Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

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Rather be
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by Rather be »

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Last edited by Rather be on Sat Nov 26, 2022 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
benjamini1000
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by benjamini1000 »

Thank you to everyone who answered. It was insightful advice. you are right photofly that this system was setup for a month long wait and is now a nightmare to navigate due to the 1-2 year wait time.

I read the TC requirements for examiners and do not seem to see anything that would prevent me from being approved yet I have a strong feeling that the review board is stuck in outdated ways that does not treat mental health properly and I fear that I will be reject arbitrarily. Either way, there doesnt seem to be anything I can do at this time.
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Bede
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by Bede »

My CAME told me that ADHD is an absolute disqualification for a medical. I had ADHD and was on Ritalin as a kid as have a disproportionate number of pilots. I’ve disclosed this and had no issue. They know that boys have a hard time sitting still and are frequently over diagnosed. When I first disclosed this I just said that I got the diagnosis after I was bored in class and couldn’t sit still.
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Rwy17
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by Rwy17 »

I guess heres an update on what ended up happening.

After i got my initial emergency treatment, and had my medical verbally revoked by my CAME, I started all of my required follow up treatment for the condition that I had.

I essentially harassed the TC office to try and get an answer on what needed to be done to get clearance again. They said that after I finish my follow up treatment that I had planned (which was extensive, but was done in a short time frame), if I could get a clean bill from the specialist, they’d clear me. I made it clear that i would likely be fit for work within 3 weeks, and i did not want to be sitting around while perfectly healthy waiting for TC to review my case.


When I got the clean bill, I sent in the report to TC, called them again to let them know it had been sent, and had a letter saying I was cleared to fly the same day. I was back at work within 3-4 weeks, though did have some minor follow up care needed in the months following.

Especially if you are out of work, calling them on a DAILY basis will likely help. It did for me, and I got answers within a respectable time frame. Take the situation into your hands, and bug them until you get an answer. Thats what we pay for.
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W5
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by W5 »

If you get past the CAME it is no certainty that the RAMO will go along with it. Be prepared for nasty surprises.
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benjamini1000
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by benjamini1000 »

So a little update a few months after I asked some questions regarding my ADHD and if they would approve me for my Cat 1 Medical Certificate. I have finally received a letter from Civil Aviation Medicine (Ontario Region) and they informed me that given my specific circumstances, They are unable to proceed with my application until they receive more information. (Im obviously paraphrasing). They are requesting another letter from my GP to confirm that I have not been on medication for over 6 months, A new Neuropsychological evaluation, and a psychiatrist to sign off on my safety. It can sometimes be really frustrating dealing with all these additional hurdles but Im hoping to just push through and eventually get my final approval. (although it will take an extra few months and definitely a few extra thousand dollars)
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Bede
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by Bede »

benjamini1000 wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:13 pm So a little update a few months after I asked some questions regarding my ADHD and if they would approve me for my Cat 1 Medical Certificate. I have finally received a letter from Civil Aviation Medicine (Ontario Region) and they informed me that given my specific circumstances, They are unable to proceed with my application until they receive more information. (Im obviously paraphrasing). They are requesting another letter from my GP to confirm that I have not been on medication for over 6 months, A new Neuropsychological evaluation, and a psychiatrist to sign off on my safety. It can sometimes be really frustrating dealing with all these additional hurdles but Im hoping to just push through and eventually get my final approval. (although it will take an extra few months and definitely a few extra thousand dollars)
That's good news. Keep jumping through the hoops and let us know how it turns out.
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RatherBeFlying
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by RatherBeFlying »

Childhood conditions, such as asthma and ADHD, commonly resolve themselves by adulthood. Until TC requires reports from your pediatrician, don't ask mommy and daddy for help filling out your TC medical form.

My GP spotted an elevated blood glucose level and sent me to the dietician. In the mean time I cut cookies and chips out of my diet and brought my blood glucose down without meds. A fellow pilot is an MD. His advice is not to mention it to TC.

That said, if you need to take any prescription drug on an ongoing basis, you have to report it.

