Government workers strike to impact pilot medicals

[McKinley]

Well, when we thought it couldn’t get more delayed now there’s this …


Remember, folks ! The pandemic isn’t over ! Save lives by destroying the lives of others ! Go Trudumb !

Of course, alpa pilots should be in solidarity with these individuals who can’t process pilot medicals in under a year.


https://twitter.com/duncandee/status/16 ... 7582617601

I wonder how long it’ll take to process pilot/ ATC medicals now ..

[newlygrounded]

Well, when we thought it couldn’t get more delayed now there’s this …


Remember, folks ! The pandemic isn’t over ! Save lives by destroying the lives of others ! Go Trudumb !

Of course, alpa pilots should be in solidarity with these individuals who can’t process pilot medicals in under a year.


https://twitter.com/duncandee/status/16 ... 7582617601

I wonder how long it’ll take to process pilot/ ATC medicals now ..

What do you think a fair raise would be for those folks?

[truedude]

Well, when we thought it couldn’t get more delayed now there’s this …


Remember, folks ! The pandemic isn’t over ! Save lives by destroying the lives of others ! Go Trudumb !

Of course, alpa pilots should be in solidarity with these individuals who can’t process pilot medicals in under a year.


https://twitter.com/duncandee/status/16 ... 7582617601

I wonder how long it’ll take to process pilot/ ATC medicals now ..

What do you think a fair raise would be for those folks?

Considering they can't be bothered to come into the office. They are usually rude and miserable to deal with. And their productivity is low, I would say any raise is too much. Start shrinking their numbers, and eventually they will get the picture.

[rando]

Well, when we thought it couldn’t get more delayed now there’s this …


Remember, folks ! The pandemic isn’t over ! Save lives by destroying the lives of others ! Go Trudumb !

Of course, alpa pilots should be in solidarity with these individuals who can’t process pilot medicals in under a year.


https://twitter.com/duncandee/status/16 ... 7582617601

I wonder how long it’ll take to process pilot/ ATC medicals now ..

What do you think a fair raise would be for those folks?

Zero. What did they do to earn a raise? You are paid what you can negotiate and look how dumb their argument is. “I used to go to work, then they let me work at home because Covid, now they want me to come back to the office, this is not fair! I want 12 percent raise!”. They have literally shown no ways that they have improved their value. They show no way that they are more productive. In fact that admit they just want to be as unproductive as possible and work from home as often as possible. They want danger pay for going to the office. Meanwhile our industry didn’t skip a beat going to work, moving supplies, unless you were laid off of course! How many Federal workers were laid off from Covid?

People don’t get it, covid mandates come with a cost. If everyone gets an inflation raise “just because” then this means we haven’t paid for the cost of the policies of the past 3 years. Did you think corporations would pay? Did you not see that government was in bed with corporations all pandemic? Silly you to think they would pay.

Everyone is just going to have to take a hit to quality of life unless you can prove you are worth more. If you don’t want to pay for this, then don’t encourage unnecessary policies that do little for public health and disrupt the Economy. You can’t make productivity go down the drain and expect no change to your earnings. Now think back to when people said “even if it saves one life, all these policies are worth it”. 10 to 20 percent inflation was the cost to this. So the answer is zero (doesn’t mean they will get zero, gov already offered 9 percent but since when has government been responsible with your money anyways?)

[Arnie Pye]

Government employees generally are paid higher hourly wages than the private sector. They have effectively started from ahead. That's not to mention their Gold Plated, Defined Benefit Pension package, better medical/dental, STD/LTD etc.

Most sectors of the economy are still only getting 2% wage increases. The government employees are asking for 4.5% per year. The government is offering 3% which is likely higher than most private sector employers are offering.

The sector that we deal with most as pilots is TC. Has anyone tried to reach someone there? Ever tried to get a document from them? It takes weeks and multiple calls, emails just to get ahold of someone. Recently, I was trying to reach TC to figure out how to get a copy of some information. The only practical way was to sit in the parking lot at YHM and ambush an employee who was heading into the building.

