Recruiting Video

[RustyDeuce]

Pilots trying to get sympathy by not knowing when they'll retire... making hundreds of thousands a year.
Cry me a river. Pathetic.

[seriousflyer]

Dear Rusty Deuce,

It's about being paid how much your worth.

Sincerely,
Canadian Worker

[daedalusx]

Pilots trying to get sympathy by not knowing when they'll retire... making hundreds of thousands a year.
Cry me a river. Pathetic.

Crabs in a bucket mentality.

[FelixGustof]

WestJet pilots are nothing but a bunch of whining babies nowadays. Nothing is good enough, everything is always bad. You guys are lucky to have jobs right now - every other group has taken massive hits and you're still left relatively standing.

Is it normal for WJ Management to troll AvCanada?

[Mach1]

WestJet pilots are nothing but a bunch of whining babies nowadays. Nothing is good enough, everything is always bad. You guys are lucky to have jobs right now - every other group has taken massive hits and you're still left relatively standing.

Is it normal for WJ Management to troll AvCanada?

Yes.

[Hangry]

Pilots trying to get sympathy by not knowing when they'll retire... making hundreds of thousands a year.
Cry me a river. Pathetic.

Crabs in a bucket mentality.

#canadians. How dare anyone get more than me!!! Wah wah

[Mach1]

#canadians. How dare anyone get more than me!!! Wah wah

To me, that seems to be an Ontario and BC attitude. Maybe I'm wrong but you don't seem to find it in the Prairies or the Maritimes.

[RippleRock]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

If you've worked hard, had a perfect flying record with no violations or incidents, and a ton of luck. Then, and only then you see the the light at the end of the tunnel. If you're fortunate enough, you're seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been "dead aimed" on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

[rookiepilot]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

Then, the light at the end of the tunnel, when you are seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been dead aimed aimed on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

My hero.

How aren’t you given the Order of Canada by now?

[Tbayer2021]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

Then, the light at the end of the tunnel, when you are seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been dead aimed aimed on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

My hero.

How aren’t you given the Order of Canada by now?

He's yet to achieve the pinnacle of this profession. The most difficult pilot job around. Being a Hope Air pilot.

[rookiepilot]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

Then, the light at the end of the tunnel, when you are seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been dead aimed aimed on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

My hero.

How aren’t you given the Order of Canada by now?

He's yet to achieve the pinnacle of this profession. The most difficult pilot job around. Being a Hope Air pilot.

Hmmm.

Ego issue, anyone? Miss NASA’s phone call?

Get over yourself TbAyer….not that important and replaceable by a million others.

Never once heard any of my first responder friends, ever go on an ego driven rant like the above. Funny how that is.

[Tbayer2021]

My hero.

How aren’t you given the Order of Canada by now?

He's yet to achieve the pinnacle of this profession. The most difficult pilot job around. Being a Hope Air pilot.

Hmmm.

Ego issue, anyone? Miss NASA’s phone call?

Get over yourself TbAyer….not that important and replaceable by a million others.

Never once heard any of my first responder friends, ever go on an ego driven rant like the above. Funny how that is.

Absolutely! I also know who isn't replaceable, and that's a Hope Air pilot. I'm honestly in constant awe that you choose to bless us with your superior knowledge and skills by coming around here. My dream is to one day snatch one of the extremely limited Hope Air spots and join your ranks.

[rookiepilot]

He's yet to achieve the pinnacle of this profession. The most difficult pilot job around. Being a Hope Air pilot.

Hmmm.

Ego issue, anyone? Miss NASA’s phone call?

Get over yourself TbAyer….not that important and replaceable by a million others.

Never once heard any of my first responder friends, ever go on an ego driven rant like the above. Funny how that is.

Absolutely! I also know who isn't replaceable, and that's a Hope Air pilot. I'm honestly in constant awe that you choose to bless us with your superior knowledge and skills by coming around here. My dream is to one day snatch one of the extremely limited Hope Air spots and join your ranks.

You sure come across like a very angry, bitter person………how sad your life must be.

