Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

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W5
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Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by W5 »

CONAIR EXPANDS WITH PURCHASE OF ELEVEN DASH 8 Q400 AIRCRAFT

https://www.aerialfiremag.com/conair-ex ... NZzZu61FfY

ABBOTSFORD, CANADA (January 13, 2021) – Conair Group Inc., operating the largest, privately-owned fixed-wing fleet of firefighting aircraft in the world, is pleased to announce the purchase of eleven Dash 8 Q400 aircraft for conversion to airtankers, engineered specifically for aerial firefighting.

After more than a decade of research and development, Conair’s answer to the future of aerial firefighting is the Q400AT, the most advanced airtanker in the world today. The purchase marks the most significant investment Conair has made to date towards developing a fleet of Next Generation aircraft designed to better fight wildfires for years to come.

For over 50 years Conair has made strides to lead the industry, supporting government agencies using their versatile fleet of 70 aircraft. The company continues their proactive approach with the recent purchase, making a committed step towards creating an inventory of superior aerial firefighters. The expansion provides customers with the security of knowing the Conair fleet will always be ready when called to respond to emergency situations.

Planes used to fight wildfires as airtankers are often older models and are flown into demanding environments, inevitably resulting in metal fatigue over time. In addition, aircraft designed to obsolete standards leads to increased risk of incidents, costly repairs, limited replacement parts, and ultimately time grounded from fighting fires. Conair’s strategic move towards a long-term vision includes replacing the company’s fleet of heavy legacy airtankers with the new Q400ATs.

“We evaluated 29 aircraft before selecting the Q400 for modification into an aerial firefighting tool. The unanimous opinion of our flight operations experts was that the Q400 exceeds all the Next Generation performance criteria within a maneuverable and stable platform.” says Jeff Berry, Director of Business Development at Conair. “The Q400AT is fast, fuel efficient, and tactically flexible, operating both initial attack as well as sustained support actions. The Q400 is still in production and has strong Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) support from De Havilland Aircraft of Canada Limited (De Havilland Canada), guaranteeing availability of parts and servicing for years.”
“We are delighted that Conair is acquiring another eleven Dash 8 aircraft to support the growth of the company’s specialized airtanker fleet,” said Philippe Poutissou, Vice President Marketing and Sales, De Havilland Canada. “In addition to being the most advanced and efficient turboprops deployed in regional airline and air transport roles around the world, De Havilland Canada’s versatile Dash 8 Series aircraft continue to be an ideal platform for special mission operations such as aerial firefighting, search and rescue and medical evacuation and we congratulate Conair on the excellent work they are doing supporting diverse communities with their Dash 8 multi-role and airtanker aircraft.”

Conair has been modifying the Q400 into airtankers since 2005, with a proven record of success having been flown more than 8,000 hours with a fleet availability for dispatch rate of 98.5%. The Conair Q400MR multi-role and Q400AT airtanker are similar in design, with both featuring an external 10,000-litre tank. Four Q400MR aircraft are in operation in France, with four more on order, and the company’s first Q400AT airtanker was placed in operation in Queensland, Australia in September of 2020. In total, the company has purchased 6 new and 13 used Q400 aircraft within the last 2 years.

“We look forward to manufacturing the Q400 aircraft into airtankers out of our hangars in Abbotsford, British Columbia, employing a group of specialists during a particularly tough time for the aviation industry,” shares Barry Marsden, CEO. “It makes us proud that this Canadian-made, De Havilland Canada airframe, powered with Canadian-made Pratt & Whitney engines, will be modified by our team in Canada, and then put into operation around the world to help our partners suppress wildfires for what could be decades.”