[newlygrounded]

Well, when we thought it couldn’t get more delayed now there’s this …


Remember, folks ! The pandemic isn’t over ! Save lives by destroying the lives of others ! Go Trudumb !

Of course, alpa pilots should be in solidarity with these individuals who can’t process pilot medicals in under a year.


https://twitter.com/duncandee/status/16 ... 7582617601

I wonder how long it’ll take to process pilot/ ATC medicals now ..

What do you think a fair raise would be for those folks?

Zero. What did they do to earn a raise? You are paid what you can negotiate and look how dumb their argument is. “I used to go to work, then they let me work at home because Covid, now they want me to come back to the office, this is not fair! I want 12 percent raise!”. They have literally shown no ways that they have improved their value. They show no way that they are more productive. In fact that admit they just want to be as unproductive as possible and work from home as often as possible. They want danger pay for going to the office. Meanwhile our industry didn’t skip a beat going to work, moving supplies, unless you were laid off of course! How many Federal workers were laid off from Covid?

People don’t get it, covid mandates come with a cost. If everyone gets an inflation raise “just because” then this means we haven’t paid for the cost of the policies of the past 3 years. Did you think corporations would pay? Did you not see that government was in bed with corporations all pandemic? Silly you to think they would pay.

Everyone is just going to have to take a hit to quality of life unless you can prove you are worth more. If you don’t want to pay for this, then don’t encourage unnecessary policies that do little for public health and disrupt the Economy. You can’t make productivity go down the drain and expect no change to your earnings. Now think back to when people said “even if it saves one life, all these policies are worth it”. 10 to 20 percent inflation was the cost to this. So the answer is zero (doesn’t mean they will get zero, gov already offered 9 percent but since when has government been responsible with your money anyways?)

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

Why do you think working from home is less productive? I work an office job, most people spend 2-3 hours a day commuting! I found when I was working from home people were more willing to reply to messages after hours etc.

You chose a job that requires you to be there in person, why do you want everyone to needlessly jam up the roads 5 days a week for people who cannot work remotely?

Westjet pilots voted to strike, are you going to tell them they're asking for too much?

[newlygrounded]

Government employees generally are paid higher hourly wages than the private sector. They have effectively started from ahead. That's not to mention their Gold Plated, Defined Benefit Pension package, better medical/dental, STD/LTD etc.

Most sectors of the economy are still only getting 2% wage increases. The government employees are asking for 4.5% per year. The government is offering 3% which is likely higher than most private sector employers are offering.

The sector that we deal with most as pilots is TC. Has anyone tried to reach someone there? Ever tried to get a document from them? It takes weeks and multiple calls, emails just to get ahold of someone. Recently, I was trying to reach TC to figure out how to get a copy of some information. The only practical way was to sit in the parking lot at YHM and ambush an employee who was heading into the building.

This is not true at all. Yeah if you speak both French and English and got back in during the 90's there is a chance you'd make more working for the feds. For the rest you're likely to never get a promotion. You can see what the raises were over time. Some years were 0.5%. Also you realize in negotiations you ask for more than you'd accept and meet in the middle? This reminds me of how the teachers got ZERO raise but now they're greedy for asking?



I'm very disappointed with how hard it is to deal with TC, but do you think telling people to live below inflation is going to lead to a better outcome for anyone?

[truedude]

What do you think a fair raise would be for those folks?

Zero. What did they do to earn a raise? You are paid what you can negotiate and look how dumb their argument is. “I used to go to work, then they let me work at home because Covid, now they want me to come back to the office, this is not fair! I want 12 percent raise!”. They have literally shown no ways that they have improved their value. They show no way that they are more productive. In fact that admit they just want to be as unproductive as possible and work from home as often as possible. They want danger pay for going to the office. Meanwhile our industry didn’t skip a beat going to work, moving supplies, unless you were laid off of course! How many Federal workers were laid off from Covid?

People don’t get it, covid mandates come with a cost. If everyone gets an inflation raise “just because” then this means we haven’t paid for the cost of the policies of the past 3 years. Did you think corporations would pay? Did you not see that government was in bed with corporations all pandemic? Silly you to think they would pay.

