RV-8

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Strega
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Re: RV-8

Post by Strega » Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:29 am

If you buy a left hand turning engine, why not just change the camshaft?
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Re: RV-8

Post by Mapleflt » Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:42 am

If thats the best cost effect option yes, go for it especially if one has chosen to rebuilt their own engine also.
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Re: RV-8

Post by Adam Oke » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:09 am

Here's an update on my project. I've got lots to do yet. I'm still deciding on a primer before I go to town bucking rivets.

Horizontal Stab
Image

Vertical Stab
Image
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Re: RV-8

Post by BoostedNihilist » Thu Jan 14, 2010 11:55 am

Adam, looks awesome!! must be fun! Looking forward to more pics of your progress..
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Re: RV-8

Post by AEROBAT » Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:13 am

Strega wrote:If you buy a left hand turning engine, why not just change the camshaft?

Strega,

I could be wrong but don't you have to change the mags as well?
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Re: RV-8

Post by Strega » Sat Jan 16, 2010 6:33 pm

yes..

The mags will need to be changed to the opposite rotation as well,,

Although, if you are overhauling it anyway, it wont add any expense.

Just thought of something else, the oil pump and accesorie case might be different on the L engine as well...

Id have to look at the ipc ..

nonetheless,, I still think you could do it way cheaper, as the L engines are quite abit cheaper than the normal unit.
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Re: RV-8

Post by Mapleflt » Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:09 am

After a bit of research and consideration I believe Straga has hit on a great option for the homebuilder. I would look for a complete removal and purchase all the accessories; don't forget the propeller, with the engine. It will also add a unique feature to the final product without any operational issues, assuming the operator (pilot) understands how to use the rudder pedals.
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Re: RV-8

Post by GoinNowhereFast » Tue Sep 14, 2010 12:06 pm

I'm not sure about the RV-8, but most singles off-set the vertical stab to counteract the torque of a right turning engine. Using a left turning engine would require lots of rudder input in cruise, and possible control problems at slow speed.
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Re: RV-8

Post by structurespilot » Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:59 pm

Hello I just thought I'd give you my two cents. I've built an RV 7 for Van's. I built a quick build for the factory in oregon as a Canadian trial experiment. In the end the dollar rising killed me and I couldn't compete with the paso. My current career is as a structures AME in YYC, but I also have a Commercial MIFR, and I tow banner on the side for extra cash.
I would be happy to answer any question you have about structures, especially Van's Aircraft. Van's does a great job of keeping the drawings, etc. in laymans terms, but you might come across something you are wondering about.
If I were building, I would chose FP prop. Less maintenance, less cost to purchase, and send for rebuild when due. Less money buy leaps and bounds, for sure. Do a little digging and you will soon agree. Well if performance was all you wanted you would be building a Harmon Rocket, Van's is all about the best comprimise, and best bang for your buck right?
Have fun, and enjoy the building process, hope to hear from you. Let me know how you are doing.

Norm..
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Re: RV-8

Post by Rudder Bug » Tue Feb 01, 2011 2:59 pm

Awesome Adam, congrats!

Please keep them coming as you are progressing. I have abandoned my VJ-22 Volmer amphib project when I acquired a Tri-Pacer. Two years later I still give her a whole lotta love. Just done with a new interior. Now I'll tell you what: a sewing machine is the greatest invention of all times!

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Post by Beefitarian » Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:43 am

Did you pick a primer?
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Re:

Post by Adam Oke » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:45 pm

Beefitarian wrote:Did you pick a primer?
I've got some more time and money to pound away at the project again. NAPA 7220 Self Etching Rattle Can Primer -- Any thoughts anyone? Between that and some Sherwin Williams Self etching, they both seem very common.
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Re: RV-8

Post by Mapleflt » Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:46 pm

Any pictures of your progress, just because I am VERY jealous and living vicariously thru YOU
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Re: RV-8

Post by Adam Oke » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:03 pm

Update:

I have the entire tail built, less the trim tab. I wanted to build riblets instead of just bending the sides down on the trim tab. Plans call to bend the sides and install blind rivets. The bending looks like a pain in the ass to get right, and a lot of builders are opting to install riblets. I think I will just order some....now I have an excuse to put the order in...

So right now, I just need to tear everything apart, debur, dimple, and prime. I'm starting with the horizontal stab.

I did some dimpling on the horizontal stab and started on the left hand side. For some stupid reason I was dimpling the for and aft spar web, including the flange attach points on the ribs. Call outs are for blind rivets .... not flush! Well, that mistake cost me $120, but now I can buy those riblets.

