The UnVaxxed Overflow Hospitals

[hamstandard]

Hits 'keep coming': Hospitals struggle as COVID beds fill

DETROIT (AP) — Hospitals across the country are struggling to cope with burnout among doctors, nurses and other workers, already buffeted by a crush of patients from the ongoing surge of the COVID-19 delta variant and now bracing for the fallout of another highly transmissible mutation.

Ohio became the latest state to summon the National Guard to help overwhelmed medical facilities. Experts in Nebraska warned that its hospitals soon may need to ration care. Medical officials in Kansas and Missouri are delaying surgeries, turning away transfers and desperately trying to hire traveling nurses, as cases double and triple in an eerie reminder of last year's holiday season.

“There is no medical school class that can prepare you for this level of death," said Dr. Jacqueline Pflaum-Carlson, an emergency medicine specialist at Henry Ford Health System in Detroit. “The hits just keep coming.”

The national seven-day average of COVID-19 hospital admissions was 60,000 by Wednesday, far off last winter's peak but 50% higher than in early November, the government reported. The situation is more acute in cold-weather regions, where people are increasingly gathering inside and new infections are piling up.

New York state reported Friday that slightly more than 21,000 people had tested positive for COVID-19, a new high since tests became widely available. The consequences were swift in New York City: The Rockettes Christmas show was scratched for the season, and some Broadway shows canceled performances because of outbreaks among cast members.

“We are in a situation where we are now facing a very important delta surge and we are looking over our shoulder at an oncoming omicron surge," Dr. Anthony Fauci, chief medical adviser to President Joe Biden, said of the two COVID-19 variants.

At AdventHealth Shawnee Mission, a hospital near Kansas City, Missouri, chief medical officer Dr. Lisa Hays said the emergency department is experiencing backups sometimes lasting for days.

“The beds are not the issue. It’s the nurses to staff the beds. ... And it’s all created by rising COVID numbers and burnout," Hays said. “Our nurses are burnt out.”


Experts attribute most of the rise in cases and hospitalizations to infections among people who have not been inoculated against the coronavirus. The government says 61% of the U.S. population is fully vaccinated.

Dr. Steve Stites, chief medical officer at University of Kansas Health System in Kansas City, Kansas, said the “pandemic of the unvaccinated” continues to swamp the hospital and its workers.

“There’s no place to go. Our staff are tired. We’re going to run out of travelers," Stites said, referring to visiting health care workers, “and omicron is at our doorstep. This is a tornado warning to our community.”

Ohio's National Guard deployment is one of the largest seen during the pandemic, with more than 1,000 members sent to beleaguered hospitals especially in the Akron, Canton and Cleveland areas.

As of Friday, 4,723 people in the state were hospitalized with the coronavirus, a number last seen about a year ago, Gov. Mike DeWine said. Some staffers were taking only short breaks before punching in for second shifts, he added.

Health systems elsewhere that are doing somewhat better are nervously eying the arrival of the omicron variant and girding themselves for the impact.

Nebraska officials said hospitals might have to put some care on hold to make room for COVID-19 patients. While case numbers are down from the state's pandemic peak, they could rebound rapidly, and bed availability remains tight because of patients with non-virus ailments.

“It may be likely that omicron will cause a giant surge, and honestly we can’t handle that right now,” said Dr. Angela Hewlett of Nebraska Medicine in Omaha.

At Los Angeles’ Providence Holy Cross Medical Center, just 17 coronavirus patients were being treated there Friday, a small fraction of the hospital’s worst stretch. Nurse manager Edgar Ramirez said his co-workers are weary but better prepared if a wave hits.

“The human factor of having that fear is always going to be there,” Ramirez said. “I tell our crew, ‘We have to talk through this. We have to express ourselves.’ Otherwise it’s going to tough.”

Twin sisters Linda Calderon and Natalie Balli, 71, had planned to get vaccinated but delayed it until it was too late. Now they're on oxygen in the same room at Providence Holy Cross, their beds separated by just a few feet.

“We kept saying, ‘we’ll do it tomorrow.’ But tomorrow never came,” Calderon said as she watched her sister struggle to breathe. “We really regret not getting the shots, because if we did, we wouldn’t be like this right now.”

Pflaum-Carlson, the doctor at Detroit's Henry Ford Health, made a public plea for people to get the shots both for their benefit and for those toiling on the frontlines of care. Eighty percent of the roughly 500 COVID-19 patients at the system's five hospitals were unvaccinated,

“Have a little grace and consideration in how devastating things are right now,” she said.

