PICUS at Encore

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hsilgnepilot
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PICUS at Encore

Post by hsilgnepilot »

Hi everyone,

Just wondering how the PICUS program is at Encore. Are there enough training pilots/PICUS eligible captains to keep up with the demand? Is it reasonable for someone with 150 PIC to expect to fly 200 hours under PICUS to log 100 PIC within 2 years of being hired in order to qualify for the ATPL? Or is it quite a lengthy wait to get it done like at some other regionals?

TIA
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skyhighh
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by skyhighh »

Any captains can do PICUS. That being said, back when I worked at Encore, not every captains agreed to-do it as it was unpaid and there was no incentive to do it.
Helping the company while they ask captains to do more for less is a growing concern at Encore.
But to answer your question, yes PICUS is being done rather quickly. I think you have to be on site for a year or something though before being eligible. I don't remember exactly.

Hope that helps.
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tbayav8er
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by tbayav8er »

Minor Correction :)......ALMOST any Captain can do it. It has to be a Captain who has completed their first recurrent after qualifying as Captain. So pretty much all Captains can do it.
skyhighh wrote: Mon Jan 20, 2020 8:05 pm Any captains can do PICUS. That being said, back when I worked at Encore, not every captains agreed to-do it as it was unpaid and there was no incentive to do it.
Helping the company while they ask captains to do more for less is a growing concern at Encore.
But to answer your question, yes PICUS is being done rather quickly. I think you have to be on site for a year or something though before being eligible. I don't remember exactly.

Hope that helps.
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altiplano
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by altiplano »

You're either PIC or you aren't.

Go get a job flying airplanes before you go to the regionals if you want to be an ATP.
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skyhighh
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by skyhighh »

tbayav8er wrote: Mon Jan 20, 2020 8:30 pm Minor Correction :)......ALMOST any Captain can do it. It has to be a Captain who has completed their first recurrent after qualifying as Captain. So pretty much all Captains can do it.
skyhighh wrote: Mon Jan 20, 2020 8:05 pm Any captains can do PICUS. That being said, back when I worked at Encore, not every captains agreed to-do it as it was unpaid and there was no incentive to do it.
Helping the company while they ask captains to do more for less is a growing concern at Encore.
But to answer your question, yes PICUS is being done rather quickly. I think you have to be on site for a year or something though before being eligible. I don't remember exactly.

Hope that helps.
My bad :prayer:

Altiplano: unfortunately this isn’t the world we live in anymore. Until an accident occurs... :(
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goingnowherefast
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by goingnowherefast »

altiplano wrote: Mon Jan 20, 2020 10:14 pm You're either PIC or you aren't.

Go get a job flying airplanes before you go to the regionals if you want to be an ATP.
Except this PICUS thing. Where you are PIC until you need you look left and be an FO again. Then it's all cuddly, you aren't the PIC anymore while the other PIC solves the problem. An actual PIC looks left and sees the person who's responsible for solving all problems...their own reflection in the side window.
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altiplano
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by altiplano »

Exactly. How can you be PIC when someone else is the one who is really responsible.

Remember when FO time only was worth 1/2 for an ATPL too?

Meanwhile in the US you need to show up at the regionals with an ATPL already in hand to get the job, and look what are wages have done there. Operators being able to hire inexperienced pilots helps keep wages down.

If I'm a Captain at an airline doing PICUS, particularly if it's unpaid, I wouldn't do it. It's great to be a nice guy by letting the new guy tick boxes for progression, but the larger implications of inexperienced ATPLs and a bloated labour market make it a negative for the profession.
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C-GGGQ
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by C-GGGQ »

Except regional wages “skyrocketed” from 18k starting wage at regionals according to the tables at airline pilot central are still $39 an hr. Now its USD sure, but the biggest chunk of that “make 95k you’re first year” is signing bonuses ie Mesa airlines 22,500 signing bonus 5000 if you come with a type rating, 20,000 if you don’t get captain in two years etc etc.
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PostmasterGeneral
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by PostmasterGeneral »

And yet unions themselves are fighting for PICUS programs at certain airlines, instead of using the shortage of qualified captains to drive up seniority they’re protecting their almighty seniority list. :prayer:
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altiplano
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by altiplano »

C-GGGQ wrote: Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:06 am Except regional wages “skyrocketed” from 18k starting wage at regionals according to the tables at airline pilot central are still $39 an hr. Now its USD sure, but the biggest chunk of that “make 95k you’re first year” is signing bonuses ie Mesa airlines 22,500 signing bonus 5000 if you come with a type rating, 20,000 if you don’t get captain in two years etc etc.
At least they're paying. Doubled their wage and then some. Plus bonuses. Are Canadian regionals paying signing bonuses to get guys that didn't just fall off the truck? No, they just go to the next flight school on their list and hire another 250 hour student, dangle mainline airline progression and a PICUS program and guys are around the corner to get on.
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C-GGGQ
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Re: PICUS at Encore

Post by C-GGGQ »

As many on here like to point out signing bonuses can easily disappear and are not an increase in wages. A look through the payscales and most start fo’s at 40-50 and stagnate quick. Jazz’s FO scale surpasses most of them in year 5 or 6. For captains they start around the same as jazz $80, and stagnate quick too. Jazz’s top of the scale is higher than all of them some by a lot. I’ve been digging into this extensively this week as I am in the states and the wife wants to move here. Progression to the majors is much slower here too. If i could get there at all. (No degree)
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