Julian.B wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 11:13 am
Their union sold them out. Pure and simple.
Their union is/was our union. Pure and simple. This all played out just the way Big Red wanted it. Jazz, Sky, Georgian, we were/are all just puppets in their game. That's what needs to be understood.
On a similar note, don't be surprised when United swoops in and buys 49% of AC.
Julian.B wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 11:13 am
"while Sky Regional guys got a job and got their equipment protected..."
Julian.B wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 7:27 am
"...and protection on the BEST AIRCRAFT."
This is misleading. Got jobs, yes. Equipment protection, not really. At least as soon as the recall class on Monday the 5th, from Julie's mouth: "As soon as the next equipment bid, which will hopefully be in August, it is highly unlikely you will be able to hold the Embraer." This is in reference to current FOs on the 175 from Sky coming over, obviously.
I'm not sure who "Julie" is. Manager? Well that's good. At least Jazz pilots can bid on the Embraer. None the less; the fact that Sky Regional were hired at Jazz as DOH and with no interview is amazing by itself. It really sets a great example, although completly misplaced. It's like winning a war and telling your enemies they can join your army and have dibs on ranks above your own soldiers. Pretty crappy situation. I am willing to bet a left nut that if that ever went to a vote, it would have never been approved by Jazz pilots. Their union sold them out. Pure and simple. Everything else is circumstantial.
Jazz was at war with Sky Regional? That's news to me.
straight2thepoint wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 8:16 pm
On a similar note, don't be surprised when United swoops in and buys 49% of AC.
Oh? That would be good I would say. A much needed investment can be a good thing for Air Canada. I thought foreign airlines can't invest in Canadian carriers more than 25%. Did they raise it to 49%? I honestly don't know what the laws are.
notwhoyouthinkIam wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 10:34 pm
Jazz was at war with Sky Regional? That's news to me.
Well, maybe my "war" analogy was a little dramatic, but Sky Regional was created to undermine Jazz and Air Canada pilots. They got great airplanes and some of the best routes. They were flying the same planes Mainline guys did, for half the cost. Anyway, I'm starting to repeat myself. I don't have much more to add. If Jazz pilots are happy with their union and having 200+ pilots slide above them in seniority (even with the retirements, etc), then so be it. I don't think that guy that returned to McDonalds was happy about it. I think I saw a post on TIYCP.
notwhoyouthinkIam wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 10:34 pm
Jazz was at war with Sky Regional? That's news to me.
Well, maybe my "war" analogy was a little dramatic, but Sky Regional was created to undermine Jazz and Air Canada pilots. They got great airplanes and some of the best routes. They were flying the same planes Mainline guys did, for half the cost. Anyway, I'm starting to repeat myself. I don't have much more to add. If Jazz pilots are happy with their union and having 200+ pilots slide above them in seniority (even with the retirements, etc), then so be it. I don't think that guy (Jazz Dash capt) that returned to McDonalds was happy about it. I think I saw a post on TIYCP.
As someone who spent many years at Jazz and over a decade at Westjet, you cannot compare Encore to Jazz.
Schedule and pay rates are just small parts of an airlines WAWCON’s. It would be more fair to compare Jazz to Westjet mainline.
I don't understand. WAWCON stands for wages and working conditions. What else can we quantifiably measure?
Well my whole point was there’s many other things to look at then just pay and schedule and that’s not to say Encore is even better at those. Heck I flew more on the 37 then I did at Jazz. But other very important things to consider are health/dental which is 1000x better at Jazz than any of the WJ group and retirement savings plans. You may not think so but wait till your get in you later years and have children.
Literally the only advantages Encore has is reserve, aircraft age(lol doesn’t matter) and no interview if you want to go to mainline. That’s it.
What is encores retirement now that they don’t have stock anymore? Can they still do a match or is it gone?
I don't understand. WAWCON stands for wages and working conditions. What else can we quantifiably measure?