[rookiepilot]

I thought all of these hospital stories were fake news.

Where are all those videos from the Anti Vax crowd posted on this site, showing empty hospitals and happy dancing nurses?

Are you psychotic nuts now saying those videos of empty ER’s nationwide….might not be truthful?

Don’t be afraid. Own up now those who posted them on this site. Be proud of your information.

At AdventHealth Shawnee Mission, a hospital near Kansas City, Missouri, chief medical officer Dr. Lisa Hays said the emergency department is experiencing backups sometimes lasting for days.

“The beds are not the issue. It’s the nurses to staff the beds. ... And it’s all created by rising COVID numbers and burnout," Hays said. “Our nurses are burnt out.”

Is she lying then Anti Vaxers? Yes or no?

[Vaticinator]

I'm not anti vax and I can't speak to the situation in your anecdote of a single hospital not in this country, however across all of Canada

Between December 6, 2021 and December 13, 2021:

the number of hospital beds occupied by COVID-19 patients decreased from 1,117 to 1,086 beds.

This is cut and paste directly from the Health Canada covid 19 daily epidemiology update website.

Do you have any non-anecdotal data relevant to Canada that contradicts Health Canada that we should be aware of?

[rookiepilot]

I'm not anti vax and I can't speak to the situation in your anecdote of a single hospital not in this country, however across all of Canada

Between December 6, 2021 and December 13, 2021:

the number of hospital beds occupied by COVID-19 patients decreased from 1,117 to 1,086 beds.

This is cut and paste directly from the Health Canada covid 19 daily epidemiology update website.

Do you have any non-anecdotal data relevant to Canada that contradicts Health Canada that we should be aware of?

Why do you assume after 2 years of this, Canada has enough trained, healthy health care workers to even maintain a level amount of ICU beds?

Do you think experienced, healthy, still motivated ICU nurses are hatching out of the ground?

[ReserveTank]

Vaxxed vs. Unvaxxed. Plebs vs. plebs. "Hospitals filling up." It's simply victim politics--You MUST have an enemy, preferably each other.
Divided we fall, said someone. Collectively, we are the globalists' enemy. They employ their Machiavellian strategy of divide and rule, and it works. The problem is the weak submissives that desire, that need to be ruthlessly ruled over. A psychopathic quid pro quo.

[Vaticinator]

Why do you assume after 2 years of this, Canada has enough trained, healthy health care workers to even maintain a level amount of ICU beds?

Do you think experienced, healthy, still motivated ICU nurses are hatching out of the ground?

I haven't assumed anything about the number of health care workers in Canada. I was merely pointing out that the data does not support the thread title that "The UnVaxxed Overflow Hospitals", at least not in this country. (The OP and you posted anecdotes from outside of Canada.) The readily available data shows that in Canada, 1086 hospital beds (453 ICU beds) are occupied by covid patients. Obviously this is undesirable, but it doesn't sound like hospitals are "overflowing."

As far as nurses "hatching out of the ground", I haven't seen any data that indicates a relationship between 10% of our population being unvaccinated and the number of health care professionals. I have seen that 5616 nurses re-entered the field in 2020. I'd love to see more hard data on this aspect of covid, so please share what relevant data you have that you're basing your position on.

[Bede]

I thought all of these hospital stories were fake news.

Well someone with a youtube channel went into a hospital and demanded to check out the ICU and they wouldn't let them in so clearly they're hiding something.

[ReserveTank]

Why do you assume after 2 years of this, Canada has enough trained, healthy health care workers to even maintain a level amount of ICU beds?

Do you think experienced, healthy, still motivated ICU nurses are hatching out of the ground?

I haven't assumed anything about the number of health care workers in Canada. I was merely pointing out that the data does not support the thread title that "The UnVaxxed Overflow Hospitals", at least not in this country. (The OP and you posted anecdotes from outside of Canada.) The readily available data shows that in Canada, 1086 hospital beds (453 ICU beds) are occupied by covid patients. Obviously this is undesirable, but it doesn't sound like hospitals are "overflowing."

As far as nurses "hatching out of the ground", I haven't seen any data that indicates a relationship between 10% of our population being unvaccinated and the number of health care professionals. I have seen that 5616 nurses re-entered the field in 2020. I'd love to see more hard data on this aspect of covid, so please share what relevant data you have that you're basing your position on.

