Landing fee at CYOS
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Landing fee at CYOS
https://www.thesudburystar.com/news/loc ... l-airport/
My first thoughts are:
1.The town council wants to close the airport (well, that's not news, everyone's known that for ever) and this is how they plan to do it.
2. $35 would make it probably the fourth most expensive airport in the country for a piston single, for a dumpy little airport with an ugly terminal building in the middle of nowhere. Why bother?
My first thoughts are:
1.The town council wants to close the airport (well, that's not news, everyone's known that for ever) and this is how they plan to do it.
2. $35 would make it probably the fourth most expensive airport in the country for a piston single, for a dumpy little airport with an ugly terminal building in the middle of nowhere. Why bother?
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
- rookiepilot
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Never landed there. No need.photofly wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:59 pm https://www.thesudburystar.com/news/loc ... l-airport/
My first thoughts are:
1.The town council wants to close the airport (well, that's not news, everyone's known that for ever) and this is how they plan to do it.
2. $35 would make it probably the fourth most expensive airport in the country for a piston single, for a dumpy little airport with an ugly terminal building in the middle of nowhere. Why bother?
I'm curious how other pilots think municipal airports, especially in the middle of nowhere, should be funded, though, as landing fees are very unpopular. Not everyone buys gas, either.
Things do cost money to operate.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Wait until the Mayor's daughter needs an emergency medevac from the airport, where Ornge frequently land, then ask *him* how he thinks the airport should be funded.
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
At $35 say goodbye to another airport.
"Carelessness and overconfidence are more dangerous than deliberately accepted risk." -Wilbur Wright
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Could just land at Wiarton or Collingwood instead if you’re not too picky on location. $35 is a little steep unless you get a CATSA massage thrown in and you can get a Tim Horton’s inside the terminal.
Let’s Go Brandon
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
For $35 that CATSA massage hopefully has a happy ending.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
I pay for libraries, even though I don't borrow library books. I pay for parks, even though I don't visit them, or swing on the swings. I don't use community centres or public beaches; I don't visit municipal Christmas light displays, nor New Year's Eve celebrations. I don't skate on municipal rinks, nor play baseball on municipal diamonds. Yet I pay for all these things. Why is it the one municipal facility I do use, is the one that has to be self-funding?rookiepilot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:35 pm
I'm curious how other pilots think municipal airports, especially in the middle of nowhere, should be funded, though, as landing fees are very unpopular. Not everyone buys gas, either.
Things do cost money to operate.
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
The same way other municipal infrastructure is funded. Tax dollars. As photofly pointed out. I don't use any of those facilities either.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:35 pmI'm curious how other pilots think municipal airports, especially in the middle of nowhere, should be funded, though, as landing fees are very unpopular. Not everyone buys gas, either.
Other ways: Build hangars and lease them, or lease the land and let others build. Or attract aviation-related businesses and lease them land to build on.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Ha ha. They did those things; all the hangars are leased already. So they took the money, and now they're going to bill all the hangar owners on top for their landings.
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Now I'm curious how many pilots would be willing to buy and operate a small town airport with their own money.
Prediction: Crickets.
Prediction: Crickets.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
There are a bunch near you: Greenbank is a private airfield, so is Burlington, Brampton is a not-for-profit run by pilots, Buttonville is privately owned, also run by a flying family. Edenvale is private, Collingwood was sold into private ownership last year... should I go on?
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Would you run a library in a small town with your own money? Or a fire hall?rookiepilot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 am Now I'm curious how many pilots would be willing to buy and operate a small town airport with their own money.
Prediction: Crickets.
As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Crickets, and most other invertebrates (other than perhaps ACPA leadership) lack the cash flow, ambition, organization, and leadership to operate an airport.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 am Now I'm curious how many pilots would be willing to buy and operate a small town airport with their own money.
Prediction: Crickets.
Although your post does raise the interesting philosophical question as to whether one is still considered a pilot if their own body has the ability to fly... I think most people, generally, would not consider crickets to be pilots.
Therefore, I believe your prediction is wrong. I am willing to bet a beer on that (or 90% of a beer, if it is cargo aircraft only).