Everyone is just going to have to take a hit to quality of life unless you can prove you are worth more. If you don’t want to pay for this, then don’t encourage unnecessary policies that do little for public health and disrupt the Economy. You can’t make productivity go down the drain and expect no change to your earnings. Now think back to when people said “even if it saves one life, all these policies are worth it”. 10 to 20 percent inflation was the cost to this. So the answer is zero (doesn’t mean they will get zero, gov already offered 9 percent but since when has government been responsible with your money anyways?)

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

Why do you think working from home is less productive? I work an office job, most people spend 2-3 hours a day commuting! I found when I was working from home people were more willing to reply to messages after hours etc.

You chose a job that requires you to be there in person, why do you want everyone to needlessly jam up the roads 5 days a week for people who cannot work remotely?

Westjet pilots voted to strike, are you going to tell them they're asking for too much?

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

[newlygrounded]

Zero. What did they do to earn a raise? You are paid what you can negotiate and look how dumb their argument is. “I used to go to work, then they let me work at home because Covid, now they want me to come back to the office, this is not fair! I want 12 percent raise!”. They have literally shown no ways that they have improved their value. They show no way that they are more productive. In fact that admit they just want to be as unproductive as possible and work from home as often as possible. They want danger pay for going to the office. Meanwhile our industry didn’t skip a beat going to work, moving supplies, unless you were laid off of course! How many Federal workers were laid off from Covid?

People don’t get it, covid mandates come with a cost. If everyone gets an inflation raise “just because” then this means we haven’t paid for the cost of the policies of the past 3 years. Did you think corporations would pay? Did you not see that government was in bed with corporations all pandemic? Silly you to think they would pay.

Everyone is just going to have to take a hit to quality of life unless you can prove you are worth more. If you don’t want to pay for this, then don’t encourage unnecessary policies that do little for public health and disrupt the Economy. You can’t make productivity go down the drain and expect no change to your earnings. Now think back to when people said “even if it saves one life, all these policies are worth it”. 10 to 20 percent inflation was the cost to this. So the answer is zero (doesn’t mean they will get zero, gov already offered 9 percent but since when has government been responsible with your money anyways?)

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

Why do you think working from home is less productive? I work an office job, most people spend 2-3 hours a day commuting! I found when I was working from home people were more willing to reply to messages after hours etc.

You chose a job that requires you to be there in person, why do you want everyone to needlessly jam up the roads 5 days a week for people who cannot work remotely?

Westjet pilots voted to strike, are you going to tell them they're asking for too much?

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

I work in the private sector, show me your studies? What's with this all or nothing thinking? Show me companies that work well under a culture of fear? It's ironic to see someone complain about laziness but not link any study.

I go in 5 days a week, I still realize people not being on the road frees up space for me.

On average, those who work from home spend 10 minutes less a day being unproductive, work one more day a week, and are 47% more productive

https://www.apollotechnical.com/working ... productive.

https://www.businessnewsdaily.com/15259 ... ctive.html

Allowing employees to work remotely can increase their productivity.


I think most people here have a @#$! you I got mine attitude.

[truedude]

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

Why do you think working from home is less productive? I work an office job, most people spend 2-3 hours a day commuting! I found when I was working from home people were more willing to reply to messages after hours etc.

You chose a job that requires you to be there in person, why do you want everyone to needlessly jam up the roads 5 days a week for people who cannot work remotely?

Westjet pilots voted to strike, are you going to tell them they're asking for too much?

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

I work in the private sector, show me your studies? What's with this all or nothing thinking? Show me companies that work well under a culture of fear? It's ironic to see someone complain about laziness but not link any study.

I go in 5 days a week, I still realize people not being on the road frees up space for me.

On average, those who work from home spend 10 minutes less a day being unproductive, work one more day a week, and are 47% more productive

https://www.apollotechnical.com/working ... productive.

https://www.businessnewsdaily.com/15259 ... ctive.html

Allowing employees to work remotely can increase their productivity.


I think most people here have a @#$! you I got mine attitude.

