QOL for commuters

[yhz41]

What's life at Rouge like these days? I thought it was kind of the golden egg for commuters at one point?

[jpilot77]

What's life at Rouge like these days? I thought it was kind of the golden egg for commuters at one point?

It was socialized bidding before COVID, but it is now mainline working conditions.

[PostmasterGeneral]

What's life at Rouge like these days? I thought it was kind of the golden egg for commuters at one point?

Unfortunately, the only REAL way to make commuting a non-issue is seniority. Helps both in schedule bidding, and in the commute itself.

[altiplano]

NB maximum is 14-16 days a month depending on DBM, very occasionally I do better than the maximum by a day or 2. I'm about 30% block holder. Seniority makes the commute better, group pairings into work periods choose pairings you can same-day fly in/out on, etc.

It should be better here, there is no doubt. But they want us working more.

The pressure they constantly apply on every corner of the contract they can is brutal. They have multiple full time staff whose only job is to fück us.

Know the contract, they will cut corners if you allow them, fly your block.

A big problem is optimizing in our PBS program, which while optimal for them is not optimal for us, it subverts seniority by swapping flying from senior blocks as it no longer can build legal blocks, this allows them to build inefficient pairings irrespective of their staffing levels because it all gets shuffled in somehow anyway.

We need control and a say in our pairings.

We used to be allowed a maximum 900 DBM hours per year (avg. 75/mo) we're now up to 996 (avg. 83/mo) and they were going for 1020 in the last MOA that was voted down.

Thank a generation of union leadership that thought working more was a raise.

The LCC "see, socialized was better" suggestion is a red herring because the flying they did was almost all the most productive flying that was taken away from mainline and adversely affected those blocks. Put out a LCC pairing package of primarily 6.5-10 hour/day credit pairings of course you get better blocks.

But also realize, the corporation was invested in the division that the LCC created, they nurtured that appearance of LCC-contract-is-better while it served them, they were meanwhile always looking for how to, and intending to, optimize those schedules as they could (guys paid to fück us). Observe the Repatriation Flying coming in from the '17 reopener, YQM, YQT, YQB, etc. Remember it was supposed to be completely separate fins too? How'd that work out?

I'm not so sure that all the long single days at the LCC suit a commuter that well anyway unless you really like your crash pad mates.

WB? Used to be pretty F-n good. Even junior blocks. Max days? Don't need it! But remember optimizing and the guys whose only job is to fück us. Blocks on the 767 started taking a dump, now the 330... and with no China flying and no Russian airspace, productivity on the 777 & 787 is down. Geopolitics change though... but remember they want you at work more and will come however they can (ie. 88hrs, 1020hrs).

Know the contract, follow the contract, tell them NO, don't extend, fly your block, book off fatigued. It's as simple as that.

[Col. Panic]

By 2019, Rouge flying was not necessarily all the high productivity pairings… you mixed high credit turns with extremely low credit (no DPG meant we had 3 day pairings worth 6 hours) Regional Replacement flying, and seemed to work 16 days every month. I still liked it, but it wasn’t the same as the early days of Rogue where you could work 9 days of turns or more days with nice layovers. The 77:30 MMG and 2.5x draft were welcome additions.

On the main topic… I have commuted for my 5 years at AC. I don’t recommend it, if you can avoid commuting, but it is manageable. I have been commuting as a very junior reserve pilot for the past 6 months, and it’s not as bad as I thought it might be… but that may depend a bit on fleet type and seat. I only rarely have to sit for a whole day at the crash pad, they seem to use me most of the days I’m available… which I like, because if I’m going to bother to commute, I would much rather fly than sit.
With the “best fit” reserve rules, there is no chance of being senior enough to pass on everything and stay home! The good news is that as long as hiring continues, you won’t be at the bottom of the list for long, and even a junior block holder probably gets a more commuter friendly schedule that a pilot on reserve. We have some of the worst reserve rules in the business, and QOL for reserve pilots has not been a priority for negotiations in the past, as sitting on reserve is a “choice” for most, at least according to some of our (former, thankfully) leaders.

[Fanblade]

Air Canada does not have a commuter policy. AC has a letter on your file if you don’t make it to work policy.

If you want to commute I suggest an airline that has a viable policy. AC does not have one.

If they won’t pay a livable wage for the city you are based in, AND won’t provide a proper commuting policy as a substitute. What does that tell you?

[Malfunction]

Shit company!

[garfield]

Commuting, good luck with that in the long term.. AIF's tripling, flight reductions.

From my hometown there use to be 3 daily flights to the closest hub, now it's 1...

[Curiousflyer]

Whats the QOL like for AC pilots who commute? Any insight from anyone living in Calgary would be appreciated.

And what are the upgrade times like? How many hours do you need to upgrade?

There are a ton of Calgary commuters. AC travel passes are based on seniority, so if another pilot is trying to commute on the same flight as you, they will have priority over you for getting the flight. Junior NB FO’s based in YVR are doing days 18-20 days a month. WB is more right now, but could come down if/when China opens back.

The best gig right now for Calgary Commuters is YVR 787 RP, as there are direct FRA and LHR pairings that start and end with a DH from YVR to YYC. As a commuter, you can cancel and bank your DH and just drive to the airport in Calgary for your flight. However, to get any of these flights you’ll need at least 3-4 years of seniority. There are 787 RP’s with 7-8 years that have effectively made YYC a base, as all of their pairings start and end out of YYC.