[Tbayer2021]

Hmmm.

Ego issue, anyone? Miss NASA’s phone call?

Get over yourself TbAyer….not that important and replaceable by a million others.

Never once heard any of my first responder friends, ever go on an ego driven rant like the above. Funny how that is.

Absolutely! I also know who isn't replaceable, and that's a Hope Air pilot. I'm honestly in constant awe that you choose to bless us with your superior knowledge and skills by coming around here. My dream is to one day snatch one of the extremely limited Hope Air spots and join your ranks.

You sure come across like a very angry, bitter person………how sad your life must be.

Shit! I hope that doesn't disqualify my for a position with Hope Air.

[rookiepilot]

Absolutely! I also know who isn't replaceable, and that's a Hope Air pilot. I'm honestly in constant awe that you choose to bless us with your superior knowledge and skills by coming around here. My dream is to one day snatch one of the extremely limited Hope Air spots and join your ranks.

You sure come across like a very angry, bitter person………how sad your life must be.

Shit! I hope that doesn't disqualify my for a position with Hope Air.

I strongly suspect I’ve gotten a ton more joy volunteering for them flying a slow tin can, than you show in your posts flying the heavy metal.

Enjoy your bitterness.

[Tbayer2021]

You sure come across like a very angry, bitter person………how sad your life must be.

Shit! I hope that doesn't disqualify my for a position with Hope Air.

I strongly suspect I’ve gotten a ton more joy volunteering for them flying a slow tin can, than you show in your posts flying the heavy metal.

Enjoy your bitterness.

Yet another reason why I want to join your ranks. I want to have the pure joys of life that can only be achieved by commenting on professional pilot threads without being one.

Teach me the way, senpai.

[photofly]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

If you've worked hard, had a perfect flying record with no violations or incidents, and a ton of luck. Then, and only then you see the the light at the end of the tunnel. If you're fortunate enough, you're seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been "dead aimed" on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

Have to ask - why do you do it, then?

[sstaurus]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

If you've worked hard, had a perfect flying record with no violations or incidents, and a ton of luck. Then, and only then you see the the light at the end of the tunnel. If you're fortunate enough, you're seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been "dead aimed" on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

Have to ask - why do you do it, then?

Does it matter? It’s about getting compensated for those factors.

[Mach1]

I'm pretty sick of other employee groups and management telling pilots that "they make too much". What a bunch of complete garbage.

Last I checked if you lost your medical, your entire career was blown. No Human Rights Tribunal for disabled pilots will be convened. As Woke as we all are, no one will claim "your feelings are hurt", and help salvage your career. Not one. MS, CF, any cognitive disfunction, auto immune disorder, psychologically infirm, vision loss, hearing loss, loss of a limb or motor control.....GOODBYE. There are almost NO careers that can be shut down as fast and permanently as this one.

We can literally lose our job three times a year. Fail a check ride (twice a year), or line-check (once a year) and you are put under a microscope to find out why. Get it together immediately, or don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out. The license, RAIC and passport MUST be maintained or GOODBYE.

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars. I'm sure the Military boys and gals could add a few lines here.

If you've worked hard, had a perfect flying record with no violations or incidents, and a ton of luck. Then, and only then you see the the light at the end of the tunnel. If you're fortunate enough, you're seated in front of an HR rep at that one big airline you've been "dead aimed" on, trying to explain your worth. Maybe they see it maybe they don't. Depends partly on the mood of the HR rep, and whether or not your "hitting on all cylinders" that day. Too bad so sad if you aren't.

THEN....you get to start at the bottom of a pay scale that pays poorer than your buddy who went straight to work in a greenhouse tending "wacky tabbacy" plants, 9-5 weekends off, while you are trying to make ends meet, flying the worst schedules or sitting on reserve all day to finally fly at o'Black Thirty when you're tired as no tired you've ever felt. --for years-- in one of the three most expensive cities to live in on earth.

