Porter monopoly kaput!

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Black Cat
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Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by Black Cat »

Air Canada and Continental Airlines have been given initial approval to operate out of Billy Bishop Toronto City Centre Airport on Toronto Island.

The Toronto Port Authority says that a consulting firm it hired to evaluate landing slots at the airport has allocated 44 slots to Porter Airlines, 30 to Air Canada and 16 to Continental.

Until now, Porter has been the only commercial airline operating out of the airport, but Air Canada has asked for a judicial review on how slots are awarded at the island airport. It’s due to be heard in July.

Air Canada wants its Jazz affiliate to offer flights from the island.

For its part, Porter says it deserves more slots than it is being offered under the new arrangement.

“Historic usage rights give Porter access to 112 daily slots,” Porter spokesman Brad Cicero said in an e-mail.

Port authority president Geoff Wilson said the goal is to “providing the travelling public with more carrier options than in the modern history of this airport.”

Air Canada and Continental would both have to negotiate formal operating agreements before they could use the airport.



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sanjet
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by sanjet »

Nothing surprising. They were expected to be given slots at YTZ. Was only a matter of time.
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Justjohn
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by Justjohn »

Until now, Porter has been the only commercial airline operating out of the airport

As I recall, Jazz abandoned Ops at the Island as unworkable ... Maybe 5 years ago. It could have been longer ago, can't recall. Porter makes a go of it, and suddenly Jazz is all ME TOO ME TOO.

Yes it's good that the traveling public have choices. But it is a little disingenuous to spin Porter as the bad guy.
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C-FABH
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by C-FABH »

Justjohn wrote:As I recall, Jazz abandoned Ops at the Island as unworkable ... Maybe 5 years ago. It could have been longer ago, can't recall. Porter makes a go of it, and suddenly Jazz is all ME TOO ME TOO.

Yes it's good that the traveling public have choices. But it is a little disingenuous to spin Porter as the bad guy.
As I recall correctly (having worked there at the time), Porter Airlines purchased City Centre Aviation Limited which owned the CYTZ Terminal building. Jazz was evicted from the terminal shortly thereafter.

So, in a way, I would call it the failure of the Toronto City Centre Airport management for failing to adequately provide terminal space to any airlines other than Porter. Why would Porter allow Jazz to keep operating at the Island when it isn't in their best interest? Although Jazz didn't offer much service and the loads were dwindling, the airport hadn't done anything to improve the facilities or attract any other carriers.
Black Cat wrote:Port authority president Geoff Wilson said the goal is to “providing the travelling public with more carrier options than in the modern history of this airport.”
I really doubt that Geoff Wilson cares that much, this is a complete 180 to everything they've stated since Day 1 at Porter Airlines.
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ScudRunner
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by ScudRunner »

What terminal will Jazz and Colgan fly out of ? or will Porter finally become profitable through selling them gate space at YTZ?
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jakey
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by jakey »

Any room left for GA at YTZ?
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teacher
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by teacher »

Porter will continue to lose money but Reggco, Porter's parent company, will make money off Jazz and Colgan.
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2775PSI
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by 2775PSI »

Porter only owns half the terminal, the Harbour Commission the other half. So Porter, Jazz and Colgan will be sharing the one and only terminal, correct?

How will this affect the Porter IPO??
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midwingcrisis
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by midwingcrisis »

My take is POE CASM's have to shaved. They have reached critical mass or close. Ancillary revenues are going to be a must. Additional routes extremely costly (marketing). Convince the Lords in Ottawa next month. Welcome the competition. All out battle on product and frequency. See if the customer stays. Try an IPO
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iflyforpie
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by iflyforpie »

They didn't do an IPO because the airline isn't profitable and nobody would pay what the shares are worth. The parent company will get more revenue from terminal leases, but I would imagine Jazz and Colgan would cut into Porter's already low load factors...
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2775PSI
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by 2775PSI »

So they're no longer going public because of this?
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iflyforpie
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by iflyforpie »

2775PSI wrote:So they're no longer going public because of this?
They weren't going public before this do to the debt load and losses of the airline. This new development can't make the prospectus for a Porter IPO look much better...
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Flybaby
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by Flybaby »

They were delaying their IPO because of the economic conditions on the world markets. Europe was threatening to throw the world back into a recession so they decided like many companies around the world to delay till the world markets are a little more bullish.
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winds_in_flight_wtf
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by winds_in_flight_wtf »

is porter really doing that bad? Did they not just hire a bunch of pilots? I thought they were doing well?
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2775PSI
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by 2775PSI »

iflyforpie wrote:
2775PSI wrote:So they're no longer going public because of this?
They weren't going public before this do to the debt load and losses of the airline. This new development can't make the prospectus for a Porter IPO look much better...
Not sure what you mean...there was a very public announcement of plans for IPO.


Flybaby wrote:They were delaying their IPO because of the economic conditions on the world markets. Europe was threatening to throw the world back into a recession so they decided like many companies around the world to delay till the world markets are a little more bullish.
So they are still planning an IPO, just at the right time?
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paul65
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by paul65 »

Doesn't Porter also own the ILS? I understand it's private and only they can use it. Plus it's a non-standard approach.
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iflyforpie
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by iflyforpie »

2775PSI wrote:
iflyforpie wrote:
2775PSI wrote:So they're no longer going public because of this?
They weren't going public before this do to the debt load and losses of the airline. This new development can't make the prospectus for a Porter IPO look much better...
Not sure what you mean...there was a very public announcement of plans for IPO.

I meant they suspended their IPO before slots were awarded to Jazz and Continental at YTZ.
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mattedfred
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by mattedfred »

first of all, the slots belong to AC, not Jazz

i predict that RD will sell PD to QK and keep the rest of the operation as he will be able to charge CO and AC high user fees

a PD/QK merger would be DOH for pilots and include some flushing and bumping rights for a period of time
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Jaques Strappe
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by Jaques Strappe »

mattedfred wrote:first of all, the slots belong to AC, not Jazz

i predict that RD will sell PD to QK and keep the rest of the operation as he will be able to charge CO and AC high user fees

a PD/QK merger would be DOH for pilots and include some flushing and bumping rights for a period of time
Matted

I think you may be right, for several reasons. Jazz wants Q400s. Porter has them with more on the way that now need to be paid for without the expected capital generation of a successful IPO and besides, it would be a "Deluce Deja Vu" all over again! The more things change, the more they stay the same.
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Maxpwr
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Re: Porter monopoly kaput!

Post by Maxpwr »

mattedfred wrote:first of all, the slots belong to AC, not Jazz

i predict that RD will sell PD to QK and keep the rest of the operation as he will be able to charge CO and AC high user fees

a PD/QK merger would be DOH for pilots and include some flushing and bumping rights for a period of time
Could you please expand on what "some flushing and bumping rights" means please? It better not mean what i think it means...
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