At this point, even if you're right, none of the numbers matter. For the entire history of rhetoric, "experts" have been pulling statistics out of their arses, making fools of the midwit plebs. The data doesn't matter, because as soon as you're ready to prove, the narrative shifts. To name the most prominent, IMO...

-Just 2 weeks
-Don't wear masks
-Wear masks (we just wanted to prevent hoarding)
-Virus comes from China
-Don't ban travel from China (that's racist)
-We need 70% vaccine compliance
-Only 70% are vaccinated, covid is the unvaxxed's fault
-We need 90% vaccine compliance
-Only 100% vaccine compliance will work
-We won't implement vax passports
-You must have a vax passport to function in public
-Unvaxxed are spreading covid still
-Unvaxxed can't go anywhere in public
-Masks are effective, mandate extended
-Masks are mandatory everywhere, people disinfecting like germaphobes--covid somehow spreading


I get what you're saying, but statistics don't matter to these people. One of these guys on the forum actually discredited a doctor because they didn't have a Nobel Prize. They share the victim anecdotes as proof of hospital capacity but sneer at anecdotes and articles from medical professionals. Face it, the weak and antisocial are having their passive-aggressive heyday, and it's all government and corporate backed. Weak men create hard times--this is the proof. It's a lesson for every generation.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

I thought all of these hospital stories were fake news.

Where are all those videos from the Anti Vax crowd posted on this site, showing empty hospitals and happy dancing nurses?

Are you psychotic nuts now saying those videos of empty ER’s nationwide….might not be truthful?

Don’t be afraid. Own up now those who posted them on this site. Be proud of your information.

At AdventHealth Shawnee Mission, a hospital near Kansas City, Missouri, chief medical officer Dr. Lisa Hays said the emergency department is experiencing backups sometimes lasting for days.

“The beds are not the issue. It’s the nurses to staff the beds. ... And it’s all created by rising COVID numbers and burnout," Hays said. “Our nurses are burnt out.”

Is she lying then Anti Vaxers? Yes or no?

It’s not my responsibility to determine what we need for hospital capacity. I have been told if I don’t want a vaccine, I will have certain restrictions such as not being able to go to restaurants for dine in. By following these measures if unvaccinated, this mitigates the risk of spreading Covid and reduces hospitalization. I have done my part.

We are simply following our leadership. Seems like you are upset with them. Maybe write your MPP and let them know you are upset with them. I would think putting our sharpest experts to tackle Covid they could have figured things out after two years. It’s to bad hospitals are over flowing, not my problem.

Are you frustrated with those who are not vaccinated? Why? They simply live within the rules the government has implemented as directed by our experts. If they follow those rules, the rules designed to mitigate transmission, cases, hospitalizations, deaths etc… what are you upset about? If your world is crumbling, maybe ask your leaders and experts why they aren’t doing enough to keep hospital beds available. Not being vaccinated is an acceptable option. The government has made that part of its plan. They have a plan where if you are not vaccinated you take additional precautions… I would think the idea is that by having those rules set that way, the unvaccinated are no more risk to the system than the vaccinated

[photofly]

Kary Mullis won he Nobel prize for chemistry in 1993, and died in 2019. Before COVID. His Ph.D was in biochemistry, not medicine.

Vladimir Zelenko is a family physician with no research experience. I don’t know whether he’s a nominee for a Nobel peace prize or not, but either way, it doesn’t entitle him to credibility on promoting drug protocols not authorized by the medical establishment. You can read about him here: https://viralproductsexchange.com/z-sta ... elenko-vsl

Weak men hear “Nobel prize” and “doctor” in the same sentence and go gushy in the head and wobbly-wobbly at the knees.

When you hear people promoting a dead guy and a boob at the top of their list of sources, it tells you everything you need to know about what they’re saying.

[dialdriver]

Vaxxed vs. Unvaxxed. Plebs vs. plebs. "Hospitals filling up." It's simply victim politics--You MUST have an enemy, preferably each other.
Divided we fall, said someone. Collectively, we are the globalists' enemy. They employ their Machiavellian strategy of divide and rule, and it works. The problem is the weak submissives that desire, that need to be ruthlessly ruled over. A psychopathic quid pro quo.

Umm, what?