Don't tell us for one second what we are worth until you have walked the walk. Put on the shoes and see if you would go through what most of us did to get to where we are. My bet your honest answer will be.....NOT ON YOUR LIFE....there are too many other less risk averse, far less expensive, far less dangerous paths to make a living. I can name a hundred, and not one is spoken of with the same distain when speaking of the pay of a Commercial Airline Pilot.

Apparently everyone is worth more, except for that one dark stormy night as a passenger, when you have no choice but to admit you're thankful for what we put ourselves through -on our own dime- to get to where we are.

That's actually a pretty good description of the career path of a Canadian pilot. The only thing I would add is that everyone I know has a friend or a colleague who died on the job.

The oddly jealous or oddly trolling management types trying to shame you for describing the career path of the average pilot are failing to address anything you have said here and seem obsessed with maintaining the status quo of pay and power dynamics. The real question here isn't, "Why do you deserve better pay and working conditions?" The real question here is, "Why are these other people so against you getting better pay and working conditions? What is their motivation to see you make less?"

How about explaining (yes, I am looking at you photofly and rookiepilot) how pilots getting paid more directly hurts you and why you are so against it? Do you feel the same way about Executive pay and how that has gone up exponentially over the last couple of decades? Why does someone improving their life somehow diminish your life?

[rookiepilot]

How about explaining (yes, I am looking at you photofly and rookiepilot) how pilots getting paid more directly hurts you and why you are so against it? Do you feel the same way about Executive pay and how that has gone up exponentially over the last couple of decades? Why does someone improving their life somehow diminish your life?

Ok, Mach1, you've asked a polite question. I'll attempt to give a polite but direct answer.

I answer in the context of one who hasn't worked on an hourly wage since I was a teenager. Near 40 years ago. Since then, commission, then my own business.

Short answer, it doesn't diminish me. It's the attitude that offends.

I AM on the side of Pilots receiving more pay -- especially younger pilots. None of us want to see a Colgan Air up here.

I have repeatedly posted about professional negotiation thoughts for young people, including exploring out of the box options.

Been Trolled.

Posted about financial wisdom.

Been Trolled.

I think when sharing with the general public or anyone who can help you, angry entitled rants get you no-where. Pilots are important, so are a whole host of other professionals like first responders and medical staff. Demeaning their role isn't going to win points.

Professional, assertive negotiation, mixed with HUMILITY, is the path to follow, IMO.

Gotta run.

[Tbayer2021]

During the 2008/09 recession. Delta management came looking for concessions from the pilots claiming it was an existential crisis. The union caved and gave somewhere in the area of $600M in total concessions. Not long after (a month or two from what I recall the Delta MEC member telling me) the company announced bonuses totalling around $600M for their executives, during an earnings call. Quite the coincidence, no? He told me that since that moment, the Union took the stance of "We will bankrupt the company before we give anymore concessions".

The results of a less humble and more hardline approach speak for themselves.

Humility may have served you well during your life and small business ventures, Rookie. I'm not saying it should be ignored. But in the world of large airlines and multi billion dollar negotiations, humility won't get you very far.

And while you're claiming to be the victim of trolling, maybe take a look in the mirror and reflect as to the reason why this has been a constant response to many of your posts. If it smells everywhere you go, check under your own shoe. Or so they say.

[Mach1]

Ok, Mach1, you've asked a polite question. I'll attempt to give a polite but direct answer.

I answer in the context of one who hasn't worked on an hourly wage since I was a teenager. Near 40 years ago. Since then, commission, then my own business.

Short answer, it doesn't diminish me. It's the attitude that offends.

I AM on the side of Pilots receiving more pay -- especially younger pilots. None of us want to see a Colgan Air up here.

I have repeatedly posted about professional negotiation thoughts for young people, including exploring out of the box options.

Been Trolled.

Posted about financial wisdom.

Been Trolled.

I think when sharing with the general public or anyone who can help you, angry entitled rants get you no-where. Pilots are important, so are a whole host of other professionals like first responders and medical staff. Demeaning their role isn't going to win points.

Professional, assertive negotiation, mixed with HUMILITY, is the path to follow, IMO.

Gotta run.

