August Equip Bid

Discuss topics relating to Jazz Aviation LP.

Moderators: lilfssister, North Shore, ahramin, sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, I WAS Birddog

fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by fish4life »

Babar350 wrote: Tue Aug 20, 2019 4:51 pm Now that AC bid is out Jazz will need lots of pilots if AC needs to fill each GS with 60% of Jazz pilots.

I think Jazz will need to give AC 480 pilots ... ouch
That assuming the 600+ Transat pilots aren’t filling a bunch of them
---------- ADS -----------
 
TSAM
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 98
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:11 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by TSAM »

.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Last edited by TSAM on Wed Apr 08, 2020 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by fish4life »

Not all, but if after the whole shakedown with Transat AC only needs 400 pilots instead of 800 that drops the Jazz requirement to 240. I don’t want people to make a decision assuming AC is going to take almost 500 Jazz pilots next year.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Outlaw58
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:49 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Outlaw58 »

With everything that needs to happen before the sale is finalized, company restructures and unions come to agreement, it is fairly safe to say that AT will continue to operate "as is" for at least another year if not more. Thinking that AT pilots will come in flocks in AC ground school in the next year to fill those bid positions is a bit shortsighted.

Further down the road, maybe but not before then.

58
---------- ADS -----------
 
dhc#
Rank 6
Rank 6
Posts: 424
Joined: Sun May 05, 2013 7:38 am

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by dhc# »

There are many variables, but does anyone have a somewhat accurate "guesstimate" for how many AC will take from Jazz going into 2020 and beyond ??

I get the delayed Jazz bid will detail more but I am curious to what everyone thinks will happen...
---------- ADS -----------
 
av8ts
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 831
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:31 am

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by av8ts »

fish4life wrote: Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:13 pm
Babar350 wrote: Tue Aug 20, 2019 4:51 pm Now that AC bid is out Jazz will need lots of pilots if AC needs to fill each GS with 60% of Jazz pilots.

I think Jazz will need to give AC 480 pilots ... ouch
That assuming the 600+ Transat pilots aren’t filling a bunch of them
I doubt very much that AC will park all the TS planes. Under ACPA rules AC will actually have to hire mores pilots to operate those aircraft
---------- ADS -----------
 
Warden
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 120
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:08 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Warden »

fish4life wrote: Wed Aug 21, 2019 6:30 am Not all, but if after the whole shakedown with Transat AC only needs 400 pilots instead of 800 that drops the Jazz requirement to 240. I don’t want people to make a decision assuming AC is going to take almost 500 Jazz pilots next year.
It's been said clearly by management at AC. The 800+ vacancies posted are needed now, for the planes we have now. The AT pilots are not included with this.

So given the 60%, that's minimum 480 pilots coming from Jazz in the next year to two years. That is going to create a ridiculous amount of movement at Jazz.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Warden
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 120
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:08 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Warden »

dhc# wrote: Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:18 am There are many variables, but does anyone have a somewhat accurate "guesstimate" for how many AC will take from Jazz going into 2020 and beyond ??

I get the delayed Jazz bid will detail more but I am curious to what everyone thinks will happen...
I don't think AC even knows what they themselves will be doing in 2020 and beyond. Things change yearly. I hardly expect anyone to know until the time comes.

There is only one thing that is true. 800+ vacancies just posted yesterday at AC. So that means 480+ pilots from Jazz.
---------- ADS -----------
 
fish4life
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1809
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:32 am

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by fish4life »

Can jazz lose 500 pilots next year ? That’s about 1/3 of the list if I’m not mistaken then, is there even enough FO’s with AA’s to upgrade that many?

This is not a shot at Jazz, I don’t think any of the airlines except maybe WJ or AC have enough right seat experience to backfill CPT spots when 1/3 of the list leaves in a year.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Babar350
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 135
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:36 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Babar350 »

Does Jazz have 480 eligible pilots that would want to flow to AC?
Basically, 480 pilots that have at least 2 years of experience, 2000 TT AND their ATPL...
Unless AC changes the minimum requirements.
---------- ADS -----------
 
User avatar
KenoraPilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 815
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 2:34 pm
Location: Alberta

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by KenoraPilot »

fish4life wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:35 am Can jazz lose 500 pilots next year ? That’s about 1/3 of the list if I’m not mistaken then, is there even enough FO’s with AA’s to upgrade that many?

