Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

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faculties11
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Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by faculties11 » Sat Feb 02, 2019 12:45 am

As the title states I'm sitting at 1000+ hrs.

Trying to figure out the next move.
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Adam Oke
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Adam Oke » Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:53 am

Yes. I know of a few that were hired sub 1000 with a Class IV.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by faculties11 » Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:18 am

Adam Oke wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:53 am
Yes. I know of a few that were hired sub 1000 with a Class IV.
Were these instructors out of flight college programs with an agreement with Jazz Aviation LP?

I'm a career changer a little on the mature side. Is there any hiring currently going on at the moment with Jazz? Last I heard there was surplus of staff but was just a rumour...
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by rudder » Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:50 am

faculties11 wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:18 am

Were these instructors out of flight college programs with an agreement with Jazz Aviation LP?

I'm a career changer a little on the mature side. Is there any hiring currently going on at the moment with Jazz? Last I heard there was surplus of staff but was just a rumour...
Jazz will be hiring hundreds per year for 2019/2020 for attrition to AC/other airlines/retirements/training.

Best guess hiring 250 in 2019. Hiring 300 in 2020.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Canoehead » Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:01 am

Adam Oke wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:53 am
Yes. I know of a few that were hired sub 1000 with a Class IV.
You also need 250 multi. Under 1000 with no multi will not be given serious consideration.
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faculties11
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by faculties11 » Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:17 am

Canoehead wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:01 am
Adam Oke wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:53 am
Yes. I know of a few that were hired sub 1000 with a Class IV.
You also need 250 multi. Under 1000 with no multi will not be given serious consideration.
Interesting - are they not picking up guys with 250 hours TT right out of college/University programs? I'm off the street so to speak, guess that "waiver" doesn't apply to me?
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by rudder » Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:23 am

Here is the drill.

Jazz has published minimum experience hiring requirements. These do NOT apply to applicants from accredited college/university flying programs (effectively waived at Jazz discretion).

Jazz trains these pilots to fly airliners in an airline environment (multi-crew/SOP/Part 705 Ops/high density and high level airspace).

Once qualified (ATPL) they apply to AC. AC is basically hiring right out of college but uses Jazz as the ab initio training facility.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by faculties11 » Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:29 am

rudder wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:23 am
Here is the drill.

Jazz has published minimum experience hiring requirements. These do NOT apply to applicants from accredited college/university flying programs (effectively waived at Jazz discretion).

Jazz trains these pilots to fly airliners in an airline environment (multi-crew/SOP/Part 705 Ops/high density and high level airspace).

Once qualified (ATPL) they apply to AC. AC is basically hiring right out of college but uses Jazz as the ab initio training facility.
Thanks rudder.

Preferences as per the job description:

Preference will be given to candidates with qualifications beyond the basic requirements:
Applicants who possess a Canadian ATPL.
Applicants with two crew multi-engine turbine experience.
Graduates from an Aviation College degree or diploma program.
Applicants with commercial or military flight experience.
Applicants with Flight Management System (FMS) and/or glass cockpit experience.
Internal Jazz referral.

I submitted my application regardless. I don't have any internal references. If anyone wants a free beer at Arizona's, let me know. :lol:
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Mrbobmarly111 » Sat Feb 02, 2019 3:10 pm

I have a very very close friend who is involved with the hiring process. And I know for a Fact they have hired people with less than 500 hours and no post secondary education. They Did not have any multi time other than required for their license.

Here is my advice APPPPPPPLLLLLLLLYYYYYYY!!!!!!! worst that happens is you dont get a invite to a interview.

Also on a second note I know they track how many times you've applied for so if you meet the requirements to apply according to the job posting just put your name in.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by hsilgnepilot » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:12 am

1000 hours and 100 multi and you shouldn't have an issue
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Hilroy » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:54 am

Just curious how they can prefer people with no commercial experience vs someone with at least some experience...
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by V1Vr » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:03 am

Hilroy wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:54 am
Just curious how they can prefer people with no commercial experience vs someone with at least some experience...
Because at the end of the day you're just a number. Pretty much anyone can make it a Jazz training program. Is it right? No, but it's reality.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Canoehead » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:20 pm

V1Vr wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:03 am
Pretty much anyone can make it a Jazz training program. Is it right? No, but it's reality.
What do you mean?!
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by V1Vr » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:56 pm

Canoehead wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:20 pm
V1Vr wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:03 am
Pretty much anyone can make it a Jazz training program. Is it right? No, but it's reality.
What do you mean?!
That the reality is the most of the new hires are young and inexperienced.

