Chex, while I generally agree with your posts on ULCCs, this one goes to Soyer - I've seen it first hand. While I can't comment on specifics, the agreements made between Flair and (some) airports in regards to incentives were very favorable.Realitychex wrote: ↑Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:04 pmIf you actually believe that “some” airports are rebating the AIF to Flair via various schemes whilst charging all the other carriers operating there the full nut, please give me a call.Soyer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:25 pm I love the myopic vision of pilots AIF and airport fees are not what they seem. Most airports incentivize flights in various ways so they may take in $25 in an AIF but they return that with other hand based on the incentive structure. So is Flair eating the AIF - doubt it! But then again pilots know the financial end better than the finance guys!
I have a warehouse full of Sony Betamax machines that I’ll sell you for $50 each. You can easily sell them for $400 a pop on EBay.
$10 fare
Moderators: sky's the limit, sepia, Sulako, lilfssister, North Shore, I WAS Birddog
Re: $10 fare
Re: $10 fare
I'll take those betamaxes. PM for more details.Realitychex wrote: ↑Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:04 pmIf you actually believe that “some” airports are rebating the AIF to Flair via various schemes whilst charging all the other carriers operating there the full nut, please give me a call.Soyer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:25 pm I love the myopic vision of pilots AIF and airport fees are not what they seem. Most airports incentivize flights in various ways so they may take in $25 in an AIF but they return that with other hand based on the incentive structure. So is Flair eating the AIF - doubt it! But then again pilots know the financial end better than the finance guys!
I have a warehouse full of Sony Betamax machines that I’ll sell you for $50 each. You can easily sell them for $400 a pop on EBay.
Re: $10 fare
Flights are free now in Feb. Feel free to have the competition buy them all up too.
https://flights.flyflair.com/en-ca/sale?dc=FREEFAREFEB
https://flights.flyflair.com/en-ca/sale?dc=FREEFAREFEB
Re: $10 fare
Nice publicity to get people flying and to try the Flair brand, but hell, Jetsgo charged $1 for last min seats, and that didn't age well. Good luck.tbaylx wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:49 pm Flights are free now in Feb. Feel free to have the competition buy them all up too.
https://flights.flyflair.com/en-ca/sale?dc=FREEFAREFEB
-
- Rank 7
- Posts: 700
- Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:12 am
Re: $10 fare
My first thought too. I didn't think anyone would try to beat Jetsgo's last minute cash flow attempt.330heavy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:32 pmNice publicity to get people flying and to try the Flair brand, but hell, Jetsgo charged $1 for last min seats, and that didn't age well. Good luck.tbaylx wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:49 pm Flights are free now in Feb. Feel free to have the competition buy them all up too.
https://flights.flyflair.com/en-ca/sale?dc=FREEFAREFEB
If the $10 fares didn't work, the "free" fares come off as a desperate last grasp.
-
- Rank 5
- Posts: 383
- Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2020 8:28 pm
Re: $10 fare
So a $10 fare is a "desperate cash grab" to get cash flow, but free seats are somehow still a cash grab? You people are hilariousimjustlurking wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:44 pmMy first thought too. I didn't think anyone would try to beat Jetsgo's last minute cash flow attempt.330heavy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:32 pmNice publicity to get people flying and to try the Flair brand, but hell, Jetsgo charged $1 for last min seats, and that didn't age well. Good luck.tbaylx wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:49 pm Flights are free now in Feb. Feel free to have the competition buy them all up too.
https://flights.flyflair.com/en-ca/sale?dc=FREEFAREFEB
If the $10 fares didn't work, the "free" fares come off as a desperate last grasp.
Re: $10 fare
Cash grab in the sense of ancillaries such as bags, seats etc perhaps, but more of a promo than a cash grab IMO. Still impressive fares from what I randomly checked. Does Flair really need to offer 10 or free base fares? Every carrier has empty seats these days, and much like the pilot profession, it drags down the fares for others. No need to have a ticket cost less to cross the country than it does for the fare for the cab from the airport. I'm sure they could charge more for the same effect, but I'm no bean counter.
The Canadian market is about to get saturated, and the game of razor thin margins is a dangerous game.
The Canadian market is about to get saturated, and the game of razor thin margins is a dangerous game.
Re: $10 fare
The whole point of a ULCC is to drag down fares for passengers. There's also no need for a domestic ticket in Canada to cost more than flying to Europe. There will be plenty of competition this summer and that is a win for the public. Margins are within the airline's control and those with high CASM will certainly lose some market share to the ULCC's330heavy wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 3:33 pm Cash grab in the sense of ancillaries such as bags, seats etc perhaps, but more of a promo than a cash grab IMO. Still impressive fares from what I randomly checked. Does Flair really need to offer 10 or free base fares? Every carrier has empty seats these days, and much like the pilot profession, it drags down the fares for others. No need to have a ticket cost less to cross the country than it does for the fare for the cab from the airport. I'm sure they could charge more for the same effect, but I'm no bean counter.
The Canadian market is about to get saturated, and the game of razor thin margins is a dangerous game.
-
- Rank 7
- Posts: 700
- Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:12 am
Re: $10 fare
If you have empty seats, there isn't anyone in that seat that is paying for carry-on and checked bags, reservation fees, food, or drink.newlygrounded wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:21 pmSo a $10 fare is a "desperate cash grab" to get cash flow, but free seats are somehow still a cash grab? You people are hilariousimjustlurking wrote: ↑Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:44 pmMy first thought too. I didn't think anyone would try to beat Jetsgo's last minute cash flow attempt.
If the $10 fares didn't work, the "free" fares come off as a desperate last grasp.
Re: $10 fare
I would be curious to see passenger loads on Flair flights over the last 12 months, does anyone have any insight?
Re: $10 fare
Never flew them but they have pulled out of Thunder Bay for the time being. For that the loads must not be to good as we have a bunch of competition here that always has good loads, or the one cancellation Flair had gave such bad PR that they said forget you guys.
-
- Rank 5
- Posts: 339
- Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2008 7:59 am
Re: $10 fare
They pulled out for February but will resume flights starting in March.
Re: $10 fare
I heard they did well over the 2021 Summer season but really stalled out over the past few months only with a bump during Christmas. I've heard good things from K/W from last summer and over Christmas but right now it's a struggle to fill up seats in most markets it seems, hence why they cut back a lot of flights (they can blame COVID exposure, but its due to low demand right now). I'm actually shocked they're still gonna try flying to Mexico, especially seeing how low the bookings seem to be.
I'm really surprised they aren't trying to take some of Westjet's market share on the YYC hub flights to the east. Flights from YYC to Hamilton, London (ON), and Windsor could certainly work given they are only operated by Westjet. They seem to be pulling it off in K/W and previously did in Hamilton. Despite Westjet being extremely aggressive in defending its K/W market share, it looks like flair is getting a decent chunk of seats filled on the YKF-YYC route.
Re: $10 fare
Thanks for the info guys. Yes I was surprised as well with their expansion to Mexico, they seem all over the place with some of their route choices. I do think competition is good for everyone and I wish them well but I also hope they have qualified people keeping track of their finances. Perhaps they know something we don’t.