Those studies are very weak. One relies a lot on self reported productivity. Another relies on several studies in Europe and makes some very proud conclusions. In other words, they aren't worth anything.

[newlygrounded]

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

I work in the private sector, show me your studies? What's with this all or nothing thinking? Show me companies that work well under a culture of fear? It's ironic to see someone complain about laziness but not link any study.

I go in 5 days a week, I still realize people not being on the road frees up space for me.

On average, those who work from home spend 10 minutes less a day being unproductive, work one more day a week, and are 47% more productive

https://www.apollotechnical.com/working ... productive.

https://www.businessnewsdaily.com/15259 ... ctive.html

Allowing employees to work remotely can increase their productivity.


I think most people here have a @#$! you I got mine attitude.

Those studies are very weak. One relies a lot on self reported productivity. Another relies on several studies in Europe and makes some very proud conclusions. In other words, they aren't worth anything.

Thanks for not talking about any of my other points, how about you provide studies? Aside from banks (who own lots of real estate) most major companies are letting people work remotely.

Do you seriously think people will put in more work if they lose 2-3 hours a day commuting? I personally did a lot work, based on the fact I ate healthier. If I'm out of my desk at 5pm, I'm not responding to an email at 4:59. If I'm at my house I don't mind working an extra 20-30 mins for free.

A lot of companies I know in Toronto and Vancouver cancelled their office lease, or subletted space. But I'm sure people on av who have never worked in an office know better!

[truedude]

I work in the private sector, show me your studies? What's with this all or nothing thinking? Show me companies that work well under a culture of fear? It's ironic to see someone complain about laziness but not link any study.

I go in 5 days a week, I still realize people not being on the road frees up space for me.

On average, those who work from home spend 10 minutes less a day being unproductive, work one more day a week, and are 47% more productive

https://www.apollotechnical.com/working ... productive.

https://www.businessnewsdaily.com/15259 ... ctive.html

Allowing employees to work remotely can increase their productivity.


I think most people here have a @#$! you I got mine attitude.

Those studies are very weak. One relies a lot on self reported productivity. Another relies on several studies in Europe and makes some very proud conclusions. In other words, they aren't worth anything.

Thanks for not talking about any of my other points, how about you provide studies? Aside from banks (who own lots of real estate) most major companies are letting people work remotely.

Do you seriously think people will put in more work if they lose 2-3 hours a day commuting? I personally did a lot work, based on the fact I ate healthier. If I'm out of my desk at 5pm, I'm not responding to an email at 4:59. If I'm at my house I don't mind working an extra 20-30 mins for free.

A lot of companies I know in Toronto and Vancouver cancelled their office lease, or subletted space. But I'm sure people on av who have never worked in an office know better!

They are doing because people don't want to come back and many places are having a hard time finding employees . Doesn't mean it will work long term. And I can't wait for people to start complaining when companies start shipping all these jobs remotely to other countries.

[Arnie Pye]

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

WFH does not kill productivity. I'd also be ok if India ran Transport Canada. I'm sure they would answer the odd phone call or respond to an email in a timely manner.

This is not true at all. Yeah if you speak both French and English and got back in during the 90's there is a chance you'd make more working for the feds. For the rest you're likely to never get a promotion. You can see what the raises were over time. Some years were 0.5%. Also you realize in negotiations you ask for more than you'd accept and meet in the middle? This reminds me of how the teachers got ZERO raise but now they're greedy for asking?



I'm very disappointed with how hard it is to deal with TC, but do you think telling people to live below inflation is going to lead to a better outcome for anyone?

All this chart shows is the percentage increase. It doesn't show a starting point. It also doesn't show the bloated but guaranteed government pension, the benefits package etc. Name one airline (or private sector employer) that still has a DB Pension for its janitors.

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

I'm calling BS on the idea that government employees make tens of thousands less than in the private world.

I believe everyone's pay should be indexed to inflation. The sad reality is that in my 30 years of working in Canada, I have never worked for a company that gave actual inflation based COLA. Not inside of aviation or in my former office life in the private sector.