I've had dental work and been prescribed antibiotics. I haven't reported it.
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photofly
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by photofly »

RatherBeFlying wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 9:06 pm Childhood conditions, such as asthma and ADHD, commonly resolve themselves by adulthood. Until TC requires reports from your pediatrician, don't ask mommy and daddy for help filling out your TC medical form.
I think the point here is that the (adult) poster has a current and active diagnosis of ADHD, and a prescription for drugs to ameliorate its symptoms, to be taken as needed. Your CAME will certainly ask you if you have been prescribed OR taken any treatments. You can't duck the question because although your physician wrote you a prescription you decided not to fill or use take the pills.
I've had dental work and been prescribed antibiotics. I haven't reported it.
Respectfully, you should have, and didn't. Not something to recommend to others.
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Bede
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by Bede »

photofly wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 5:51 am Your CAME will certainly ask you if you have been prescribed OR taken any treatments.
It's actually even broader. They ask"have you ever been investigated for ...?"
So even if you've had some symptoms and sent for testing and it was negative they want to know about it.
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7ECA
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by 7ECA »

Right from the form, the question is: "Has the applicant consulted a physician or other healthcare provider since their last aviation medical?"

Later, after being questioned on a whole host of conditions/ailments, you're asked; in the past twelve months has the applicant: "Used ANY medication to treat a medical condition? (This includes prescription, non-prescription, over-the-counter, herbal medications,
cannabis, or cannabis-derived products. Examples: acetaminophen for backpain, cannabis for anxiety, cannabidiol (CBD) for chronic pain) (If yes, please list medication name, dose, and route of administration, frequency, and reason for use)"


Seems pretty straight forward, they're not trying to yank your medical if you've taken an Advil or a Tylenol or fifty in the previous year... but a history of significant use of painkillers, OTC meds, or other things could require a second look.

As for your GP, they have a duty to inform TC/RAMO if you are being treated for a condition (or placed on meds) that could interfere with your ability to hold an aviation medical.
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Negative_Unable
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by Negative_Unable »

benjamini1000 wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 9:42 pm So I have been reading this thread and would like to ask some relevant questions. First a bit of context.

I am of relatively standard normal health with two specific exceptions. I was diagnosed temporarily by my GP with an episode of depression (it was minor and there were no relevant danger to myself or others) this was about a year ago and I was prescribed an SSRI to cope which I have been off for over 6 months as I no longer need it. I am also fully diagnosed with ADHD which I was prescribed meds for specifically 'AS NEEDED' (while I was in university) which I have not needed or taken in well over 6 months. I am new to the Aviation community and am currently looking to acquire my PPL.

When I spoke to a CAME, the guy was unbelievably condescending and he found it necessary to twist my words to make it seem like I need my meds but refuse to take them. To be clear, I have received a letter from my GP specifying that I no longer require my meds, That I am of sound mind, and I have not needed my medication for over 6 months.

That letter is being forwarded to TC to add to my file as I wait for my Medical Certification.

Question 1. What is the likelihood I would be rejected from getting my Cat 1 certificate due to the situation I've described? If its High, What can I do (that isn't unreasonably expensive) to reduce the risk?

Question 2. Because I have an existing condition, How do I acquire my Cat 4 certificate? Do I submit it through the normal channels alongside my letter from my GP? Do I need to speak to a CAME? (When I asked this to the CAME I met with, he said he wouldn't sign off on my Cat 4 declaration because of my existing conditions.)

Question 3. If I am not eligible for a Cat 1, will the review board automatically consider me for a cat3? or do I need to reapply once I hear back?

To be clear, I can confidently say that I have not had a depression episode in over 6 months nor have I needed medication in that period, It was a clear one time occurrence.
As for my ADHD, I am fully able to function in society without severe challenges outside of an educational setting. I have never had difficulty operating a vehicle nor have I had any real world challenges that would make me unfit to fly an aircraft. I know its the duty of the CAME to keep the skies safe yet there is no real reason I should be dismissed from my conditions aside from potential arbitrary rules.
While I can’t speak for your exact situation, I did email TC (prairie region) because I wanted to recommend a friend for ATC but he was diagnosed with ADHD. He was also taking medication. Keep in mind this is for a CAT 2, but this was the exact response:

“All ADHD medications are disqualifying. Any applicant must be 3 mos free of meds with proven mood stability, Psych report and follow-ups for a period of time.”

So take from that what you will!
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hithere
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by hithere »

benjamini1000 wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:13 pm So a little update a few months after I asked some questions regarding my ADHD and if they would approve me for my Cat 1 Medical Certificate. I have finally received a letter from Civil Aviation Medicine (Ontario Region) and they informed me that given my specific circumstances, They are unable to proceed with my application until they receive more information. (Im obviously paraphrasing). They are requesting another letter from my GP to confirm that I have not been on medication for over 6 months, A new Neuropsychological evaluation, and a psychiatrist to sign off on my safety. It can sometimes be really frustrating dealing with all these additional hurdles but Im hoping to just push through and eventually get my final approval. (although it will take an extra few months and definitely a few extra thousand dollars)
Are they asking for a Neuropsychological evaluation or Neurocognitive evaluation? Neuroocognitive tests are often required by TC after head injuries and cost over $3000 to do privately.
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7ECA
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by 7ECA »