I was responding to someone who said

"Just curious how they can prefer people with no commercial experience vs someone with at least some experience..."
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by MrTurbine » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:25 pm

V1Vr wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:56 pm
Canoehead wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:20 pm
V1Vr wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:03 am
Pretty much anyone can make it a Jazz training program. Is it right? No, but it's reality.
What do you mean?!
That the reality is the most of the new hires are young and inexperienced.

I was responding to someone who said

"Just curious how they can prefer people with no commercial experience vs someone with at least some experience..."
Kinda funny the era we live in. Flight Instructors with less than 1000 hours coming and telling us that they are experienced pilots , and deserve a job.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by MarkyMark90 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:09 pm

I would still prefer having a guy that flew in the north for only 100 hours than having a 1500 hr instructor...
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by lownslow » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:22 pm

faculties11 wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 12:45 am
Will Jazz hire with instructing time only?
Probably, but you'll more than likely be outwardly boring and inwardly miserable so consider going on some sort of adventure outside of driving a bus for poverty wage first.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by HansDietrich » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:22 am

MarkyMark90 wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:09 pm
I would still prefer having a guy that flew in the north for only 100 hours than having a 1500 hr instructor...
Oh come on. 100 hrs? That's not even enough to learn the aircraft. I do agree with you, from a flying experience point of view, instructors bring very little value to a two crew, IFR, high performance environment. Those who have instructed love to claim that their experience is extremely valuable, which at first it isn't. Sure, once you fly for a few years then decided to get into the training department, it may come into use, but from my experience, flying with those that have instructed was always the worst. You may have been "god" to the poor 10 hr PPL student, but you're nothing but an inexperienced arrogant piece of sh*t in a two crew environment. It's their attitude I have an issue with.

Love it or hate it, working up North, starting out on the ramp, "paying your dues" makes you a humble(er) person. That's the number one reason I like people that have flown up North. You can spot them a mile away. They're not arrogant, condescending jerks toward their fellow workers.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Aviatard » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:51 am

HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:22 am
you're nothing but an inexperienced arrogant piece of sh*t
Only experienced arrogant pieces of sh*t need apply then?
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by HansDietrich » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:55 am

Aviatard wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:51 am
HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:22 am
you're nothing but an inexperienced arrogant piece of sh*t
Only experienced arrogant pieces of sh*t need apply then?
If I'd have it my way, and worked for Jazz HR, every resume with "Instructor Time" only would automatically go to the garbage; not even the shredder. It's not worth the electricity wasted. Seneca graduates are miles ahead of these individuals; experience and attitude.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Maple_30 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:16 am

HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:55 am
Aviatard wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:51 am
HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:22 am
you're nothing but an inexperienced arrogant piece of sh*t
Only experienced arrogant pieces of sh*t need apply then?
If I'd have it my way, and worked for Jazz HR, every resume with "Instructor Time" only would automatically go to the garbage; not even the shredder. It's not worth the electricity wasted. Seneca graduates are miles ahead of these individuals; experience and attitude.
I usually never post here - but seeing this kind of comment is simply disgusting.
How could you say that every individual who instructed is a piece of s***? :shock:
Like do you know personally every flight instructor in Canada?
Literally, who do you think you are to judge somebody because of a line on a resume?

I am a flight instructor and I definetely agree with the fact that instructing hours are NOT real-world experience. But it still is time spent in an airplane with decision-making that has to be done most of the time. Some flight instructors can be very arrogant with the sh*ttiest attiude ever, I agree with that, like any pilot, but I also know PLENTY of flight instructors that are outstanding pilots with a great attitude. Judging somebody based on the fact that he/she was a flight instructor without knowing that person is simply a joke, and I honestly wouldn't even take anything seriously from a person who thinks that. Like, wow ...