[photofly]

It’s not my responsibility to determine what we need for hospital capacity. I have been told if I don’t want a vaccine, I will have certain restrictions such as not being able to go to restaurants for dine in. By following these measures if unvaccinated, this mitigates the risk of spreading Covid and reduces hospitalization. I have done my part.

We are simply following our leadership. Seems like you are upset with them. Maybe write your MPP and let them know you are upset with them. I would think putting our sharpest experts to tackle Covid they could have figured things out after two years. It’s to bad hospitals are over flowing, not my problem.

Are you frustrated with those who are not vaccinated? Why? They simply live within the rules the government has implemented as directed by our experts. If they follow those rules, the rules designed to mitigate transmission, cases, hospitalizations, deaths etc… what are you upset about? If your world is crumbling, maybe ask your leaders and experts why they aren’t doing enough to keep hospital beds available. Not being vaccinated is an acceptable option. The government has made that part of its plan. They have a plan where if you are not vaccinated you take additional precautions… I would think the idea is that by having those rules set that way, the unvaccinated are no more risk to the system than the vaccinated

Assuming you’re not vaccinated, would you waive your right in perpetuity to hospital treatment for COVID should you ever need it? Or waive your right to treatment in ICU? Or a ventilator?

I’m curious how deep your personal conviction that vaccination is of no benefit runs.

When you say “it’s not my responsibility to…”, what do you see as your responsibility?

[CYERCaptainPooping]

It’s not my responsibility to determine what we need for hospital capacity. I have been told if I don’t want a vaccine, I will have certain restrictions such as not being able to go to restaurants for dine in. By following these measures if unvaccinated, this mitigates the risk of spreading Covid and reduces hospitalization. I have done my part.

We are simply following our leadership. Seems like you are upset with them. Maybe write your MPP and let them know you are upset with them. I would think putting our sharpest experts to tackle Covid they could have figured things out after two years. It’s to bad hospitals are over flowing, not my problem.

Are you frustrated with those who are not vaccinated? Why? They simply live within the rules the government has implemented as directed by our experts. If they follow those rules, the rules designed to mitigate transmission, cases, hospitalizations, deaths etc… what are you upset about? If your world is crumbling, maybe ask your leaders and experts why they aren’t doing enough to keep hospital beds available. Not being vaccinated is an acceptable option. The government has made that part of its plan. They have a plan where if you are not vaccinated you take additional precautions… I would think the idea is that by having those rules set that way, the unvaccinated are no more risk to the system than the vaccinated

Assuming you’re not vaccinated, would you waive your right in perpetuity to hospital treatment for COVID should you ever need it? Or waive your right to treatment in ICU? Or a ventilator?

I’m curious how deep your personal conviction that vaccination is of no benefit runs.

When you say “it’s not my responsibility to…”, what do you see as your responsibility?

Why would I have to do that. Those are not the rules. If the rules change, then maybe I will play a different hand.

My responsibility is to follow the guidelines, rules, laws.

If the government says unvaccinated can’t go to a restaurant, because the risk is to high, but a vaccinated person can, so long as everyone is following those rules what is anyone pissed about? The consequences have already been handed out. Maybe the non vaccinated should be mad at the vaccinated who have privileges to do things where we know they are spreading Covid. It’s pretty clear that many vax people are spreading Covid… guess what we know this because the government is changing the rules for the vax. So no, I’m not upset with the vaccinated… I just expect them to play by the new rules.

IMO being pissed off about an antivax person is like being pissed off about someone released from prison after doing their time for a crime. If you are not satisfied with the penalty ask Trudeau to spank me harder.

[photofly]

It’s not my responsibility to determine what we need for hospital capacity. I have been told if I don’t want a vaccine, I will have certain restrictions such as not being able to go to restaurants for dine in. By following these measures if unvaccinated, this mitigates the risk of spreading Covid and reduces hospitalization. I have done my part.

We are simply following our leadership. Seems like you are upset with them. Maybe write your MPP and let them know you are upset with them. I would think putting our sharpest experts to tackle Covid they could have figured things out after two years. It’s to bad hospitals are over flowing, not my problem.

Are you frustrated with those who are not vaccinated? Why? They simply live within the rules the government has implemented as directed by our experts. If they follow those rules, the rules designed to mitigate transmission, cases, hospitalizations, deaths etc… what are you upset about? If your world is crumbling, maybe ask your leaders and experts why they aren’t doing enough to keep hospital beds available. Not being vaccinated is an acceptable option. The government has made that part of its plan. They have a plan where if you are not vaccinated you take additional precautions… I would think the idea is that by having those rules set that way, the unvaccinated are no more risk to the system than the vaccinated

Assuming you’re not vaccinated, would you waive your right in perpetuity to hospital treatment for COVID should you ever need it? Or waive your right to treatment in ICU? Or a ventilator?