That is a fair answer. If I understand your position correctly, you dislike the delivery of the message (or the tone of the message, if you prefer) but do not disagree with the content of the message. I can understand that.

When I look at the message, I see it slightly different. I see the frustration with the situation and the entrenched attitude of the companies involved towards devaluing the person as well as the work.

I have seen your posts on financial advice and I appreciate those posts. Unfortunately, disagreeing on the internet (of via text of any kind) often takes on an unintended tone (okay, sometimes it is intended) due to brevity, time constraints, typing on a touch screen (which I despise), or the bravery of being out of range. I think this was a better response to the post than your initial response.

Enjoy the day,
Cheers

[digits_]

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars.

A whole continent has proven you wrong. This is absolutely not the case.

Depending on how you look at it, you could even say that the above mentioned career path breeds *worse* pilots. After all, up until 10 years ago, the only pilots that made it into an airliner were the ones that accepted flying crappy equipment for shady operators at some point in their career.

The ones who refused didn't/wouldn't have made it.


At the very least, let's dump this fallacy that you need to have been professionally abused in your early career in order to make it. It's not true. It's a Canadian thing, that is -luckily- starting to disappear. Don't glorify it.

[RippleRock]

Anyone know how expensive it is to become a pilot? Anyone know how hard it is to slog your way through poor paying, dangerous flying jobs that literally threaten your life daily with poorly maintained equipment, or shoddy SOP's? Anyone? Flying drunk loggers or mine workers out of poorly prepared dirt airstrips with poorly maintained aircraft in weather that would curl your toes? This is an absolute necessity to refine the skills that are essential to making split second decisions that may or may not result in a "front page story" and cost hundreds of millions of dollars.

A whole continent has proven you wrong. This is absolutely not the case.

Depending on how you look at it, you could even say that the above mentioned career path breeds *worse* pilots. After all, up until 10 years ago, the only pilots that made it into an airliner were the ones that accepted flying crappy equipment for shady operators at some point in their career.

The ones who refused didn't/wouldn't have made it.


At the very least, let's dump this fallacy that you need to have been professionally abused in your early career in order to make it. It's not true. It's a Canadian thing, that is -luckily- starting to disappear. Don't glorify it.

Let me guess Digits.

Another "waste of skin" accountant or bean counter.

There is currently a program for for -all you do- that can be run by a 10th grader.

Good luck going forward. Seriously. You're really going to need it.

[rookiepilot]

Ok, Mach1, you've asked a polite question. I'll attempt to give a polite but direct answer.

I answer in the context of one who hasn't worked on an hourly wage since I was a teenager. Near 40 years ago. Since then, commission, then my own business.

Short answer, it doesn't diminish me. It's the attitude that offends.

I AM on the side of Pilots receiving more pay -- especially younger pilots. None of us want to see a Colgan Air up here.

I have repeatedly posted about professional negotiation thoughts for young people, including exploring out of the box options.

Been Trolled.

Posted about financial wisdom.

Been Trolled.

I think when sharing with the general public or anyone who can help you, angry entitled rants get you no-where. Pilots are important, so are a whole host of other professionals like first responders and medical staff. Demeaning their role isn't going to win points.

Professional, assertive negotiation, mixed with HUMILITY, is the path to follow, IMO.

Gotta run.

When I look at the message, I see it slightly different. I see the frustration with the situation and the entrenched attitude of the companies involved towards devaluing the person as well as the work.


Enjoy the day,
Cheers

I sympathize, I really do.

That is not going to change by posting here, good as that might feel to vent. IMO there are 3 viable options to proceed for one who wants to effect change in their own destiny.

NONE of these choices are easy or comfortable. All will take personal sacrifice. Is what it is......

One is effective labour action to call attention. Fire your Union leaders if they won't represent you.

2 is getting unique training and qualifications, to stand out from the herd, and compensation would change appropriately.

3 would be my choice, and that is to leave Canada. Go to Asia / M East, live an adventure, make a killing, come back with a giant pile of PIC hours and experience, write your own ticket.