Sukhoi Superjet on fire Moscow

[Jet Jockey]

I don’t know pelmet and I don’t know how he is trying to convey his message but I tell you what...

If someone is stupid enough in a situation like this one to delay people from an evacuation by blocking the alley or exit point because he is retrieving his bagage in the overhead bin, then I can assure if I was a passenger behind him I would go through him like a hot knife goes through butter.

Anyone seen carrying luggage off an aircraft during or after an emergency evac is ordered should be procecuted.

[digits_]

Was the bounced cause by the emergency, or did the bounce create the emergency?

[pelmet]

Inside cabin footage here....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KwTpGLK ... e=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYizjxuUiEM

And now for advice on evacuating in a situation like this(being in the back of the aircraft with major fire outside all around while still moving). If you are in the rear.....

...you are where people are going to die, just like the British Airtours 737 in Manchester with the engine fire The rear exits cannot be used due to flames and there is a huge traffic jam with panicky people blocking any movement.

There are no guarantees, but you start your evacuation during the rollout if you see flames like this. Everyone else will be sitting, frozen in fear while the aircraft is decelerating. Once it stops, it almost everyone will get up, jam up, and you are stuck. So while the aircraft is still moving, release your seat belt, climb over people as required, run forward out of the external fire zone which will soon be the internal smoke zone.

Of course, maybe you will die because you released your seatbelt and there was a sudden stop and everyone else survives, no guarantees.

By the way, if during a critical fire situation like this where it is obvious that seconds count), you encounter someone blocking you as they try to get their overhead baggage, hit them in the face as hard as you can with all your adrenaline strength, so they fall down and let them get trampled instead of them killing you and others by delaying evacuation.

That's my plan anyways. Feel free to remain seated until the evac alarm sounds, it keeps the aisle clear for me.

I'm guessing if this accident happened in Canada, there is no way you'd post this callous post right after multiple people were burned alive. Too bad for them, right?

This is why I have zero respect for you. Cold, poor taste and timing, regardless of the point about people stupidly getting their carry on bag. Yeah. We get it.

This isn't educational. Doesn't help Crew with how to better handle an in flight fire.

And before you whine to the mods --- again ---

If the mods want to ban me for saying this, go right ahead.

Oh, oh. Based on the replies, it looks like I may have discovered some of the people that are the type to block escape from a burning aircraft due to retrieving their valuables. Sorry boys, you are getting a fist in the face if you block me in such a situation, hopefully enough to knock you down.

By the way, those who have no words, or no respect for me, or are blocking me might want to read this article about the Moscow tragedy.....

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/r ... 34976.html

It has the quote..."Passengers were also accused of delaying the evacuation of the burning plane by reaching into the overhead compartments to retrieve their belongings"

"The Interfax news agency cited an unnamed "informed source" as saying the evacuation of the plane had been delayed by some passengers insisting on collecting their hand luggage first."

So to all other folks remember, these characters on the forum badmouthing me will result in your death in such a situation. You have seconds to escape. My advice can save your life. Their advice, as has been seen in multiple different discussions, on multiple subjects(where no more than insults are typically given and has resulted in warnings from the mods for two of them) results in much worse for you.

Be careful who you take your advice from.

[pelmet]

Cold, poor taste and timing, regardless of the point about people stupidly getting their carry on bag.

This isn't educational. Doesn't help Crew with how to better handle an in flight fire.

I don’t know pelmet and I don’t know how he is trying to convey his message but I tell you what...

If someone is stupid enough in a situation like this one to delay people from an evacuation by blocking the alley or exit point because he is retrieving his bagage in the overhead bin, then I can assure if I was a passenger behind him I would go through him like a hot knife goes through butter.

Anyone seen carrying luggage off an aircraft during or after an emergency evac is ordered should be procecuted.

The article below discusses three accidents where an aircraft is literally on fire and people are risking lives to get their beloved baggage. It is a reality that won't change. Therefore one might want to consider what they will do when blocked unnecessarily in a critical, life threatening situation. Time for politeness to end. Today actually is the right timing to discuss the subject. One has to be cold about it and it has absolutely nothing to do with how the crew is handling an in-flight fire. It is how to save your life during a ground evacuation.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... on-450122/

[rookiepilot]

Oh, oh. Based on the replies, it looks like I may have discovered some of the people that are the type to block escape from a burning aircraft due to retrieving their valuables. Sorry boys, you are getting a fist in the face if you block me in such a situation, hopefully enough to knock you down.

By the way, those who have no words, or no respect for me, or are blocking me might want to read this article about the Moscow tragedy.....

