"No phone calls please!"

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skybaron
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"No phone calls please!"

Post by skybaron » Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:48 pm

Rant.

For all you so-called employers posting ads for employment. . .

GET OVER YOURSELVES!

The "No phone calls" at the end of an advert is just you being your asshole self. Dragging the industry down. Next, you're going to want money from your future applicants (whom you never spoke with) to pay you to work. Imagine that.
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Go Juice
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Go Juice » Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:58 pm

Especially for a job as important as CP. If I'm going to apply for a CP job in the middle of nowhere, I WILL have questions.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Cranium » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:27 pm

As the guy who wound up answering the phone at our shop through my apprenticeship, I actually sympathize with the employers. I would rather read through a resume and answer any questions in a cover letter or during an interview than stop what I'm doing and risk pissing off a PAYING customer just to answer the phone 40 times a day just to answer questions like:

1. "So, um, how much do you pay?"
2. "How much vacation do I get?"
3. "How quickly will I get to left seat?"
4. "Where are you located?"
5. "What kind of planes do you have?"

By the way, the answers are:
1. Not as much as you'd like.
2. Not as much as you'd like.
3. Not as soon as you'd like.
4. Do some research before you apply, dummy!
5. Do some research before you apply, dummy!

(By the way, these were actual questions I was asked on many occasions. The answers are the ones I would've preferred to give, but the one I actually gave was "Send us your resume, and we'll contact you if you are selected for an interview.")
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Brewguy » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:33 pm

A great big +1 to what Cranium wrote.

Obviously neither of you have ever been in a management position - and have never had to hire someone. Every employer, everywhere (not just in the aviation industry) specify how they want to receive information from potential job applicants.

If a job is something you may have even a remote interest in - you throw in a resume. It doesn't do any harm. if and when the employer makes further contact with you, you have ample opportunity to ask your questions then.

A company may only be hiring 1 person, and for that single position, they may receive 600 applications. Many companies do not have a full-time HR person to answer all your unwanted phone calls.

The person reviewing your resume may be doing so on his/her lunch hour every day for a couple of weeks, or staying after work, or taking them home to review after dinner. The person who is doing the hiring may not want to have their real, day-to-day work interrupted by some jack ass who can't read and follow simple directions, so they can answer the same questions over and over and over again.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by iflyforpie » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:21 pm

Well, maybe the no phone calls is a way of weeding out the intelligent. They want people who don't ask questions and will work for anything and under any conditions.

I would not even show up for an interview without knowing pay rate and vacation time, something that you pretty much can't research unless you know somebody who works there.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Golden Pilot » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:23 pm

+2 to Cranium and Brewguy.

I ALWAYS specify that Phone calls are not accepted.

As a full line pilot as well as a manager, I do not need the distraction and interuptions of every prospective aviator, most who do not remotely meet the minimum requirements specified, to bother me during a busy day.

I can read, and discard ones from the likes of Skybaron, and concentrate on good prospects like Brewguy !

Those who can't read, or choose to ignore the request are duly noted, and the resume is trashed upon arrival.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Golden Pilot » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:27 pm

Ifly, those are questions that you can ask If and WHEN the employer calls you for more info.
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teacher
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by teacher » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:04 pm

It's amazing how fast some people forget what it's like to be on the other end of that phone.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Go Juice » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:08 pm

I'm a big shot line pilot and also a manager that's right... I don't have time to talk to you new pilot who's trying to get his first job. I'm too important and too busy for you!

Now good thing I have an F/O to do all my preflight checks and put the tents on... man I'm a captain I don't do that shit anymore...

Love the attitude
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Brewguy » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:09 pm

On which end are you referring to teacher?

I've been on both. And as an applicant, I've always respected the instructions given in a job posting. If it says to mail, I mail. If it says to fax, I fax. If it says not to phone, I don't.

What has always amazed me, is that some people see a job posting, and feels that the company who is hiring owes them anything. Owes them more consideration, or time, than they have any entitlement to.

Submitting an application / resume in no way, shape or form commits you to anything. It's just your way of saying, "Hey, you're hiring? Cool. I may be interested. Call me".
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Golden Pilot » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:27 pm

Go Juice wrote: good thing I have an F/O to do all my preflight checks
I don't fly with a F/O ( what ever that is? ) if that post was aimed at me?

As brewguy says, I am hiring, and I set the rules, you don't like, DON'T APPLY.