I’m curious how deep your personal conviction that vaccination is of no benefit runs.

When you say “it’s not my responsibility to…”, what do you see as your responsibility?

Why would I have to do that. Those are not the rules. If the rules change, then maybe I will play a different hand.

My responsibility is to follow the guidelines, rules, laws.

No responsibility whatsoever other than that? Interesting.

So you’d be ok if vaccines became mandatory, with stringent, punitive and possibly crippling fines for those who refuse? Just new rules, right? Each new rule is merely an opportunity to play your hand differently? How very dispassionate of you.

What are you prepared to lose, or pay, before the balance tilts in favour of a vaccine, for you? $200 fines per month? $1000? Your Job? Car? House? Night time curfew? Prison?

Would all these things be overreach? Wrong? As things stand, I think so. But they can only be wrong in a world where individuals have some responsibility to act outside of following the rules. In the world where the individual (that's you, by the way) has no responsibility to their fellows, the state has no responsibility to do the right thing by them - it's just rules, after all.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

No responsibility whatsoever other than that? Interesting.

So you’d be ok if vaccines became mandatory, with stringent, punitive and possibly crippling fines for those who refuse? Just new rules, right? Each new rule is merely an opportunity to play your hand differently? How very dispassionate of you.

What are you prepared to lose, or pay, before the balance tilts in favour of a vaccine, for you? $200 fines per month? $1000? Your Job? Car? House? Night time curfew? Prison?

I never said I was okay with anything. I am saying we can’t fault those who play by the rules.

If you are wealthy and you tax plan. Are you guilty of tax fraud? Is this not ethical? You literally play by the rules created by the system. They made the rules, and you follow them… now they are upset?

How would vaccine policy be any different? Play by the rules. I am just hearing lots of hate for the non vaccinated and I find it interesting. The non vaccinated have made many sacrifices to maintain that choice. Government has enforced policies that are designed to solve the issues and they are following the policy. What is everyone angry about?

Yes, each new rule I will decide how to play my hand. What’s it to you what it takes for me to get a vaccine? I already posted here, I’d get vaccinated if I knew government would drop all Covid restrictions. I thought this was reasonable. But since I’m not the expert, I don’t understand the science of why that can’t happen, I will continue to abide by the rules in play.

[photofly]

Yes, each new rule I will decide how to play my hand. What’s it to you what it takes for me to get a vaccine? I already posted here, I’d get vaccinated if I knew government would drop all Covid restrictions. I thought this was reasonable. But since I’m not the expert, I don’t understand the science of why that can’t happen, I will continue to abide by the rules in play.

So I'll ask again. If the government in your province said it was now necessary to refuse hospital, ICU or ventilator treatment for COVID for unvaccinated individuals, and, with regret, they would be left to die if necessary, would that induce you to get vaccinated?

Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

Yes, each new rule I will decide how to play my hand. What’s it to you what it takes for me to get a vaccine? I already posted here, I’d get vaccinated if I knew government would drop all Covid restrictions. I thought this was reasonable. But since I’m not the expert, I don’t understand the science of why that can’t happen, I will continue to abide by the rules in play.

So I'll ask again. If the government in your province said it was now necessary to refuse hospital, ICU or ventilator treatment for COVID for unvaccinated individuals, and, with regret, they would be left to die if necessary, would that induce you to get vaccinated?

Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

I am not sure what I would do. I would likely move to a different province or expedite my move to America, greatest country in the world!

I think the more important thing to focus on is the collective, and not so much my personal choices. End of the day my personal choices have very little bearing on the direction of the pandemic. The fact is we have about 10 percent of people not vaccinated, and they are likely to not get vaccinated without a drastic change in policy. At this point we are not likely to see stronger policy because Covid has proven to be fairly mild for most people, it’s not the boogeyman we thought it was in March 2020. I don’t even think we will see vaccines mandated for kids to go to school in the under 12 age group. So the important thing to focus on for you will be how will you live in Covid times with 10 percent unvaccinated going forward. How will you live in a world where many under 12 are not vaccinated?