Well my whole point was there’s many other things to look at then just pay and schedule and that’s not to say Encore is even better at those. Heck I flew more on the 37 then I did at Jazz. But other very important things to consider are health/dental which is 1000x better at Jazz than any of the WJ group and retirement savings plans. You may not think so but wait till your get in you later years and have children.
Literally the only advantages Encore has is reserve, aircraft age(lol doesn’t matter) and no interview if you want to go to mainline. That’s it.
What is encores retirement now that they don’t have stock anymore? Can they still do a match or is it gone?
Retirement, who cares, their planes are 5.77484 years old on average........
RegionalPilot wrote: ↑Mon Jul 12, 2021 5:58 pm
How many is left to be recalled (including SKV)?
If all of the Sep 9th class has been recalled. Rough math, 128 till the bottom of the Jazz Aviation and Sky Regional Integrated Pilot System Seniority List. Then the fun begins when one day they will work their way up the tree lol.
Apparently flying hours are over the agreement for august. Max sched hours have been augmented pending further recalls. With about 150-200 guys on layoff, there will not be many more remaining by september in my opinion.
the-minister31 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:53 pm
Apparently flying hours are over the agreement for august. Max sched hours have been augmented pending further recalls. With about 150-200 guys on layoff, there will not be many more remaining by september in my opinion.
That number is probably fairly accurate.
As of August 01st approximately 200 remaining on involuntary layoff plus those that passed on recall. However, the equipment bid that runs in August will determine the actual number of pilots required for 2022.
I wonder if some of the recently recalled pilots will be put back on furlough following the equipment bid. That would be tough for many as a lot of pilots have resigned from their other non aviation jobs to accept the recall.
Ash Ketchum wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 5:22 am
I wonder if some of the recently recalled pilots will be put back on furlough following the equipment bid. That would be tough for many as a lot of pilots have resigned from their other non aviation jobs to accept the recall.
Lol. Jazz is like doing 80-90 hour blocks. Training is a mess, no one is going to get laid off in the next little while. The recalls that happened already looked out a year and happened BEFORE the border opened up. I'm sure those recalled will be just fine.
And anyways I wouldn't really feel bad either way since they've all been on CEWS and working other jobs on top of it for the last year, many making BANK.
Can anyone confirm if there were additional recalls sent out that the union didn’t announce? I’m hearing calls went out for August 1st and 5th effective dates.
Is the union allowed to run recalls without letting the membership know? I’ve checked all emails and I don’t have anything.
Also, any chatter about what this LOU holds that’s supposed to be coming out this week? Hopefully it’s in relation to the boarder opening and means more good news!
I know for a fact that people have been recalled for 4-5th of august.
I was surprised that the union did not update the recall list or current number of pilots remaining on recall. I am an eternal optimistic and I tell myself that they think it doesn't matter anyway since everybody will be back by september ! But to be honest all depends on that famous position bid...
Why the lack of communication....privacy issues for Jazz & ALPA ? Kinda crappy for everyone who's waiting for recall news and numbers having to resort to this board for nuggets of information.
The union stated that recalls would a constant and continual process and that it would be difficult to keep the membership up to date because it is constantly changing. Basically any list they publish would be immediately out of date. Recall notices have been going out every month since April
2nine9two wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 5:00 pm
The union stated that recalls would a constant and continual process and that it would be difficult to keep the membership up to date because it is constantly changing. Basically any list they publish would be immediately out of date. Recall notices have been going out every month since April
Yeah they said that in a recent memo to members. I don't even work at Jazz anymore and I heard about the Aug recalls.
A friend of mine originally from Sky got a recall call Monday this week.... 20 additional calls for EMB drivers have gone out this week for a Aug 16th reinstatement... therefore 20 original Jazz pilots will or have already been recalled as well .... more recalls to follow.... things heating up. At the rate we are going at by Oct 1 I wouldn't be surprised if the March 2020 class is recalled by then. As mentioned earlier the August Position bid is going to tell a clearer story. Congrats to all coming back!