Good thing you're not an HR person!
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by HansDietrich » Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:18 am

Maple_30 wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:16 am
HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:55 am
Aviatard wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:51 am


Only experienced arrogant pieces of sh*t need apply then?
If I'd have it my way, and worked for Jazz HR, every resume with "Instructor Time" only would automatically go to the garbage; not even the shredder. It's not worth the electricity wasted. Seneca graduates are miles ahead of these individuals; experience and attitude.
I usually never post here - but seeing this kind of comment is simply disgusting.
How could you say that every individual who instructed is a piece of s***? :shock:
Like do you know personally every flight instructor in Canada?
Literally, who do you think you are to judge somebody because of a line on a resume?

I am a flight instructor and I definetely agree with the fact that instructing hours are NOT real-world experience. But it still is time spent in an airplane with decision-making that has to be done most of the time. Some flight instructors can be very arrogant with the sh*ttiest attiude ever, I agree with that, like any pilot, but I also know PLENTY of flight instructors that are outstanding pilots with a great attitude. Judging somebody based on the fact that he/she was a flight instructor without knowing that person is simply a joke, and I honestly wouldn't even take anything seriously from a person who thinks that. Like, wow ...

Good thing you're not an HR person!
It is disgusting. Indeed my comment is not nice, however please quote me where I said "Every instructor is a piece of ______". I've never said that. You're twisting my comments.

It's my personal experience, the MAJORITY of instructors I've flown with were arrogant individuals that presume they're above everyone else. I'm not sure where this type of character develops, but from the many I've met, these were the ones that

1. Thought were "too good" to throw bags up North or have a job that's "beneath them".
2. They somehow have superior knowledge to the rest of us.
3. Instructed just to get hours, very few giving an actual **** about their students.
4. Somehow got their ATPL flying VFR circuits... (That still boggles my mind, but that's something that TC needs to change)

So yes, as a general rule, I would not hire instructors. It's too much of a risk. I'd even dare say in the high 80s (percentile) of individuals that I'd never work with.
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Last edited by HansDietrich on Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by mixturerich » Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:58 pm

Really sticking to your guns hey? Are you trying to make enemies with everyone on this site? Seems like you’re a regular poster who knows better than any pilot or manager out there. You’re sure opinionated!
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by yhz41 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:20 pm

Maple_30 wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:16 am
HansDietrich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:55 am
Aviatard wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:51 am


Only experienced arrogant pieces of sh*t need apply then?
If I'd have it my way, and worked for Jazz HR, every resume with "Instructor Time" only would automatically go to the garbage; not even the shredder. It's not worth the electricity wasted. Seneca graduates are miles ahead of these individuals; experience and attitude.
I usually never post here - but seeing this kind of comment is simply disgusting.
How could you say that every individual who instructed is a piece of s***? :shock:
Like do you know personally every flight instructor in Canada?
Literally, who do you think you are to judge somebody because of a line on a resume?

I am a flight instructor and I definetely agree with the fact that instructing hours are NOT real-world experience. But it still is time spent in an airplane with decision-making that has to be done most of the time. Some flight instructors can be very arrogant with the sh*ttiest attiude ever, I agree with that, like any pilot, but I also know PLENTY of flight instructors that are outstanding pilots with a great attitude. Judging somebody based on the fact that he/she was a flight instructor without knowing that person is simply a joke, and I honestly wouldn't even take anything seriously from a person who thinks that. Like, wow ...

Good thing you're not an HR person!
Dont worry man, Hans is just one of those people who is miserable about absolutely everything. He also cant quite seem to let go of a company he swears up and down he hates. Get on with your life. If the instructors want to be at jazz let them be at jazz. They'll certainly appreciate it unlike some people.
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Re: Wil Jazz hire with instructing time only?

Post by Outlaw58 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:28 pm

mixturerich wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:58 pm
Really sticking to your guns hey? Are you trying to make enemies with everyone on this site? Seems like you’re a regular poster who knows better than any pilot or manager out there. You’re sure opinionated!
Dunning-Kruger maybe? ;)

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