Do you feel strongly enough in your beliefs you would advocate for stronger consequences? Maybe you will protest at parliament hill? Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

[TG]

Yes, each new rule I will decide how to play my hand. What’s it to you what it takes for me to get a vaccine? I already posted here, I’d get vaccinated if I knew government would drop all Covid restrictions. I thought this was reasonable. But since I’m not the expert, I don’t understand the science of why that can’t happen, I will continue to abide by the rules in play.

So I'll ask again. If the government in your province said it was now necessary to refuse hospital, ICU or ventilator treatment for COVID for unvaccinated individuals, and, with regret, they would be left to die if necessary, would that induce you to get vaccinated?

Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

I am not sure what I would do. I would likely move to a different province or expedite my move to America, greatest country in the world!

I think the more important thing to focus on is the collective, and not so much my personal choices. End of the day my personal choices have very little bearing on the direction of the pandemic. The fact is we have about 10 percent of people not vaccinated, and they are likely to not get vaccinated without a drastic change in policy. At this point we are not likely to see stronger policy because Covid has proven to be fairly mild for most people, it’s not the boogeyman we thought it was in March 2020. I don’t even think we will see vaccines mandated for kids to go to school in the under 12 age group. So the important thing to focus on for you will be how will you live in Covid times with 10 percent unvaccinated going forward. How will you live in a world where many under 12 are not vaccinated?

Do you feel strongly enough in your beliefs you would advocate for stronger consequences? Maybe you will protest at parliament hill? Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

It's not about freaking beliefs, it's about common sense which anti vaxers don't have (Or think they have)

You guys are so knowledgeable about virology, medicine and what's best to do for a country during a pandemic after all....

[photofly]

Yes, each new rule I will decide how to play my hand. What’s it to you what it takes for me to get a vaccine? I already posted here, I’d get vaccinated if I knew government would drop all Covid restrictions. I thought this was reasonable. But since I’m not the expert, I don’t understand the science of why that can’t happen, I will continue to abide by the rules in play.

So I'll ask again. If the government in your province said it was now necessary to refuse hospital, ICU or ventilator treatment for COVID for unvaccinated individuals, and, with regret, they would be left to die if necessary, would that induce you to get vaccinated?

Think of this as an opportunity to demonstrate the strength of your commitment to anyone reading this thread.

I am not sure what I would do. I would likely move to a different province or expedite my move to America, greatest country in the world!

I think the more important thing to focus on is the collective, and not so much my personal choices. End of the day my personal choices have very little bearing on the direction of the pandemic.

The course of the pandemic is determined by your personal choices, in a collective with everyone else.

So it’s in the fictional world where your personal choices have no bearing on the collective, and where there’s no possible personal consequence to you for your choice to avoid vaccination, that you are happy to go without. Because of, in your head:

Your getting COVID 100% won’t spread it to anyone else
The 100% certainty in your head that It will only be a mild illness if you do
The 100% guarantee, again in your head, but not actually in real life, of the best medical treatment in the world being available to you free of charge if it’s not a mild illness

You live in a great world in your head, and if I lived there I’d probably be obstinate and avoid vaccination, too. But that’s the only place such a world exists.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

TG, I have been saying I am to dumb to understand these things. What I do understand is if I live by the rules I am doing my part. I have been told I have a choice, and the choice is get a vaccine and live with the consequences, or don’t get a vaccine and live with the consequences. I am not the expert, the experts made the rules and I live within the restrictions.

I am not an intellectual, I have below average IQ didn’t graduate high school… I’m so dumb all I know is how to follow the rules the government makes. Why are you angry at me?

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths? You made up many ridiculous thoughts you think are in my head but actually those are not my thoughts at all. My only thought is the government needs to tell me what my choices are and then what the rules are with those choices. As long as we listen to the experts we can end the pandemic.

Take your outrage somewhere else. Imjustlurking said he’s going to Florida and doesn’t give a rip about the unicorn variant… like wow!

Funny how you were all so proud of the consequences for the non vax… some of you even mock the unvaccinated.but as soon as they shrug their shoulders and say fine, I accept the restrictions but still not getting vaccinated all of a sudden your blood boils. What do you all think we need more consequences for the non vaccinated? Should we just make it mandatory for all… mandate the vaccine that’s not even designed for the unicorn variant, where we know it’s less effective anyways… but just make it mandatory so you feel safer? Oh wait a second, that sounds like I was making scientific sounding opinions… maybe I am to dumb to question this.

