Transition between aircraft

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highupabove
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Transition between aircraft

Post by highupabove »

Are there any formal rules for private pilots transitioning between aircraft? Does one need a formal checkout by a CFI for a transition from a C150 to C172? What about C172 to PA28? Or is an experienced pilot that is current sufficient? (I am assuming non-complex aircraft.)
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PilotDAR
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by PilotDAR »

What an appropriate question! The answer is that it should not matter, but it does, and different amounts of matter to different people (airplane providers/insurers). The more experience you get on different types, and the broader that experience on each type (airwork and emergencies) the easier it will be to transition to other types.

Every type has its little "should knows" and a number of them have some "gotta knows". For sure, read the flight manual cover to cover before you present yourself to fly. Understand the limitations, particularly odd ones, Know your speeds, and any emergency procedures. Know the fuel system.

Then, get a checkout if you can. From a 150 to a 172 is not a big leap. From a 150 to a 206 amphib is a huge leap! Characteristics like glass cockpit, taildragger, floatplane, skiplane, amphibian justify extra training, and each of those are ratings or endorsements in other jurisdictions. Certain types are a little different, and justify type training: Lake amphibian, Bellanca Viking, Ercoupe, Cessna 177 or 210, any taildragger, or anything "vintage".

Once you start getting bigger, twin, or helicopters, then a type endorsement is required, so training is not optional. For the lighter planes, the design requirements do say "must not require unusual pilot skill and attention", but understand that the basis of that subjective assessment were FAA test pilots who come from a different skill base than is common today, so take that with a grain of salt.

In the mean time, you'll generally find that the provider of the plane insists on you taking type training - because their insurer does.
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ahramin
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by ahramin »

In addition to PilotDAR's good advice, the answer to your question is found on your licence: No.

There is no definition of a "complex" aircraft in Canada, so no worries there. Your licence is valid for all aircraft that are neither high performance nor multi crew. So no regulatory requirements for any checkout when transitioning between any of those types.

The most limiting factor for an FTU rental is usually the school policy and for a private aircraft is often the insurance requirements in order to meet the legal liability requirements. There are insurance policies out there that will cover a pilot for any aircraft without a checkout but they are not cheap or easy to get.
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JasonE
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by JasonE »

I have a reasonable amount of hours on PA28. PM me if you have any specific questions.
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by Cessna 180 »

Depends on what your insurance company wants. There's a few of us that fly a plane my buddy owns, some need a checkout, some are fine with their previous experience.
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PilotDAR
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by PilotDAR »

a plane my buddy owns, some need a checkout, some are fine with their previous experience.
As an example of this, my buddy owned a 182RG for years. He kindly let me fly it, and over many years, I probably flew it 100 hours, where he put near a thousand on it. He sold it and downsized to a really nice 172. Years later, he bought another beautiful 182RG. I hadn't flown one since his many years back, though was insured to ferry it home from California for him with no checkout. When I got it home, he was required to fly a five hour checkout with me, and it was his insurance! We had both flown continuously between the two 182RGs, so it really wasn't a matter of currency.

I never did figure it out, other than to note to myself that when he tried to add me to the 172 insurance when he bought that, it was a fuss to add me. I sometimes don't understand insurers!
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Caterpillar
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by Caterpillar »

So the short answer is no, but the insurance won’t let you.
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highupabove
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by highupabove »

Thanks everyone, this is super interesting and helpful. I was looking through the CAR:s but couldn't find anything other than the blanket privileges mentioned. The only reference I have is from my PPL is all single pilot, non-high performance, single engine land aeroplanes.
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jakeandelwood
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by jakeandelwood »

Yes, it's pretty much the insurance companies that are making the rules. If your renting the flight school will make you do a checkout, which is a good thing. If you buy an obscure plane trying to find someone to give you that insurance required checkout can be difficult sometimes.
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Big Pistons Forever
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by Big Pistons Forever »

ahramin wrote: Sat Mar 14, 2020 7:04 pm In addition to PilotDAR's good advice, the answer to your question is found on your licence: No.

There is no definition of a "complex" aircraft in Canada, so no worries there. Your licence is valid for all aircraft that are neither high performance nor multi crew. So no regulatory requirements for any checkout when transitioning between any of those types.
Actually there is a definition of complex aircraft in a CAR 400.01, Interpretations

“ complex aeroplane means an aeroplane that has flaps and a constant-speed propeller and, except in the case of a seaplane, retractable landing gear; (avion complexe)”

However, Ahramin is correct with his response to the OP

For any pilot who has a question about what they can do with any permit, license, or rating; the best thing to do is go to CAR Part 4 and look up the privileges associated with that permit, license or rating. Complex aircraft is not mentioned anywhere in those privileges therefore there is no restriction on flying one even for a holder of a Recreational Pilot Permit.
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ahramin
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by ahramin »

Thanks Big Pistons Forever, I never noticed that. Is there any CAR that refers to a complex aircraft or is it just the definition?
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Big Pistons Forever
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Re: Transition between aircraft

Post by Big Pistons Forever »

ahramin wrote: Sun Mar 15, 2020 12:54 pm Thanks Big Pistons Forever, I never noticed that. Is there any CAR that refers to a complex aircraft or is it just the definition?
CAR 426.75, Requirements for the integrated CPL course;

(vi) 5 hours flight time on complex or technically advanced aeroplanes

NOTE:

A technically advanced aeroplane means an aeroplane that combines most or all of the following design features: advanced cockpit automation system (glass cockpit), GPS with moving map, automated engine and systems management, and integrated autoflight/autopilot systems for IFR/VFR flight operations.
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