So between the higher hourly/salary rate and the executive level benefits package, I think only a 10.5% raise should be sufficient. You want more, show some value to the tax payers. Process a passport application in days as a standard service. Send out an ADB within a week of the application. Then we'll talk.

[rando]

Well I think you just made up a lot of things there about private sector being compensated more than the public workers in similar roles. Also about productivity, there's a reason workers are being called back to the office in the private sector.

Do WestJet pilots deserve a raise? Well what are the comparables? What's the going rate for a 737 pilot today? There are objective ways to see that they have leverage. It's not about deserveing, you get what you negotiate. All I can say is I have not seen any legitimate arguments that federal workers have a good argument for more compensation.

If you own a business and inflation runs.... Do you pay your employees based on the value they provide? Or do you automatically give raises just because? Inflation is not a reason someone deserves a raise. You deserve a raise when you can negotiate one, and you can negotiate a raise when you present objective facts about your worth to the workplace. Pilots have leverage. Federal workers have literally said nothing that seems to justify a compelling argument about how much value they are to the taxpayers. We already pay way more for federal services than a decade ago, yet the service is more shit than ever. Maybe some overpaid middle managers need to get canned first. It's a dumpster fire. Imagine a pilot stood up and said "I deserve a raise because I can't work from home". This is literally how stupid the federal workers come across. Think of some valid arguments before you picket! Inflation doesn't mean you are valuable.

[newlygrounded]

I guess we know who you work for...

Our entire goverment is one bloated entity. And work from home kills productivity, and study after study shows this to be true. And if your job can be done from home, we might as well ship it out of the country.

WFH does not kill productivity. I'd also be ok if India ran Transport Canada. I'm sure they would answer the odd phone call or respond to an email in a timely manner.

This is not true at all. Yeah if you speak both French and English and got back in during the 90's there is a chance you'd make more working for the feds. For the rest you're likely to never get a promotion. You can see what the raises were over time. Some years were 0.5%. Also you realize in negotiations you ask for more than you'd accept and meet in the middle? This reminds me of how the teachers got ZERO raise but now they're greedy for asking?



I'm very disappointed with how hard it is to deal with TC, but do you think telling people to live below inflation is going to lead to a better outcome for anyone?

All this chart shows is the percentage increase. It doesn't show a starting point. It also doesn't show the bloated but guaranteed government pension, the benefits package etc. Name one airline (or private sector employer) that still has a DB Pension for its janitors.

Ever heard of inflation? Government wages for the majority of employees are tens of thousands lower than they would get in private. Most years have been under inflation. One of the years was a 0.5% raise. Do you not think peoples pay should have SOME correlation with inflation?

I'm calling BS on the idea that government employees make tens of thousands less than in the private world.

I believe everyone's pay should be indexed to inflation. The sad reality is that in my 30 years of working in Canada, I have never worked for a company that gave actual inflation based COLA. Not inside of aviation or in my former office life in the private sector.

So between the higher hourly/salary rate and the executive level benefits package, I think only a 10.5% raise should be sufficient. You want more, show some value to the tax payers. Process a passport application in days as a standard service. Send out an ADB within a week of the application. Then we'll talk.

You're making some very sweeping statements. Most people think pilots all make over $100k a year that's very much not true. What are you basing your idea that they make more than the same job in private? Unless you give some concrete evidence your speculation is as good as anyone elses.

I know people in government, and private doing similar jobs. Every single one makes more in private. You can check pay scales in collective agreements if you disagree with me. Every government process has several people involved. If one part of the process has a backlog that's going to affect the end user. Why punish everyone who is doing their job on time?

[newlygrounded]

Well I think you just made up a lot of things there about private sector being compensated more and the public workers in similar roles. Also about productivity, there's a reason workers are being called back to the office in the private sector.

Do WestJet pilots deserve a raise? Well what are the comparables? What's the going rate for a 737 pilot today? There are objective ways to see that they have leverage. It's not about deserveing, you get what you negotiate. All I can say is I have not seen any legitimate arguments that federal workers have a good argument for more compensation.