I realize I could complain and question our government, but you all told me I’m dumb and not an expert. Then when I say fine, I’m too dumb, I’ll just listen to the experts you are still outraged. If you don’t like the rules and choices the government laid out then let us know what needs to change.. apparently you all know better. I’m just going to be the dummy poopy head and follow the rules! Two more weeks!

[altiplano]

At AdventHealth Shawnee Mission, a hospital near Kansas City, Missouri, chief medical officer Dr. Lisa Hays said the emergency department is experiencing backups sometimes lasting for days.

“The beds are not the issue. It’s the nurses to staff the beds. ... And it’s all created by rising COVID numbers and burnout," Hays said. “Our nurses are burnt out.”

Is she lying then Anti Vaxers? Yes or no?

Wrong question - the question is what is her motivation, what is her bias.

Recent Google review of AdventHealth Shawnee Mission says the patient was in the ER with a cut and stitched up in 45 minutes... hardly a days long ER waits.

Also, what's the greater motivation of the article itself? Isolated and anecdotal quotes from a few people are not news. They are picked, probably not in context, to stoke a response, a feeling in broader society.

My friends and family in healthcare just shrug when I ask about this stuff... what pieces like this portray are not reflected in reality as the statistic posted above shows.

[photofly]

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths?

Statistically, more than if you were vaccinated.

Take your outrage somewhere else.

I’m not outraged. That’s you inventing thoughts you would like me to have in my head, so you can decry them. I’m actually puzzled and curious.

Funny how you were all so proud of the consequences for the non vax… some of you even mock the unvaccinated.but as soon as they shrug their shoulders and say fine, I accept the restrictions

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

[imjustlurking]

Photofly, how much Covid spread am I personally responsible for? How many deaths?

Statistically, more than if you were vaccinated.

Take your outrage somewhere else.

I’m not outraged. That’s you inventing thoughts you would like me to have in my head, so you can decry them. I’m actually puzzled and curious.

Funny how you were all so proud of the consequences for the non vax… some of you even mock the unvaccinated.but as soon as they shrug their shoulders and say fine, I accept the restrictions

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

It's annoy arguing with these people, eh?

Altiplano tries to annoy me by calling me a telemarketer because I worked as a call center agent for the Provincial Vaccine Contact Centre as my COVID job.

Others go around saying I'm not a pilot. I don't know why that would or should upset me. I'd be much more comfortable writing this reply from my own home instead of a random hotel.

Antivaxxers have run out of half-sensible arguments and are now working with fallacies. It's best to remind them that they're stupid and get on with your day.

[altiplano]

You talk in circles.

It was pointed out above, all the incremental restrictions starting from 2 weeks and on down to where we are today.

Vaccinated are responsible for spread, that's why they are dialing them down, instituting more shots, and you don't acknowledge that You just take it hook line and sinker and look to place blame on people that didn't follow what you have chosen for yourself but, as CYER pointed out, are following the rules.

You're a hysteric, pointing fingers, casting blame, it makes you feel good... you're on a pilot forum, you aren't a pilot, did I see you're a crew scheduler or something? No matter, you comment on everything looking for your morning dopamine hit by reciting the popular opinion.

Midwit doesn't even begin to describe your case.

[CYERCaptainPooping]

But they (you) don’t accept the risks and the costs, which we will pay for you.

Remember, I'm just a dummy. I have mitigated the risks and the costs because I have consequences for not being vaccinated, and like a dummy that I am I am following the guidelines and policy of our government. I have a choice to get vaccinated right? If I am given the choice then whats your problem? You are paying the same for the vaccinated people who still end up in hospital and still spread covid. Vaccinated people have more freedoms, so they could very well spread covid in settings where non vaccinated are not allowed. Thousands of vaccinated people are boarding planes where non vaccinated can't. If you don't like the policy, speak up... if you are the expert, let us know. What should the policy be? This is not the pandemic of the non vaccinated, its the pandemic of government policy. (should policy be more strict? should we change it?)

I think what you are saying is you don't accept the leadership and experts restrictions on the non vaccinated. is this the issue?

One things for certain, if you take away a non vaccinated persons employment, you definitely will be paying for them. They have no income, and don't pay taxes. But I didn't make this policy. I didn't support it, advocate for it, I don't even think its good policy. So yes you will be the one paying for everything that our taxes fund, but that's what the experts said needs to be done to solve the pandemic. Maybe you know better.