USA--Mask Mandate no Longer in Effect

[Loon-A-Tic]

They should put The Honourable Omar Alghabra on some flights to enforce mask mandates.

Since when was it a flight attendants job to enforce face decorations.

Owing to the of requirement of a federally regulated industry the cabin crew become the "point people" insuring compliance and therefore at risk of confrontation from those who might choose to be "a pill". As a Skipper I will fully support my cabin crew in their efforts. All non-compliance will be meet with removal from the flight prior to departure or a great by local law enforcement on arrival.

[Tolip]

They should put The Honourable Omar Alghabra on some flights to enforce mask mandates.

Since when was it a flight attendants job to enforce face decorations.

Owing to the of requirement of a Federally regulated industry the cabin crew become the "point people" insuring compliance and therefore at risk of confrontation from those who might choose to be "a pill". As a Skipper I will fully support my cabin crew in their efforts. All non-compliance will be meet with removal from the flight prior to departure or a great by local law enforcement on arrival.

As pilots, are we not trained to de-escalate situations on board. And do we not have very defined rules for escalation of non compliance? And aren't we also trained to just stay out of situations like this and leave it to the FA's. Your sounding like you have some type of personal vendetta over the mask mandate. I would hope you wouldn't just rip someone off a plane and have them arrested at the first sign of non compliance, surely you have more resilience and professionalism then that... what about kids, people with special needs, breathing problems, legit doctors notes, taking a picture for a brief moment. As a skipper, what you should be doing, is being professional, using good judgment, following the rules and supporting your FA's decision either FOR or AGAINST removing someone from the flight.

[Loon-A-Tic]

They should put The Honourable Omar Alghabra on some flights to enforce mask mandates.

Since when was it a flight attendants job to enforce face decorations.

Owing to the of requirement of a Federally regulated industry the cabin crew become the "point people" insuring compliance and therefore at risk of confrontation from those who might choose to be "a pill". As a Skipper I will fully support my cabin crew in their efforts. All non-compliance will be meet with removal from the flight prior to departure or a great by local law enforcement on arrival.

As pilots, are we not trained to de-escalate situations on board. And do we not have very defined rules for escalation of non compliance? And aren't we also trained to just stay out of situations like this and leave it to the FA's. Your sounding like you have some type of personal vendetta over the mask mandate. I would hope you wouldn't just rip someone off a plane and have them arrested at the first sign of non compliance, surely you have more resilience and professionalism then that... what about kids, people with special needs, breathing problems, legit doctors notes, taking a picture for a brief moment. As a skipper, what you should be doing, is being professional, using good judgment, following the rules and supporting your FA's decision either FOR or AGAINST removing someone from the flight.

You are absolutely correct it is within the skills & abilities of the cabin crew to de-escalate and in my experience they are very good at it. However in the event the cabin crew feel the situtation is untenable de-escalation now takes the form of removal, further negotiations become pointless.

[Tolip]

Owing to the of requirement of a Federally regulated industry the cabin crew become the "point people" insuring compliance and therefore at risk of confrontation from those who might choose to be "a pill". As a Skipper I will fully support my cabin crew in their efforts. All non-compliance will be meet with removal from the flight prior to departure or a great by local law enforcement on arrival.

As pilots, are we not trained to de-escalate situations on board. And do we not have very defined rules for escalation of non compliance? And aren't we also trained to just stay out of situations like this and leave it to the FA's. Your sounding like you have some type of personal vendetta over the mask mandate. I would hope you wouldn't just rip someone off a plane and have them arrested at the first sign of non compliance, surely you have more resilience and professionalism then that... what about kids, people with special needs, breathing problems, legit doctors notes, taking a picture for a brief moment. As a skipper, what you should be doing, is being professional, using good judgment, following the rules and supporting your FA's decision either FOR or AGAINST removing someone from the flight.

You are absolutely correct it is within the skills & abilities of the cabin crew to de-escalate and in my experience they are very good at it. However in the event the cabin crew feel the situtation is untenable de-escalation now take the from of removal, further negotiations become pointless.

Totally, fair point. It's probably something worth thinking about. Because I'm guessing on canada - US flights, theres gunna be lots of unruly's and non compliance now with this rule change.. its honistly going to be quite frustrating. As now we are one of the only countries still enforcing this rule.

[Loon-A-Tic]

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, full stop.

[digits_]

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, full stop.

Let me correct that for you:

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, allowed by the economic realities imposed by the company and regulators.

The safest way would be either not to fly, or to fly without passengers. Or be on full respirators all the time. All of those would be safer than what you have to day.

[Loon-A-Tic]

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, full stop.

Let me correct that for you:

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, allowed by the economic realities imposed by the company and regulators.

The safest way would be either not to fly, or to fly without passengers. Or be on full respirators all the time. All of those would be safer than what you have to day.

That's NOT a correction, that's YOUR opinion and I would thank you to NOT paint me with YOUR brush.

[WellThatAgedWell]

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, full stop.

Let me correct that for you:

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, allowed by the economic realities imposed by the company and regulators.

The safest way would be either not to fly, or to fly without passengers. Or be on full respirators all the time. All of those would be safer than what you have to day.

That's NOT a correction, that's YOUR opinion and I would thank you to NOT paint me with YOUR brush.

It’s a fact that respirator is better than cloth masking.

Maybe someone can pull this stunt but on the airplane…

The Toronto District School Board (TDSB) is investigating a teacher who has been placed on home assignment after he sent a hostile email to students claiming that those without masks are “maybe even killing me” and that any unmasked students will need to sit outside in the hallway or face “detentions and other consequences.”

https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/ ... mask-email

Safety first! Or you are possibly killing me! have we reached peak crazy yet?