So to all other folks remember, these characters on the forum badmouthing me will result in your death in such a situation. You have seconds to escape. My advice can save your life. Their advice, as has been seen in multiple different discussions, on multiple subjects(where no more than insults are typically given and has resulted in warnings from the mods for two of them) results in much worse for you.

Such arrogance in these trolling comments, trying to defend your own callousness. Step over children as you fight your way off.

I don't think anyone remotely professional here; supports for one second risking anyone's life by getting their stuff.

Reports FWIW says the cabin was evacuated in 55 seconds.

Easy solution: Lockable overhead bins. Case closed.

Sorry all, I can only hear the screaming........

[pelmet]

Oh, oh. Based on the replies, it looks like I may have discovered some of the people that are the type to block escape from a burning aircraft due to retrieving their valuables. Sorry boys, you are getting a fist in the face if you block me in such a situation, hopefully enough to knock you down.

By the way, those who have no words, or no respect for me, or are blocking me might want to read this article about the Moscow tragedy.....

So to all other folks remember, these characters on the forum badmouthing me will result in your death in such a situation. You have seconds to escape. My advice can save your life. Their advice, as has been seen in multiple different discussions, on multiple subjects(where no more than insults are typically given and has resulted in warnings from the mods for two of them) results in much worse for you.

Such arrogance in these trolling comments, trying to defend your own callousness. Step over children as you fight your way off.

I don't think anyone remotely professional here; supports for one second risking anyone's life by getting their stuff.

Reports FWIW says the cabin was evacuated in 55 seconds.

Easy solution: Lockable overhead bins. Case closed.

Sorry all, I can only hear the screaming........

Sorry, it isn't children reaching into the overhead bin and blocking people. Too short. It is grown adults, worried about their cheap duty-free items, etc.

The cabin was not evacuated in 55 seconds. The dead people might very well still be in the cabin and it is quite possible some are dead because of the baggage blockers.

The lockable bins idea has been proposed already. Perhaps it will happen but it won't be a consideration for years to come. My advice is for the reality of today. Case still open.

[Ki-ll]

Was the bounced cause by the emergency, or did the bounce create the emergency?

Supposedly there is an interview with the captain of this flight. He said there was a lightning strike followed by airplane flight control law changing to direct with no protections, similar to Airbus. I looked up the procedure in the QRH, some fuel penalties apply, airplane should be controlled smoothly. He also said the REF speed was out of the book and he doesn’t know why the airplane bounced and burst into flames.

[rookiepilot]

Wow. I have no words Pelmet.

That’s ah... no words.

I have him blocked for just such reasons.

Endorse.

[jakeandelwood]

Easy solution: Lockable overhead bins. Case closed.



That's the perfect idea, the overhead bins get locked at the start of the descent and they aren't unlocked till the aircraft is safely stopped at the terminal. This could be done with electro-mechanical locks controlled from a panel by the flight attendant

[rookiepilot]

Easy solution: Lockable overhead bins. Case closed.

That's the perfect idea, the overhead bins get locked at the start of the descent and they aren't unlocked till the aircraft is safely stopped at the terminal. This could be done with electro-mechanical locks controlled from a panel by the flight attendant

Seems slightly more reasonable compared to the other solutions posted.

I'm curious on this little detail in your scenario, Pelmet:

While you're punching out the one doofus blocking your aisle, so he falls and gets trampled by you; how do the little kids, elderly and disabled, trapped at the back of the burning aircraft, get out now that you've permanently blocked the aisle with the 2 or three guys -- or women -- laying there you've cold - cocked?

Or is that not your problem as a "professional pilot"?

[Meatservo]

Was the bounced cause by the emergency, or did the bounce create the emergency?

Supposedly there is an interview with the captain of this flight. He said there was a lightning strike followed by airplane flight control law changing to direct with no protections, similar to Airbus. I looked up the procedure in the QRH, some fuel penalties apply, airplane should be controlled smoothly. He also said the REF speed was out of the book and he doesn’t know why the airplane bounced and burst into flames.

So of course I'm indulging myself in some armchair-aviating, but I really, really hope this whole scenario didn't turn from an abnormal procedure into a flaming fireball just because the pilots weren't able to properly handle the plane once the "protections" weren't available. I'm reluctant to come to that conclusion until the effects of this lightning-strike are known -but I find myself hoping that it crippled the controls in some way that made handling the aircraft more difficult than just a lower level of automation. For the sake of the pilots' consciences as well as the reputation of our profession. If some of you guys find this callous, remember the dead are already dead, and context matters in the aftermath.

[Ki-ll]

Was the bounced cause by the emergency, or did the bounce create the emergency?