If you own a business and inflation runs.... Do you pay your employees based on the value they provide? Or do you automatically give raises just because? Inflation is not a reason someone deserves a raise. You deserve a raise when you can negotiate one, and you can negotiate a raise when you present objective facts about your worth to the workplace. Pilots have leverage. Federal workers have literally said nothing that seems to justify a compelling argument about how much value they are to the taxpayers. We already pay way more for federal services than a decade ago, yet the service is more shit than ever. Maybe some overpaid middle managers need to get canned first.

Show me some examples? I can show you public service payscales vs private for office jobs. Their pay has been less than inflation, that's a good enough reason for me.

[newlygrounded]

Those studies are very weak. One relies a lot on self reported productivity. Another relies on several studies in Europe and makes some very proud conclusions. In other words, they aren't worth anything.

Thanks for not talking about any of my other points, how about you provide studies? Aside from banks (who own lots of real estate) most major companies are letting people work remotely.

Do you seriously think people will put in more work if they lose 2-3 hours a day commuting? I personally did a lot work, based on the fact I ate healthier. If I'm out of my desk at 5pm, I'm not responding to an email at 4:59. If I'm at my house I don't mind working an extra 20-30 mins for free.

A lot of companies I know in Toronto and Vancouver cancelled their office lease, or subletted space. But I'm sure people on av who have never worked in an office know better!

They are doing because people don't want to come back and many places are having a hard time finding employees . Doesn't mean it will work long term. And I can't wait for people to start complaining when companies start shipping all these jobs remotely to other countries.

Are you going to provide some studies? I hope you see the irony considering you are calling others lazy. You also cherry pick my points and don't respond to the rest. Do you think people will be more productive if they have a 3 hour commute on top of their work day?

[truedude]

Thanks for not talking about any of my other points, how about you provide studies? Aside from banks (who own lots of real estate) most major companies are letting people work remotely.

Do you seriously think people will put in more work if they lose 2-3 hours a day commuting? I personally did a lot work, based on the fact I ate healthier. If I'm out of my desk at 5pm, I'm not responding to an email at 4:59. If I'm at my house I don't mind working an extra 20-30 mins for free.

A lot of companies I know in Toronto and Vancouver cancelled their office lease, or subletted space. But I'm sure people on av who have never worked in an office know better!

They are doing because people don't want to come back and many places are having a hard time finding employees . Doesn't mean it will work long term. And I can't wait for people to start complaining when companies start shipping all these jobs remotely to other countries.

Are you going to provide some studies? I hope you see the irony considering you are calling others lazy. You also cherry pick my points and don't respond to the rest. Do you think people will be more productive if they have a 3 hour commute on top of their work day?

Most don't have a 3 hr commute.

[newlygrounded]

They are doing because people don't want to come back and many places are having a hard time finding employees . Doesn't mean it will work long term. And I can't wait for people to start complaining when companies start shipping all these jobs remotely to other countries.

Are you going to provide some studies? I hope you see the irony considering you are calling others lazy. You also cherry pick my points and don't respond to the rest. Do you think people will be more productive if they have a 3 hour commute on top of their work day?

Most don't have a 3 hr commute.

Honestly I don't think you're discussing in good faith.

[rando]

Well I think you just made up a lot of things there about private sector being compensated more and the public workers in similar roles. Also about productivity, there's a reason workers are being called back to the office in the private sector.

Do WestJet pilots deserve a raise? Well what are the comparables? What's the going rate for a 737 pilot today? There are objective ways to see that they have leverage. It's not about deserveing, you get what you negotiate. All I can say is I have not seen any legitimate arguments that federal workers have a good argument for more compensation.

If you own a business and inflation runs.... Do you pay your employees based on the value they provide? Or do you automatically give raises just because? Inflation is not a reason someone deserves a raise. You deserve a raise when you can negotiate one, and you can negotiate a raise when you present objective facts about your worth to the workplace. Pilots have leverage. Federal workers have literally said nothing that seems to justify a compelling argument about how much value they are to the taxpayers. We already pay way more for federal services than a decade ago, yet the service is more shit than ever. Maybe some overpaid middle managers need to get canned first.

