Hiring after DECEMBER

[belgianmoon]

Good Day all,

What is hiring going to look like after December 2nd .
Thanks .
no fights-only swearing allowed

[GetAGripen]

Was told they were running groundschools every month, no sign of change.

[averageatbest]

Good Day all,

What is hiring going to look like after December 2nd .
Thanks .
no fights-only swearing allowed

There is a class starting December 2. Following that I assume that classes will continue.

[YC87DRVR]

Significantly more leaving than they could even hope to hire. Expect hiring to continue indefinitely.

[averageatbest]

Significantly more leaving than they could even hope to hire. Expect hiring to continue indefinitely.

A healthy company is usually hiring as well.

The "more leaving [than joining]" comment is what tells the story.

[YC87DRVR]

Significantly more leaving than they could even hope to hire. Expect hiring to continue indefinitely.

A healthy company is usually hiring as well.

The "more leaving [than joining]" comment is what tells the story.

Experience leaving for well anyone with a pilot’s license, also not a good sign.

[Canadaflyer46]

Will be interesting to see the experience level of new hires from December. For years there's been a PTA/flow carrot to dangle for new hires, even if that did mean 6 or so years to get the chance. From December onwards you'll no longer get a position on the "WestJet group of companies" pilot list. Considering one could just apply directly to WestJet with 1500 hours, I can't see anyone with anything close to this experience level applying to Encore still. Perhaps they'll finally get chance to put their 250 hour program into place that has been anticipated for so long.

[kiaszceski]

It seems that depending on the interview results, candidates are proposed with either a spot at Westjet or a spot at Encore.
The recruitment team is the one deciding.

Curious to see how this will work out in 2023.

[GetAGripen]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

[kiaszceski]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

Encore.

[Canadaflyer46]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

I’d hold out for mainline and not get marooned at Encore if you have that amount of time. Mainline is currently averaging 1 pilot a day quitting for AC. Yet next year they planned to hire 400. So that’ll be more like 800 new pilots they’ll need if they stick to their plan. I won’t be surprised at all to see them to go below 1500 hours soon. It’s either drop the experience requirements yet again, or start paying more to attract pilots. Hmm I wonder which they’ll go for.

[skyhighh]

Stay out of Encore if you can. Without the PTA there is literally no reason to go there.

[FlyAlberta]

Stay out of Encore if you can. Without the PTA there is literally no reason to go there.

Unless, of course, you’re looking to time build to get your ATPL hours. That would be about the only reason right now.

[averageatbest]

Stay out of Encore if you can. Without the PTA there is literally no reason to go there.

Unless, of course, you’re looking to time build to get your ATPL hours. That would be about the only reason right now.

If you want to get 705 time so that you can apply to Air Canada, go to Encore.

[fish4life]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

I’d hold out for mainline and not get marooned at Encore if you have that amount of time. Mainline is currently averaging 1 pilot a day quitting for AC. Yet next year they planned to hire 400. So that’ll be more like 800 new pilots they’ll need if they stick to their plan. I won’t be surprised at all to see them to go below 1500 hours soon. It’s either drop the experience requirements yet again, or start paying more to attract pilots. Hmm I wonder which they’ll go for.

Any proof of them losing 1 pilot a day for AC? I’ve heard lots leaving from encore and swoop but only a few leaving WJ

[kiaszceski]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

I’d hold out for mainline and not get marooned at Encore if you have that amount of time. Mainline is currently averaging 1 pilot a day quitting for AC. Yet next year they planned to hire 400. So that’ll be more like 800 new pilots they’ll need if they stick to their plan. I won’t be surprised at all to see them to go below 1500 hours soon. It’s either drop the experience requirements yet again, or start paying more to attract pilots. Hmm I wonder which they’ll go for.

Any proof of them losing 1 pilot a day for AC? I’ve heard lots leaving from encore and swoop but only a few leaving WJ

"Critically low pilot resources" email during a shoulder season.
What's gonna happen during Christmas?

Wait until Flair gets their new payscale, it will help 4-5 years FO to switch to Flair for a DEC position.

[Canadaflyer46]

Interesting. What about 1500+ without the 500 multi-crew Swoop and Mainline ask for?