I'm finally jumping into the priming scene. Here is a pic of the right horizontal stab interior structure. The primer looks great and dry's extremely fast. I will let it cure for a few days before I start assembly for riveting. A couple runs here and there, but I have never really primed/painted anything. Not that you will see it anyways. I think I am applying a little heavy though, as it should just be a light dusting.

Image

Here is some more food for thought that I am now seriously considering! I would like some input from you guys on the Rotec R3600 engine. I know this is the extreme other end of my initial thoughts on the engine but this idea is really swaying my thoughts. There is a guy that is doing a spectacular job on experimenting with the nine cylinder R3600 radial on an RV-8. The numbers should be close to the 150HP O-320, but I would suspect slightly slower with the draggy nose. This guy plans on producing radial conversion kits in the latter parts of 2012, so it will for sure be available by the time I get around to engine hanging.

The R3600 (new) comes with all accessories and is about the same price as a O-320 less accessories (new). As it stands right now, the R3600 was launched in 2000 and they come with a recommended 1000hr TBO. You can say you blow over the 1000hr mark no problem, and they plan on upping the TBO in the near future, but only once more data from customers comes in. Apparently overhauls are significantly cheaper than the Lycoming O-320 as well. I still have to do some more research and see if you can have options like a constant speed propeller. I really do not know much about the Rotec engines so any insight from the avcan crew would be great.

The only downside is speed and potentially no option for a contant speed prop. I like how unique it is, the potential savings even for a new engine, I like the idea of sipping fuel and making noise!

Anyways, here is a picture to drool on and check out the facebook page below.

Image

https://www.facebook.com/radialconversions

Image
http://www.rotecradialengines.com/0RotecR3600/R3600.htm

So....what do you think of that sexy beast?!
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Post by Beefitarian » Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:05 pm

I love that engine. Here's a thread on another forum by a guy running one in a Sopwith Pup replica. It quit him once but the discussion came to the conclusion he had some carb ice. I don't know if he has any way to produce carb heat. I would be trying to figure out a way to have carb heat in an carborated airplane engine personally.

So anyway there's a bunch of WW I replica guys running these on that forum so they chat about it lots.

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/repli ... h-pup.html
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Re: RV-8

Post by Rudder Bug » Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:29 pm

What a beautiful engine Adam. It wil certainly make your RV very attractive and a one, well, a two of a kind!

Regarding your painting, just MIST a very, very, very, very, very THIN coat at a time. Talk to yourself and resist the temptation to ovespray. After a few coats, (read SEVERAL), you'll see it becoming more and more glossy, with no runnings at all. You will get to a point where the item will appear wet; that's when you are done.

Remember, the best way to save a lot of time is to TAKE YOUR TIME! You probably already found by now that sanding some runnings is no fun and time consuming.

Painting will get easy and fun if you stick to that rule.

I like your "box" setup, you're doing real good!

Gilles

P.S.: TAKE YOUR TIME!
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Re: RV-8

Post by Big Pistons Forever » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:08 pm

Adam Oke wrote:Update:

I have the entire tail built, less the trim tab. I wanted to build riblets instead of just bending the sides down on the trim tab. Plans call to bend the sides and install blind rivets. The bending looks like a pain in the ass to get right, and a lot of builders are opting to install riblets. I think I will just order some....now I have an excuse to put the order in...

So right now, I just need to tear everything apart, debur, dimple, and prime. I'm starting with the horizontal stab.

I did some dimpling on the horizontal stab and started on the left hand side. For some stupid reason I was dimpling the for and aft spar web, including the flange attach points on the ribs. Call outs are for blind rivets .... not flush! Well, that mistake cost me $120, but now I can buy those riblets.

I'm finally jumping into the priming scene. Here is a pic of the right horizontal stab interior structure. The primer looks great and dry's extremely fast. I will let it cure for a few days before I start assembly for riveting. A couple runs here and there, but I have never really primed/painted anything. Not that you will see it anyways. I think I am applying a little heavy though, as it should just be a light dusting.

Image

Here is some more food for thought that I am now seriously considering! I would like some input from you guys on the Rotec R3600 engine. I know this is the extreme other end of my initial thoughts on the engine but this idea is really swaying my thoughts. There is a guy that is doing a spectacular job on experimenting with the nine cylinder R3600 radial on an RV-8. The numbers should be close to the 150HP O-320, but I would suspect slightly slower with the draggy nose. This guy plans on producing radial conversion kits in the latter parts of 2012, so it will for sure be available by the time I get around to engine hanging.

