From DND's Directorate of flight Safety -
http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/dfs-ds ... p?id=10279
Also, for this time of year, Tail-plane Icing -
http://www.airforce.forces.gc.ca/dfs-ds ... sp?id=9965
Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog
Re: Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
Those were interesting pieces, thanks .
It has been nearly 25 years since I got out of uniform. Good to see that the CAF has now come to the realization that people need to sleep...
It has been nearly 25 years since I got out of uniform. Good to see that the CAF has now come to the realization that people need to sleep...
Accident speculation:
Those that post don’t know. Those that know don’t post
Those that post don’t know. Those that know don’t post
Re: Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
Now if only civvie operators realized that...
"I have control!"
Re: Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
The sleep study is older and the changes have been in place awhile. Long enough that one of the things being studied now is aircrew over-dependency on sleeping pills.
Re: Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
mmmmmmm...pills. with vitamins zzzz.
The civilian issue ,I agree, is a serious one. The problem stems from two considerations.
Firstly aircrew are subject, not to provinical regulations, but to federal. And many, many , many operators simply believe the federal people have no teeth and that they can abuse employees. It is not unusual to see people getting paid only if they work 30 days a month, at 9 10 hours a day in the north.
The second is that Tc has provide some regulations, which for example say....3 days rest in 30.
Again, there are more than a few operators that interpret this to mean the maximum time off is 3 days....not the minimum
So what it the solution?
First of all the federal labot regulations have to be enforced, and in some cases, tightened up.
Secondly, TC has to redefine their regualtions so operators can not use the opposite of them...that is minimums become maximums and visa versa.
And lastly, pilots have to start standing up for themselves. As a group they are the most spineless people I have ever met. Willing to backstab their own family member if it will get them to the seat of some heavy iron, work for nothing on the rationale that 10 more are lined up to take the no paying job if they dont. And completely unwilling to stand up to a bad employer..Just slink away....my apologies to those who are not included in this.
When people are working nights, away from base, and on odd pairings, fatigue is going to be an issue. As mentioned, the gutless ones wont complain unless they bump one in and live to tell about it. The employers will take advantage of it. so, and I hate to say it,, we need the regulator to step i.
The civilian issue ,I agree, is a serious one. The problem stems from two considerations.
Firstly aircrew are subject, not to provinical regulations, but to federal. And many, many , many operators simply believe the federal people have no teeth and that they can abuse employees. It is not unusual to see people getting paid only if they work 30 days a month, at 9 10 hours a day in the north.
The second is that Tc has provide some regulations, which for example say....3 days rest in 30.
Again, there are more than a few operators that interpret this to mean the maximum time off is 3 days....not the minimum
So what it the solution?
First of all the federal labot regulations have to be enforced, and in some cases, tightened up.
Secondly, TC has to redefine their regualtions so operators can not use the opposite of them...that is minimums become maximums and visa versa.
And lastly, pilots have to start standing up for themselves. As a group they are the most spineless people I have ever met. Willing to backstab their own family member if it will get them to the seat of some heavy iron, work for nothing on the rationale that 10 more are lined up to take the no paying job if they dont. And completely unwilling to stand up to a bad employer..Just slink away....my apologies to those who are not included in this.
When people are working nights, away from base, and on odd pairings, fatigue is going to be an issue. As mentioned, the gutless ones wont complain unless they bump one in and live to tell about it. The employers will take advantage of it. so, and I hate to say it,, we need the regulator to step i.
Accident speculation:
Those that post don’t know. Those that know don’t post
Those that post don’t know. Those that know don’t post
-
pilotidentity
- Rank 3
- Posts: 163
- Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:00 am
Re: Interesting Aircrew Fatigue Piece
Employers loose a lot of good pilots from burn out. After working a couple years with not much time off the body runs down, pilots start to complain about things that never bothered them before and they quit. The employer is more than happy that the "complainer" quits.
As Trey Cool points out pilots are spineless - one thing that we CAN do to as a PILOT GROUP is to refuse to extend duty days, even if you do it only once in awhile. Saying you are tired and don't feel it would be safe after 14 hours on the job is really not that unreasonable is it? A lot of pilots don't even ask to get paid for this extension.
As Trey Cool points out pilots are spineless - one thing that we CAN do to as a PILOT GROUP is to refuse to extend duty days, even if you do it only once in awhile. Saying you are tired and don't feel it would be safe after 14 hours on the job is really not that unreasonable is it? A lot of pilots don't even ask to get paid for this extension.