I’d hold out for mainline and not get marooned at Encore if you have that amount of time. Mainline is currently averaging 1 pilot a day quitting for AC. Yet next year they planned to hire 400. So that’ll be more like 800 new pilots they’ll need if they stick to their plan. I won’t be surprised at all to see them to go below 1500 hours soon. It’s either drop the experience requirements yet again, or start paying more to attract pilots. Hmm I wonder which they’ll go for.

Any proof of them losing 1 pilot a day for AC? I’ve heard lots leaving from encore and swoop but only a few leaving WJ

Fish4life I stand corrected. I re-read the ALPA email and the 1 pilot a day leaving average is indeed for the WestJet "group". So that includes Swoop and Encore.

[GetAGripen]

I've been pooled.

Kinda surprised there is a pool, tbh.

[averageatbest]

I've been pooled.

Kinda surprised there is a pool, tbh.

From the outside I can see how it would be surprising to be told that you meet the criteria and that they're interested, but also that they don't want you quite yet, especially after hearing how desperate they are for new pilots.

The reason is quite simple; lack of training ability. The trainers are mostly senior pilots and are flowing to mainline and switching to AC. There is a constant requirement to keep current pilots trained with recurrents and PPCs, as well as training new trainers to take over. It's not unlike the story I am hearing from Jazz.

Enjoy whatever flying you're doing now until your number is called. The Q is a lot of fun to fly when you get comfortable enough to hand fly it, but it's a lot of work and anxiety before then.

[belgianmoon]

Good Evening All,

Hope we are in for positive ride here on.

Please can Anyone confirm gs date for January? Calls out yet?

Thanks.

[Navajo350]

x2 looking for how long we have been in the pool for, before a call. Any other information would also be appreciated. Looking forward to flying the Q and meeting new people again

Cheers

[Maskless1]

Anyone have any idea how the cost of living negotiations are going?
Right now the interest rate increase driven my mortgage higher to the point where I am no longer eligible to hold the renewal. You’d think at minimum we would get an inflationary raise to reflect the mad cost of living. Raising per diems help but that is not income. The bank only cares about what your salary is. 41,000 or 76,000 doesn’t cut it for “professionals”.

[averageatbest]

Anyone have any idea how the cost of living negotiations are going?
Right now the interest rate increase driven my mortgage higher to the point where I am no longer eligible to hold the renewal. You’d think at minimum we would get an inflationary raise to reflect the mad cost of living. Raising per diems help but that is not income. The bank only cares about what your salary is. 41,000 or 76,000 doesn’t cut it for “professionals”.

First and foremost, "per diems", or Meal Cost Replacement (MCR) as we call it, is not compensation for your time and services performed. The banks have it right, but until we (collectively) refuse to accept any airline suggesting that it is, that problem will not be fixed.

With that, the last communication that was released (prior to the scheduled December 7 talk) stated that the company and the union were far apart on what they thought was appropriate. We need a significant increase in pay yesterday, an immediate change to scheduling practices today, and job security for tomorrow. The company has offered half-ass 'bonuses' to specific pilots to address the captain shortage a while back and I assume that the company has come to the table with another half-ass measure to address the immediate issues facing their operations without a thought about the issues we'll face in the short and medium term future.

The next (and last announced) round of talks are on December 16. Don't hold your breath.

TL;DR: Don't expect anything groundbreaking.

[Maskless1]

We need $10,000 on each side just to afford to get by. We’ll see what next year brings but I’m not optimistic with the new flair FO numbers. In the US the race to the top is on, meanwhile here we’re still racing to the bottom. It’s a competition to see who can pay the least. WJ is definitely making money. Our flights are full and the ticket prices are high. Sure they’re probably losing money on a hand full of high competition routes but it doesn’t turn an overall loss. I suspect “no profit” until both CBAs are complete.

[Canadaflyer46]

The company has given up on Encore and is letting it die. That's the growing consensus. PTA is done, retention talks aren't going anywhere, and the YYZ base is just about ready to shut up shop.
The staffing issues at Encore could easily be resolved with money or even a merger, but the company isn't willing to water the Encore plant anymore.