Scheduled a telemedicine renewal for my Cat. 1... CAME filled out the standard medical form, but only the first two pages, and submitted it to Transport. Well... good thing I only paid $110 for that debacle.
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rigpiggy
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine

Post by rigpiggy »

Best advice I can give is to record all discussions with your doctor and tc, and follow up with an email with read/receipt on everything.
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bb9999
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by bb9999 »

benjamini1000 wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:13 pm So a little update a few months after I asked some questions regarding my ADHD and if they would approve me for my Cat 1 Medical Certificate. I have finally received a letter from Civil Aviation Medicine (Ontario Region) and they informed me that given my specific circumstances, They are unable to proceed with my application until they receive more information. (Im obviously paraphrasing). They are requesting another letter from my GP to confirm that I have not been on medication for over 6 months, A new Neuropsychological evaluation, and a psychiatrist to sign off on my safety. It can sometimes be really frustrating dealing with all these additional hurdles but Im hoping to just push through and eventually get my final approval. (although it will take an extra few months and definitely a few extra thousand dollars)
I am trying to get my Cat 2 right now and going through the exact same thing... Quotes ranging from $2000-5500 for the evals.. It's insane...
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bb9999
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by bb9999 »

hithere wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 5:50 pm
benjamini1000 wrote: Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:13 pm So a little update a few months after I asked some questions regarding my ADHD and if they would approve me for my Cat 1 Medical Certificate. I have finally received a letter from Civil Aviation Medicine (Ontario Region) and they informed me that given my specific circumstances, They are unable to proceed with my application until they receive more information. (Im obviously paraphrasing). They are requesting another letter from my GP to confirm that I have not been on medication for over 6 months, A new Neuropsychological evaluation, and a psychiatrist to sign off on my safety. It can sometimes be really frustrating dealing with all these additional hurdles but Im hoping to just push through and eventually get my final approval. (although it will take an extra few months and definitely a few extra thousand dollars)
Are they asking for a Neuropsychological evaluation or Neurocognitive evaluation? Neuroocognitive tests are often required by TC after head injuries and cost over $3000 to do privately.

Got the same letter (albeit for CAT 2)

They want the testing done by a Neuropsych.. quotes for me so far have been up which sucks since I have no insurance but unforutnately a cost that has to be paid...

These guys took 7 months to get back to me with my medical and now I have less than a month before my course starts to get this all sorted its such a fucking headahce...
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stream42
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by stream42 »

bb9999 wrote: Mon Mar 06, 2023 4:03 pm
Got the same letter (albeit for CAT 2)

They want the testing done by a Neuropsych.. quotes for me so far have been up which sucks since I have no insurance but unforutnately a cost that has to be paid...

These guys took 7 months to get back to me with my medical and now I have less than a month before my course starts to get this all sorted its such a fucking headahce...
Any update on this, bb?
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bb9999
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by bb9999 »

stream42 wrote: Fri May 05, 2023 12:15 pm
bb9999 wrote: Mon Mar 06, 2023 4:03 pm
Got the same letter (albeit for CAT 2)

They want the testing done by a Neuropsych.. quotes for me so far have been up which sucks since I have no insurance but unforutnately a cost that has to be paid...

These guys took 7 months to get back to me with my medical and now I have less than a month before my course starts to get this all sorted its such a fucking headahce...
Any update on this, bb?

Started the course and I have until August or something like that to get my medical.

They will help me expedite the process once I send in the additional documents (which will be roughly next week)
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WhyMe1993
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Re: Dealing with Civil Aviation Medicine (Update)

Post by WhyMe1993 »

bb9999 wrote: Fri May 12, 2023 2:01 pm
stream42 wrote: Fri May 05, 2023 12:15 pm
bb9999 wrote: Mon Mar 06, 2023 4:03 pm
Got the same letter (albeit for CAT 2)

They want the testing done by a Neuropsych.. quotes for me so far have been up which sucks since I have no insurance but unforutnately a cost that has to be paid...

These guys took 7 months to get back to me with my medical and now I have less than a month before my course starts to get this all sorted its such a fucking headahce...
Any update on this, bb?

Started the course and I have until August or something like that to get my medical.

They will help me expedite the process once I send in the additional documents (which will be roughly next week)
how did it go? also what were the documents you had to send? did you have to take a neuro cog screen?
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