The R3600 (new) comes with all accessories and is about the same price as a O-320 less accessories (new). As it stands right now, the R3600 was launched in 2000 and they come with a recommended 1000hr TBO. You can say you blow over the 1000hr mark no problem, and they plan on upping the TBO in the near future, but only once more data from customers comes in. Apparently overhauls are significantly cheaper than the Lycoming O-320 as well. I still have to do some more research and see if you can have options like a constant speed propeller. I really do not know much about the Rotec engines so any insight from the avcan crew would be great.

The only downside is speed and potentially no option for a contant speed prop. I like how unique it is, the potential savings even for a new engine, I like the idea of sipping fuel and making noise!

Anyways, here is a picture to drool on and check out the facebook page below.

Image

https://www.facebook.com/radialconversions

Image
http://www.rotecradialengines.com/0RotecR3600/R3600.htm

So....what do you think of that sexy beast?!
Too bad they don't make a twin row version........
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Re: RV-8

Post by Strega » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:30 am

I would use this engine,, perhaps on a cub or some other slow aircraft.. but not on an RV

Keep it lycoming... simple, easy, and they dont quit..
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Re: RV-8

Post by Beefitarian » Sat Dec 24, 2011 9:37 pm

AEROBAT wrote:
Strega wrote:If you buy a left hand turning engine, why not just change the camshaft?

Strega,

I could be wrong but don't you have to change the mags as well?
I'm having a tasty single malt here so I may owe everyone apologies later but... If it's the same as my gear driven reverse rotational cam shaft modification in a small block chevy, you only need to change the drive gear so the mags still turn the same direction. Any AME dudes care to jump in?
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Re: RV-8

Post by GoinNowhereFast » Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:30 pm

Big Pistons Forever wrote:Too bad they don't make a twin row version........
Make a double row with the 7 cyl R2800 110hp engine. 14 cylinders and ~200hp. That's closer to the power that an RV8 should have.
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Re: RV-8

Post by Adam Oke » Thu Mar 01, 2012 7:29 pm

Here is an update for those who have been following my build. The horizontal and vertical stab are both built and ready for the MD-RA preclose inspection. Thanks to all those interested and wanting updates! Now I'll have to wait until I get back from a forestry contract before I can start priming and riveting the rudder. Does it ever feel good to hit milestones like this, where it actually looks like airplane parts. :D

Image
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Re: RV-8

Post by rapid602 » Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:31 am

I am very happy for your build, I saw an RV in CYKF and wanted to go and hold it, it looked so cute.

Something to think about, my uncle and his buddy each built the same airplane and together.NOT AN RV I THINK STARLET) Just as easy to build two planes as one. They could not decide on which engines to use. My uncle used a conventional engine and his buddy (I think used a Rotax or something similar) The results were distastorus. The aircraft with the NON conventional engine had many many many problems. The Aircraft they built was a Starlet. ( I THINK)

The point here is go and speak with the factory, or some guys who have been around these RV's for a while. An experienced builder will usually give great advice about WHAT NOT TO DO, OR WHAT HE WOULD DO DIFFERENT. I am not telling you what to put in it, here but THAT AIRCRAFT WAS DESIGNED TO RUN BEST WITH ONE OR TWO ENGINES, and I would not differ too far off the beaten path on that or you start to create more problems for yourself.

The key to building any aircraft and picking which, engine and prop, and instrumnets should be, reliability reliability, weight and cost. Remember if you built it light enough, it will go fast enough. But ten pounds here and 5 pounds there and pretty soon there is 50 pounds that you don't have to accelerate to take off speed and fly around the sky.

Hope this was some food for thought.
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Re: RV-8

Post by Beefitarian » Mon Aug 06, 2012 5:25 pm

Big Pistons Forever wrote:
Adam Oke wrote: http://www.rotecradialengines.com/0RotecR3600/R3600.htm

So....what do you think of that sexy beast?!
Too bad they don't make a twin row version........
Finance the first one and he would. You might even be able to get a royalty deal.

I spent quite a while loitering in the tent with Paul. I love his engines. He claims only one has ever quit so far and is cranky about it because he was able to say none before that one. You can run them on MoGas and he will zero time them for $5000us. I'll bring you some pictures later.
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Post by Beefitarian » Wed Aug 08, 2012 12:25 pm

Here some pictures of his parts table at Osh a couple days after they got soaked by the rain that came through and wind that nearly blew the tent away.

Check out the client projects page. There's a guy putting the 7 cylinder units into motorcycle choppers.

http://www.rotecengines.com/ProjectTable.html
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Re: RV-8

Post by Taiser » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:35 pm

I love the ROTEC, even thought about getting one a while back but I figured it would be too tough to get parts for especially in my area. You'd think ROTEC would try to get the rust off the parts they are displaying at Osh... unless that's dirt... :smt104
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