The Q400 aircraft were purchased from HEH Hamburger EmissionsHaus, through Skyworld Aviation. The eleven aircraft, originally Flybe commuter planes, are based in Europe and will be delivered to Conair starting this month.
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dhc#
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by dhc# »

Didn't notice in the article, anyone know how long it takes Conair to convert a Dash 8-400 into a tanker ? 11 of them is a massive project.
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_skyfall
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by _skyfall »

dhc# wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:47 pm Didn't notice in the article, anyone know how long it takes Conair to convert a Dash 8-400 into a tanker ? 11 of them is a massive project.
They're estimating having the Electra and Convairs phased out with replacement Q400s online in the next 2-3 years.

https://fireaviation.com/2021/01/14/con ... b7kOsrV320
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by Canoehead »

Considering this article, it's good to see demand even if it's surplus aircraft. Sure hope they check those airplanes out well. FlyBe machines were ridden hard and put away wet.

https://simpleflying.com/de-havilland-q ... suspended/
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by dhc# »

Canoehead wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 7:36 am Considering this article, it's good to see demand even if it's surplus aircraft. Sure hope they check those airplanes out well. FlyBe machines were ridden hard and put away wet.

https://simpleflying.com/de-havilland-q ... suspended/
Not looking good for new manufacture Q400's, hope demand will pick up....were they not looking at new model production Q300's with upgraded engines/props/interior/flt deck a year or so back if the demand was there?
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by fish4life »

What is typical speeds for drops in the convair and Electra’s? Do you use flaps during drops?
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

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dhc# wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:55 pm
Not looking good for new manufacture Q400's, hope demand will pick up....were they not looking at new model production Q300's with upgraded engines/props/interior/flt deck a year or so back if the demand was there?
Certainly was some discussion around it, but I'm not sure that Bombardier or Longview ever said anymore than just "exploring" the concept. I think the way of the future is less frequency. The DH8-300s at Jazz have a projected end date in the fleet (perhaps sooner than later based on current events) and will soon become a 74-78 seat operation only.
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by dhc# »

Ex-Flybe Q400 arrives at Conair base for firefighting modification

https://canadianaviationnews.wordpress. ... ification/
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by theflyingmoose »

Anyone know the cost of these conversions? I think typical freighter conversions are somewhere around 25% of the original freighter cost, but not sure if these special conversions are different. I'm doing a bit of digging to try and figure out what's next for the Q400 :)

Regardless of the conversion cost, I'd imagine that Conair got the Q400's for cheap + wildfires are likely only getting worse. They're definitely in the right business at the moment 8)
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by fish4life »

How does that payload compare to the the Electra and convair? I’d imagine it’s between the 2?

Any idea if they are going to be HUD equipped? Would the advantage of a HUD be outweighed by the fact you are looking around and not just straight forward?

The article mentioned a g-loading system, do they have a monitor that will flag certain load changes for maintenance inspection so they can hopefully catch any issues early? Pretty neat stuff.
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by dhc# »

Anyone know how many of the 11 Q400's they purchased have now been modded and will be operational for the summer 22 fire season ?
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Re: Conair adds 11 Dash 8-400's

Post by bigredone »

I will try answer a few of those questions keeping in mimd it is second hand info but from someone who knows most.

Takes about 90 days for Conair to convert from flying pax to dropping retardant.
Conair never proposed the DH8(300).
Q400s have been converted since mid 2000s with France adding 4 new to total 6, Conair adding 11(FlyBe) to the existing 2.
Drop speeds vary by type and weight but at max weight on flat ground a CV580 drops about 120kts, L188 about 130 kts and Q400 a bit less.
Tank capacity with 3hrs+res is Q400 10,000L, L188 12500L(less for non-Conair L188s), and CV580 8000L
No HUD
Most of the Conair fleet have load and parameter monitoring. Every aspect of aircraft configuration is monitored for exceedance of both manufactures limitations and company SOPs. A second system is in place for most tankers for airframe loads. These are monitored and flagged immediately to the point where crew may have an email waiting for them regarding the exceedance upon landing.
There will be 3 Q4s on North American contract 2022(1 BC, 2 State of AK), 1 remaining in Australia and then another few with the USA operation/spare. So 2 non ex-FlyBe and another 4 that were. Likely another 2 Q4 to replace last CV580 2023/24 on BC contract and maybe a spare.
With the US(Aeroflite) operation likely to take on Q400s, the 11 FlyBe AC will be onboarded within a few years and by then another batch will be ready for conversion.
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