And "First Job" ??? No "first timers" fly anywhere near here. Any Ad's I send out specify high experience.
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Last edited by Golden Pilot on Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Bede » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:30 pm

I know where the managers are coming from, but when I did the hiring for a company up north, I always took the time to talk to low time guys and give them tips. It wasn't that long prior that I was on the other end of the phone line.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Doc » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:37 pm

Bede wrote:I know where the managers are coming from, but when I did the hiring for a company up north, I always took the time to talk to low time guys and give them tips. It wasn't that long prior that I was on the other end of the phone line.
Well put. I wouldn't "waste" my time sending a resume to a company who wouldn't "waste" their time to talk to me.
Aviation managers and CP's seem to have some pretty tall horses these days.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Go Juice » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:41 pm

^^^^ + 10 000 000 and 1 beer!
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Mig29
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Mig29 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:00 pm

If you are looking for something (in this case looking for a new employee) then no matter how busy you may be, you should have a decency to answer a phone (if you are around of course and time permitting) to a caller. Just remember, everyone has to start somewhere...

If you think that it's sufficient to hire someone just by looking at the hours in his email, then you are fooling your self, because you may end up employing some complete prick! Unless you are the size of AC or WJ, where it's impossible to answer all the calls, you can spend a few minutes on the phone...

I once flew all the way to YXE and then drove in -41C to Prince Albert to drop in my resume to CP that I spoke to the day before and said I was on my way:) The guy never came to see me, as he was busy, the front desk lady told me.....I waited for few hours and then drove back to catch a flight back home that night....real professional!
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by I Я Instructor » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:13 pm

Ok, so you as the CP just got 600 e-mailed resumes for a job. How do "I" stand out from the crowd? Out of the 600 applicants there are probably 60 that qualify for the job. I very much doubt anyone will spend the time to go through the 600 to find the 60 so... calling to introduce yourself at least gives the CP a name to work with.

Am I wrong?

Alternatively, if you don't qualify for the job and still call I think you should be put on a black list :evil:
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Cat Driver » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:27 pm

Lets examine the original post here.
For all you so-called employers posting ads for employment. . .

GET OVER YOURSELVES!

The "No phone calls" at the end of an advert is just you being your asshole self. Dragging the industry down. Next, you're going to want money from your future applicants (whom you never spoke with) to pay you to work. Imagine that.
Anyone here see a possible attitude problem in the above rant, and would you want someone with that attitude flying for your company??
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2.5milefinal
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by 2.5milefinal » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:35 pm

"Next, you're going to want money from your future applicants"

A long time ago there was a 'START UP' that use to charge 25 bucks to process your resume.
Can you guess what airline? :)
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Go Juice
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Go Juice » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:46 pm

Did they have a big smile for a logo?
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2.5milefinal
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by 2.5milefinal » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:59 pm

Nope.
Hint... they are still flying.
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Golden Pilot » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:09 pm

I Я Instructor wrote: Alternatively, if you don't qualify for the job and still call I think you should be put on a black list :evil:
Great post IR, that's the most common issue that I experience. I have nothing BUT time if a 100 hr guy drops by when I'm at the hangar.
Cat Driver wrote: Anyone here see a possible attitude problem in the above rant, and would you want someone with that attitude flying for your company??



I had that same thought CAT DRIVER :o , and I'd fly your 206 for $300 a day !
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Cat Driver » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:19 pm

and I'd fly your 206 for $300 a day !
No you wouldn't because I would never ever pay under what the position deserves. :mrgreen:

Some may think I am a prick, but no one will ever accuse me of being a cheap prick. :smt040
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by teacher » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:52 pm

Brewguy wrote:On which end are you referring to teacher?

I've been on both. And as an applicant, I've always respected the instructions given in a job posting. If it says to mail, I mail. If it says to fax, I fax. If it says not to phone, I don't.

What has always amazed me, is that some people see a job posting, and feels that the company who is hiring owes them anything. Owes them more consideration, or time, than they have any entitlement to.

Submitting an application / resume in no way, shape or form commits you to anything. It's just your way of saying, "Hey, you're hiring? Cool. I may be interested. Call me".
By other end I mean the applicant. I understand that CPs can be very busy and I'm not saying you should talk to all applicants and low timers begging for work. However it doesn't hurt to put in a little effort though since as the CP in a small company you are probably also the HR department. A simple "Only qualified applicants will be contacted, thank you" might just sound a little better than "NO CALLS".
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by Golden Pilot » Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:38 pm

Cat Driver wrote: I would never ever pay under what the position deserves.
:lol: Point Taken :D
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Re: "No phone calls please!"

Post by mcrit » Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:41 pm

I can see why people get annoyed at the "no phone calls". It isn't very friendly (for lack of a better term). Sadly, sometimes you can't be friendly and survive. Think about the number of low time guys out there that are going to be chasing that job. If they all called, or even a fraction of them called, it could really tie up people at the company.
I'll end by pointing out that in other professions you don't call an employer about a job posting. You send a cover letter & resume, and save your questions for the job interview.
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