that it’s no longer the limits of technology that hold us back, but the ability to pay for it.
Not true.photofly wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:19 pmNot so fast, cowboy. The only reason anyone went into space was to prove to the other side that since this side's missile technology was reliable and accurate enough to send people to the moon that it would have absolutely no difficulty reliably delivering an armada of thermonuclear warheads to Moscow.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:56 pm
That was a bright spot in the Cold War where nations competed with technological advances and scientific achievements rather than finding new and creative ways to kill everyone on the planet.
If you really want motivation to achieve something, you had better have someone else to prove something to.
No. It's not the lack of ability to pay for it, it's the lack of will to pay for it. [/quote]
I think you misunderstood (and inadvertantly reinforce) my point, which was that the purpose of the space programme was to demonstrate to the Russians (and the US public) that US missile technology as it then existed was already sufficiently reliable to be used in manned missions. The Russians and the US electorate got the very clear message that if the guidance package (and every other critical technology) already installed in US ICBMs was good enough to put behind a Saturn V rocket carrying US citizens, it would without doubt do the job of delivering nukes to Moscow when asked.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:33 pm
In fact, a lot of it was the other way around. Grumman was contracted to build the LEM because at the time they were the only American company who’d built an aircraft with two computers in it (the A-6 Intruder). IBMs guidance package for the Saturn V was based on what was already installed in ICBMs.
Yes, basically "If we can safely, accurately, and repeatedly land men on the moon. Trust me when I say I can put a rocket through the Kremlin, east side, second floor, 4th window from the right if you make me"photofly wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:26 pmI think you misunderstood (and inadvertantly reinforce) my point, which was that the purpose of the space programme was to demonstrate to the Russians (and the US public) that US missile technology as it then existed was already sufficiently reliable to be used in manned missions. The Russians and the US electorate got the very clear message that if the guidance package (and every other critical technology) already installed in US ICBMs was good enough to put behind a Saturn V rocket carrying US citizens, it would without doubt do the job of delivering nukes to Moscow when asked.iflyforpie wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:33 pm
In fact, a lot of it was the other way around. Grumman was contracted to build the LEM because at the time they were the only American company who’d built an aircraft with two computers in it (the A-6 Intruder). IBMs guidance package for the Saturn V was based on what was already installed in ICBMs.
The manned space programme wasn't a trail blazer for forthcoming military technology, it was a demonstrator for what the US could already do, and one less likely to cause a global thermonuclear conflict than actually launching a few trial ICBMs to the USSR to show off.
In the atmosphere of the 50's and 60's, space warfare was believed by every politician and member of the public (including Russian politicians, and the Russian public) to be the next big thing. You cannot with a straight face claim that there was no political-military advantage in being seen by your enemy to be easily and reliably able to put enormous things into space, to become expert at orbital rendezvous, and the rest.
Remember that Sputnik caused enormous public panic in the US, from fear of what the Soviets' newly demonstrated abilities meant for the next war, and this was something the US political machine needed to throw back to the USSR, magnified a thousand times. It has nothing to do with whether the Pentagon was really interested in using teflon, velcro, and pens that write upside down, or not.
The space race was not at its heart a laudable peaceful time-out from the military brinksmanship of the cold war; it was very much part of it.
Do you think we can do it in a 172?Beefitarian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:13 am I like the gofund me idea but forget Kim jong.
I say digits and I go and live stream it on the internet. He's been to the north pole, let's do this!
I have a great gag planned for when we return through the van allen belt.