Supposedly there is an interview with the captain of this flight. He said there was a lightning strike followed by airplane flight control law changing to direct with no protections, similar to Airbus. I looked up the procedure in the QRH, some fuel penalties apply, airplane should be controlled smoothly. He also said the REF speed was out of the book and he doesn’t know why the airplane bounced and burst into flames.

So of course I'm indulging myself in some armchair-aviating, but I really, really hope this whole scenario didn't turn from an abnormal procedure into a flaming fireball just because the pilots weren't able to properly handle the plane once the "protections" weren't available. I'm reluctant to come to that conclusion until the effects of this lightning-strike are known -but I find myself hoping that it crippled the controls in some way that made handling the aircraft more difficult than just a lower level of automation. For the sake of the pilots' consciences as well as the reputation of our profession. If some of you guys find this callous, remember the dead are already dead, and context matters in the aftermath.

I really hope there is more to this story than just pilots not being able to fly the airplane. I heard the captain was a pretty experienced pilot.
The SSJ manual says that control in direct law is adequate and pitch trim is available

[Jet Jockey]

Oh, oh. Based on the replies, it looks like I may have discovered some of the people that are the type to block escape from a burning aircraft due to retrieving their valuables. Sorry boys, you are getting a fist in the face if you block me in such a situation, hopefully enough to knock you down.

By the way, those who have no words, or no respect for me, or are blocking me might want to read this article about the Moscow tragedy.....

So to all other folks remember, these characters on the forum badmouthing me will result in your death in such a situation. You have seconds to escape. My advice can save your life. Their advice, as has been seen in multiple different discussions, on multiple subjects(where no more than insults are typically given and has resulted in warnings from the mods for two of them) results in much worse for you.

Such arrogance in these trolling comments, trying to defend your own callousness. Step over children as you fight your way off.

I don't think anyone remotely professional here; supports for one second risking anyone's life by getting their stuff.

Reports FWIW says the cabin was evacuated in 55 seconds.

Easy solution: Lockable overhead bins. Case closed.

Sorry all, I can only hear the screaming........

Lol... again you are putting words in his mouth he never said.

He never said or mentioned children and I doubt highly any children would reach up to try to get their luggage out of an overhead bin.

He said he would not be delayed by passengers reaching above in the overhead bins. One as to assume an adult not a young child which could always be moved out of the way easily.

As for the lockable overheads it’s an ongoing discussion but just think of all the extra weight, the extra certification and so on.

Also in a panicked situation assuming the overheads become locked, what makes you think that these idiots would not try to open them anyway wasting even more time to evacuate?

[rookiepilot]

He never said or mentioned children and I doubt highly any children would reach up to try to get their luggage out of an overhead bin.

Doesn't sound to me like anything would stop the heroes of AvCan.
Exhibit A:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4TuEWtXBT_0


There are heroes -- like in this article below -- a 22 year old flight attendant-- died helping people from the back of the plane.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/0 ... -airliner/

Another article says....7 of the bodies were charred beyond recognition....

[goingnowherefast]

Lock the bins with the seatbelt sign. Not supposed to be in there anyway.

Once that becomes common knowledge, people will stop trying to open them.

[pelmet]

Lol... again you are putting words in his mouth he never said.

Sadly, that has happened repeatedly while also hurling insults and adding no useful information. Hardly a way to intelligently win an argument but for some I guess that just isn't possible.

I suppose if one disagreed with my idea, they could state what they would do in the discussed situation that has been repeatedly happening during evacuations due to fires. Maybe you will reach for your Russian-English dictionary and start searching to find out how to say...."Excuse me sir, you are in the way"

[AirFrame]

Another article says....7 of the bodies were charred beyond recognition....

Maybe less shocking if you consider that they would have been dead long before that level of charring occurred.

[Donald]

Interesting the knee-jerk reactions to this crash to:

A). Ban the Sukhoi SuperJet.

B). Award medals to the flight crew for heroically landing and initiating the evacuation.

[Meatservo]

Interesting the knee-jerk reactions to this crash to:

A). Ban the Sukhoi SuperJet.

B). Award medals to the flight crew for heroically landing and initiating the evacuation.

It would be nice to establish whether or not the evacuation was made necessary BY the flight crew's landing, before giving them any medals. Seems to me the cabin crew distinguished themselves, and I hope the flight crew did too. I think the important thing to find out is what damage the lightning strike inflicted on the plane's controllability and what this contributed to the horrible landing that caused the fire. Before we start handing out medals.

[ikarus]

Is it me, or does it look like the engines (or at least starboard one) was still running during the evacuation video?? It seems like major flames are shooting out from the back, although it's hard to see, since the entire half of aircraft was burning..