This is not a shot at Jazz, I don’t think any of the airlines except maybe WJ or AC have enough right seat experience to backfill CPT spots when 1/3 of the list leaves in a year.
Its been discussed that DEC will likely happen by end of 2020.
---------- ADS -----------
 
User avatar
ToolShed
Rank 2
Rank 2
Posts: 54
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:58 am
Location: LINNG

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by ToolShed »

Babar350 wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:03 am Does Jazz have 480 eligible pilots that would want to flow to AC?
Basically, 480 pilots that have at least 2 years of experience, 2000 TT AND their ATPL...
Unless AC changes the minimum requirements.
Minimums highly unlikely.
The flow through ratio will be renegotiated.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Warden
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 120
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:08 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Warden »

ToolShed wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:38 pm
Babar350 wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:03 am Does Jazz have 480 eligible pilots that would want to flow to AC?
Basically, 480 pilots that have at least 2 years of experience, 2000 TT AND their ATPL...
Unless AC changes the minimum requirements.
Minimums highly unlikely.
The flow through ratio will be renegotiated.
No it won't. That's the only reason a 17 year deal got passed.

Jazz will hire DEC before any flow agreements or new hire pay gets changed. I guarantee it.
---------- ADS -----------
 
User avatar
C-GGGQ
Rank (9)
Rank (9)
Posts: 1752
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 12:33 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by C-GGGQ »

The real question is what will the DEC requirements look like, and will they actually find anyone who hasn't already gone on to AC WJ etc?
---------- ADS -----------
 
Babar350
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 135
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:36 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Babar350 »

Exactly, I assume they won't be asking the same requirement for a CRJ Captain position and a Dash8 Captain position ...

Interesting times ahead.
---------- ADS -----------
 
L39Guy
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 222
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2019 10:04 pm
Location: Canada

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by L39Guy »

ToolShed wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:38 pm
Babar350 wrote: Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:03 am Does Jazz have 480 eligible pilots that would want to flow to AC?
Basically, 480 pilots that have at least 2 years of experience, 2000 TT AND their ATPL...
Unless AC changes the minimum requirements.
Minimums highly unlikely.
The flow through ratio will be renegotiated.
A deferred seniority number at AC is a likely solution...you get an AC seniority number when you are eligible, interviewed and required. One stays at Jazz longer to allow Jazz to manage the mainline move-up but when you do go to AC you get the seniority number you would have got had you gone when originally called. This would have to be clearly explained to all of the OTS new-hires during the hiring process.
---------- ADS -----------
 
Babar350
Rank 3
Rank 3
Posts: 135
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:36 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Babar350 »

The deferred seniority doesn't solve the drop in salary from the 4 first year when one flows from Jazz Captain to AC FO.

Lots of solutions...
---------- ADS -----------
 
Outlaw58
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:49 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Outlaw58 »

No equipment bid in the fall....

58
---------- ADS -----------
 
User avatar
KenoraPilot
Rank 8
Rank 8
Posts: 815
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 2:34 pm
Location: Alberta

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by KenoraPilot »

Next equipment/position bid Jan 2020.
Lots of backfills though the way it sounds. The backfills will be done next week from the ESB. Sounds like quite a few CA and FO positions available.
Also GGN Pilots from MOS4 are to begin training in October
Expecting Jan 2020 bid to be "large & expansive"
---------- ADS -----------
 
Outlaw58
Rank 4
Rank 4
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:49 pm

Re: August Equip Bid

Post by Outlaw58 »

KenoraPilot wrote: Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:35 pm Expecting Jan 2020 bid to be "large & expansive"
Understatement? LOL :)

58
---------- ADS -----------
 
Post Reply

Return to “Jazz Aviation LP - Air Canada Express”