[digits_]

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, full stop.

Let me correct that for you:

I have one agenda and one agenda only. That's to operated the airplane in the safety manor possible and create the safety possible working enviroment for my collegues, allowed by the economic realities imposed by the company and regulators.

The safest way would be either not to fly, or to fly without passengers. Or be on full respirators all the time. All of those would be safer than what you have to day.

That's NOT a correction, that's YOUR opinion and I would thank you to NOT paint me with YOUR brush.

It's a fact that you won't die in a plane crash if you don't fly. Ergo, you're not being as safe as possible.

Every safety measure is limited by economics. You can only be as safe as the company allows you to be. The option you have if your level of safety is not met, is to turn down the flight and/or to quit the company. That's it.

That's an economic reality. Every pilot (or pax or person alive) is facing those restrictions.

[ReserveTank]

Yesterday's count:

Out of 143 pax, 3 were masked. A reminder that mask policy revolved around the fringe minority, as did covid policy and the associated statistics.
Our airline sent us a memo before the ink dried on the ruling. The crew areas were instantly unmasked.
We had a great "first day back," with upbeat flight crews. It was great to see smiling again. We were denied normal human interaction for two years, so yesterday was a happy and important day.

So your clearly not a Canadian air carrier, all rules still apply within Canada and for passenger flights inbound to Canada. I would hope you support your cabin crews as there are faced with potentially confrontational situations.

I follow the escalation policy of my Company Operations Manual. If the cabin crew report a legitimate escalation, I pass it to the proper authorities. That's the required support. I NEVER go face-to-face if there is an escalation. That's what ops and law enforcement are for. Walking to the back to "sort it out" is a great way to face litigation, termination, and career loss.

[altiplano]

So what are you saying he's full of crap about?

"vaccines don't do all that much."
" It will save a small percentage of lives"

I thought that was obvious, since we were just talking about it and I'd posted evidence, which he/she/they ignored.

Are you asserting that vaccines save a large percentage of lives?

Because people at risk of a serious outcome were already a very small percentage without the vaccine.

Most people, particularly those without comorbidities, that took a vaccine would not have had a serious outcome had they contracted SARS-CoV-2 unvaccinated. That's a fact. Also we know that these vaccines did not prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2. That's a fact. Also we know that most people will get SARS-CoV-2 anyway in spite of extremely high uptake in the population. That's a fact. So are they doing all that much? I guess that's subjective.

Did these vaccines have a role in protecting some of the vulnerable population from a serious outcome? Sure. But it's correct that it's a small percentage of lives. That's a fact.

[CpnCrunch]

Are you asserting that vaccines save a large percentage of lives?

Because people at risk of a serious outcome were already a very small percentage without the vaccine.

Most people, particularly those without comorbidities, that took a vaccine would not have had a serious outcome had they contracted SARS-CoV-2 unvaccinated. That's a fact. Also we know that these vaccines did not prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2. That's a fact. Also we know that most people will get SARS-CoV-2 anyway in spite of extremely high uptake in the population. That's a fact. So are they doing all that much? I guess that's subjective.

Did these vaccines have a role in protecting some of the vulnerable population from a serious outcome? Sure. But it's correct that it's a small percentage of lives. That's a fact.

That's not true. The "vulnerable group" is basically everyone over 50:

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covi ... #AgeAndSex

And prior to Omicron, vaccines led to a 90+ % reduction in mortality from covid:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamane ... le/2785597

So I'm not sure why you feel the need to continue posting this ridiculous unsupported crap here.

[altiplano]

Are you asserting that vaccines save a large percentage of lives?

Because people at risk of a serious outcome were already a very small percentage without the vaccine.

Most people, particularly those without comorbidities, that took a vaccine would not have had a serious outcome had they contracted SARS-CoV-2 unvaccinated. That's a fact. Also we know that these vaccines did not prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2. That's a fact. Also we know that most people will get SARS-CoV-2 anyway in spite of extremely high uptake in the population. That's a fact. So are they doing all that much? I guess that's subjective.

Did these vaccines have a role in protecting some of the vulnerable population from a serious outcome? Sure. But it's correct that it's a small percentage of lives. That's a fact.

That's not true. The "vulnerable group" is basically everyone over 50:

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covi ... #AgeAndSex

And prior to Omicron, vaccines led to a 90+ % reduction in mortality from covid:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamane ... le/2785597

So I'm not sure why you feel the need to continue posting this ridiculous unsupported crap here.

It's straight math. You aren't grasping that most people weren't at significant risk from SARS-CoV-2, vaccine or not.

Pre-vaccine the death rate was so low to be statistically insignificant among everyone except vulnerable people, old people, and those with comorbidities. Even among those vulnerable people and those in poor health it was on a track not too different than other illnesses that could affect them seriously, respiratory illnesses, norovirus, and others. It certainly wasn't a death sentence though and death rates were in the low single digit percentage range or even lower dependant on unrecognized statistical errors like undiagnosed asymptomatic cases that didn't present, and misdiagnosed cases that were assumed as covid but weren't, and of those many of course died with SARS-CoV-2 not from Covid.

So given that adverse outcomes already affected a very small percentage of an already small section of the the population it's incorrect to say that the vaccines made a difference for a "large percentage of people" unless by large percentage you mean less than 1% of the population.

Lots of people who would have otherwise had an adverse outcome, sure, but that was already a small percentage of all people. For most people it didn't make much of a difference, it and it didn't stop them from contracting or spreading it.

[WellThatAgedWell]

CpnCrunch is off the rails

If there was no vax, covid fatalities would look similar. Omicron is mild like a cold.