[bcflyer]

Keep in mind that if you are commuting on AC metal you are first in line for the JS. I’ve done more YVR-YYC/YEG and YYZ-YOW/YUL than I’d like to admit and we rarely have anyone in the JS.

[fixnfly]

Keep in mind that if you are commuting on AC metal you are first in line for the JS. I’ve done more YVR-YYC/YEG and YYZ-YOW/YUL than I’d like to admit and we rarely have anyone in the JS.

Is there a flight attendant JS that you can usually take as well? If they're doing training and won't let JS in the cockpit or there is a more senior pilot? It would be nice especially if there's a couple pilots looking to commute on a full flight

[digits_]

I am wondering, with all the hiring going on, have there been cases of pilots being fired for things like missing a reserve because they didn't think they were going to get called out etc? Or do people just not do that?

[lownslow]

Is there a flight attendant JS that you can usually take as well? If they're doing training and won't let JS in the cockpit or there is a more senior pilot? It would be nice especially if there's a couple pilots looking to commute on a full flight

There are enough commuters that odds are someone on the FD commutes and thinks it’s a dick move to deny the jumpseat. I’ve even had jumpseaters during my own training, though I suppose there’s no guarantee anyone else would extend the courtesy. As far as extra FA seats go those are available too on some equipment though I’m not sure what the hierarchy of priority there is, maybe a standby FA gets it before a pilot.

[bcflyer]

I am wondering, with all the hiring going on, have there been cases of pilots being fired for things like missing a reserve because they didn't think they were going to get called out etc? Or do people just not do that?

I haven’t heard of anyone doing that recently. In the past reserve was pretty predictable but with best fit it’s pretty hard to figure out who’s going to get what. It’s definitely not advisable. As for the consequences, my guess would be a couple strikes and you would be out.

[jpilot77]

Keep in mind that if you are commuting on AC metal you are first in line for the JS. I’ve done more YVR-YYC/YEG and YYZ-YOW/YUL than I’d like to admit and we rarely have anyone in the JS.

Is there a flight attendant JS that you can usually take as well? If they're doing training and won't let JS in the cockpit or there is a more senior pilot? It would be nice especially if there's a couple pilots looking to commute on a full flight

I’ve used a flight attendant jumpseat. Pretty rare occurrence.

[RippleRock]

I recommend that anyone who wants to be respected and compensated properly in aviation steer clear.

There is a full on WACON nightmare going on that isn't going away anytime soon

[Crewbunk]

Shit company!

Today’s new hire class included candidates from Westjet, Transat, Sunwing, Flair, Lynx and Swoop. Until that changes, things like a Commuter Policy and Flat Pay will not change.

[Crewbunk]

The best gig right now for Calgary Commuters is YVR 787 RP, as there are direct FRA and LHR pairings that start and end with a DH from YVR to YYC. As a commuter, you can cancel and bank your DH and just drive to the airport in Calgary for your flight. However, to get any of these flights you’ll need at least 3-4 years of seniority. There are 787 RP’s with 7-8 years that have effectively made YYC a base, as all of their pairings start and end out of YYC.

All three positions, CA, FO and RP, on the YYC to LHR/FRA start with a DH between YVR and YYC. But beware, on a memo from “higher up” Crew Scheduling has not been granting releases from the DH. So YYC commuters have had to commute from YYC to YVR to DH from YVR to YYC to begin their pairing!

Also, the YYC-LHR flight is a week long marathon that adds LHR-BOM to the adventure.

It works both ways though. Apparently, some YYC commuters who were a ready resource for IRROPS out of YYC are now demanding their “draft” starts in their base, (YYZ or YVR). As they are saying to C/S, you can’t have it both ways!

[Dronepiper]

[/quote]

All three positions, CA, FO and RP, on the YYC to LHR/FRA start with a DH between YVR and YYC. But beware, on a memo from “higher up” Crew Scheduling has not been granting releases from the DH. So YYC commuters have had to commute from YYC to YVR to DH from YVR to YYC to begin their pairing!

[/quote]


Unreallllllllll. Everyone thinks AC is the end all be all, but when they pull stunts like this, it just really makes you question your decisions. Like what purpose does this serve other than to piss off every commuting pilot?? I don’t see any benefit to this. This would never happen at WJ.

[twa22]

The best gig right now for Calgary Commuters is YVR 787 RP, as there are direct FRA and LHR pairings that start and end with a DH from YVR to YYC. As a commuter, you can cancel and bank your DH and just drive to the airport in Calgary for your flight. However, to get any of these flights you’ll need at least 3-4 years of seniority. There are 787 RP’s with 7-8 years that have effectively made YYC a base, as all of their pairings start and end out of YYC.

All three positions, CA, FO and RP, on the YYC to LHR/FRA start with a DH between YVR and YYC. But beware, on a memo from “higher up” Crew Scheduling has not been granting releases from the DH. So YYC commuters have had to commute from YYC to YVR to DH from YVR to YYC to begin their pairing!

Why on earth would someone who is in YYC have to commute on their own dime to YVR, to then have the company DH them back to YYC

What interest or benefit does crew sched get from forcing someone to DH from YVR? That's the most non sensical thing I've read in a while. It doesn't benefit any party (at least in my mind it doesn't)

I'm not aiming this at you by the way, I'm just trying to understand the logic here