Show me some examples? I can show you public service payscales vs private for office jobs. Their pay has been less than inflation, that's a good enough reason for me.

The onus is on the federal workers to show the evidence, not me. They are the ones on strike!

If you believe inflation is a reason people deserve a raise, why is it not in legislation so its law? I think some pilots would like to go back a couple decades for back pay and also get the 80 percent raise for lost wages over the years.

Or do pilots get compensation for what they negotiate? And do they get paid based on the market conditions?

[newlygrounded]

Well I think you just made up a lot of things there about private sector being compensated more and the public workers in similar roles. Also about productivity, there's a reason workers are being called back to the office in the private sector.

Do WestJet pilots deserve a raise? Well what are the comparables? What's the going rate for a 737 pilot today? There are objective ways to see that they have leverage. It's not about deserveing, you get what you negotiate. All I can say is I have not seen any legitimate arguments that federal workers have a good argument for more compensation.

If you own a business and inflation runs.... Do you pay your employees based on the value they provide? Or do you automatically give raises just because? Inflation is not a reason someone deserves a raise. You deserve a raise when you can negotiate one, and you can negotiate a raise when you present objective facts about your worth to the workplace. Pilots have leverage. Federal workers have literally said nothing that seems to justify a compelling argument about how much value they are to the taxpayers. We already pay way more for federal services than a decade ago, yet the service is more shit than ever. Maybe some overpaid middle managers need to get canned first.

Show me some examples? I can show you public service payscales vs private for office jobs. Their pay has been less than inflation, that's a good enough reason for me.

The onus is on the federal workers to show the evidence, not me. They are the ones on strike!

If you believe inflation is a reason people deserve a raise, why is it not in legislation so its law? I think some pilots would like to go back a couple decades for back pay and also get the 80 percent raise for lost wages over the years.

Or do pilots get compensation for what they negotiate? And do they get paid based on the market conditions?

I'm not asking you why they deserve a raise. I'm asking you to prove your claim that they're over paid, or that working at home is some how less productive despite freeing up hours of peoples time and money.

I'm not in favor of typing pay to inflation by law, I think people should have the flexibility to choose what they value. Gas was $2 a litre at one point, if you're needlessly calling people in you need to either increase pay or only bring people in if necessary.

Also the companies I see calling people in have a huge interest in REIT/real estate. It's not public servants fault pilots have had zero unity, and will gladly sell out the younger generation (ex, flat pay)

[rando]

Well thankfully I’m only full of anecdotes and my perception so I no longer have to engage in this debate. I’ll just accept that you are the expert and im probably wrong.

My advice for the federal workers would be stop striking for BS reasons, and show the public objective truths so you can win them over. Working from home and other nonsense about inflation is a garbage reason to strike. Show the public how much value we get for our money and you will win me over (or probably not lol)

[newlygrounded]

Typical av, everyone has a very strong opinion (On something they have no experience with) and a very weak ability to back it up with evidence.

[rando]

Typical av, everyone has a very strong opinion (On something they have no experience with) and a very weak ability to back it up with evidence.

Who cares about these opinions of the ignorant people here. Tune in and listen to the federal workers picketing and you will be enlightened with their hardships and wrong doings of the government. In fact if you just turn avcanada off, you will pretty much hear every Canadians sobbing for the federal workers wishing we could pay them more. I would be willing to pay twice as much tax if federal workers could get what they are asking for! They need this!

[newlygrounded]

Typical av, everyone has a very strong opinion (On something they have no experience with) and a very weak ability to back it up with evidence.

Who cares about these opinions of the ignorant people here. Tune in and listen to the federal workers picketing and you will be enlightened with their hardships and wrong doings of the government. In fact if you just turn avcanada off, you will pretty much hear every Canadians sobbing for the federal workers wishing we could pay them more. I would be willing to pay twice as much tax if federal workers could get what they are asking for! They need this!

I’m sad how our country has turned into one of a crab in the bucket mentality. @#$! anybody who makes more than me, or has what I believe to be an easier life!

People literally found a solution where they can do more work for less money, and everybody here is so jealous and insecure that the demand they suffer! Because they can’t get the same benefit?