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
LOL.photofly wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:45 am There are a bunch near you: Greenbank is a private airfield, so is Burlington, Brampton is a not-for-profit run by pilots, Buttonville is privately owned, also run by a flying family. Edenvale is private, Collingwood was sold into private ownership last year... should I go on?
Owen sound is exactly like those.
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Why don't you answer the question Digits?digits_ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:48 amWould you run a library in a small town with your own money? Or a fire hall?rookiepilot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 am Now I'm curious how many pilots would be willing to buy and operate a small town airport with their own money.
Prediction: Crickets.
Tell us how you'd turn CYOS around to at least! cut their losses. I'm interested.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Because I don't agree with your assumption. You are assuming that an airport needs to make money. I don't think it needs to. A public library doesn't need to make money either.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:59 amWhy don't you answer the question Digits?digits_ wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:48 amWould you run a library in a small town with your own money? Or a fire hall?rookiepilot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:38 am Now I'm curious how many pilots would be willing to buy and operate a small town airport with their own money.
Prediction: Crickets.
Tell us how you'd turn CYOS around to at least! cut their losses. I'm interested.
So no, I wouldn't invest my personal money in a public airport, just like I wouldn't invest it in a public library. As a town council member I would accept that a community airport might operate with a loss, because it provides access to my community, which will increase economic activity.
It can also be used by emergency services. My fire department wouldn't make a profit either.
Why don't you answer my question rookiepilot? Would you run a library in a small town with your own money?
As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
- rookiepilot
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
So YYZ shouldn't have landing fees? It's a community airport. Downtown Toronto parking should be free? No property taxes?
Because, you know, we have to attract economic activity.
If you don't think a whole ton of landing fees, extra fees, surcharges, extra charges, taxes, aren't coming for the perceived entitlement class, you aren't paying attention.
Just wait.
Because, you know, we have to attract economic activity.
If you don't think a whole ton of landing fees, extra fees, surcharges, extra charges, taxes, aren't coming for the perceived entitlement class, you aren't paying attention.
Just wait.
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Re: Landing fee at CYOS
The average person understands the value to the community of the local rec center or library, unfortunately they don't understand the value to the community of the local small airport. This is exacerbated by the perception that the pilots using the airport are just rich people in their "private" airplanes selfishly making noise that bothers the town residents.
What is needed and works is a concerted effort by the GA community to lobby the local governments and sell the value of the airport. COPA has a lot of resources to help make the case and some discrete lobbying can help especially playing the medivac card. Instead you usually just see a lot of whinging but no action until the airport is gone.......
What is needed and works is a concerted effort by the GA community to lobby the local governments and sell the value of the airport. COPA has a lot of resources to help make the case and some discrete lobbying can help especially playing the medivac card. Instead you usually just see a lot of whinging but no action until the airport is gone.......
Last edited by Big Pistons Forever on Sat Dec 05, 2020 9:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
It's not owned and run by a municipality, like CYOS is.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:35 am So YYZ shouldn't have landing fees? It's a community airport.
Landing fees are a silly way for an underused airport to raise revenue, because they are a reverse incentive - they discourage landings. They make some sense for a congested airport, but CYOS isn't that.
DId you hear the one about the jurisprudence fetishist? He got off on a technicality.
Re: Landing fee at CYOS
Is CYOS suffering from too much traffic? Does it need to be restricted because the airport can't handle any more traffic? If the answer is 'no', landing fees don't make sense. Same with parking fees. If you want to attract visitors, you don't charge parking fees. If you want to keep them away because everything is overcrowded, then it does make sense.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:35 am So YYZ shouldn't have landing fees? It's a community airport. Downtown Toronto parking should be free? No property taxes?
Because, you know, we have to attract economic activity.
I would abolish, or at least seriously reform, the property taxes and increase income tax. If you retire or lose your job, and your house is paid off, at least the state won't auction off your home. But that's a whole other discussion.
Again, that's a completely different discussion.rookiepilot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:35 am If you don't think a whole ton of landing fees, extra fees, surcharges, extra charges, taxes, aren't coming for the perceived entitlement class, you aren't paying attention.
As an AvCanada discussion grows longer:
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship
-the probability of 'entitlement' being mentioned, approaches 1
-one will be accused of using bad airmanship