Vote

[BTD]

Maybe aviation is not needed, maybe it is. But anyone who says all the business travel can be subbed to zoom has a limited knowledge of the type of careers there are and the competition some firms are up against where a face to face meeting is what seals the deal.

[co-joe]

Don’t worry pilots your time is coming to an end …
Why do you feel that 200k per year is being underpaid ?
What value have you added to the economy, country and to people’s lives to earn a wage increase ?

The pandemic was very positive to show that aviation is not needed. Want to see your relatives? Go on a business trip? Use zoom! You are literally all obsolete.

Yes, why hold a relative's newborn baby in your arms when you can see them on a ipad, that's way better. In fact, let's just dip an ipad in the holy water instead of baptising them. It's pretty much the same thing. Why go to an actual wedding? Just watch the video later, nobody really wants to dance and tell stories in person anyway.

[Eric Janson]

Don’t worry pilots your time is coming to an end …
Why do you feel that 200k per year is being underpaid ?
What value have you added to the economy, country and to people’s lives to earn a wage increase ?

The pandemic was very positive to show that aviation is not needed. Want to see your relatives? Go on a business trip? Use zoom! You are literally all obsolete.

Disclaimer:- I don't work for Westjet but I would like to respond.

I don't make 200k per year.

I was providing logistical support for a country's Military. I did the 500th flight during COVID.
I have also flown Refugees to their new country.
I have also flown UN troops rotating in/out on a peacekeeping mission.
Currently doing a lot of flights for an African Flag Carrier connecting their Capital to Europe.

You can decide the value of the above for yourself.

During COVID I flew more than what I normally do. These were cargo flights using a passenger aircraft with the Economy seats removed. We delivered masks/PPE all over Europe and N America. The governments involved were appreciative.

The rapid recovery (in some cases to above 2019 levels) in a supply and demand Industry shows that your assertions are incorrect.

[Inverted2]

Ghostrider is just using extreme satire or trolling. Don’t take him too seriously. Still thinks we should be vaxxin’ and maskin’ in the Kovid forum.

[lostaviator]

Don’t worry pilots your time is coming to an end …
Why do you feel that 200k per year is being underpaid ?
What value have you added to the economy, country and to people’s lives to earn a wage increase ?

The pandemic was very positive to show that aviation is not needed. Want to see your relatives? Go on a business trip? Use zoom! You are literally all obsolete.

Doesn't like pilots.
Joined an aviation forum in 2017.
Continues to post.

Makes sense.

[flyinhigh]

Don’t worry pilots your time is coming to an end …
Why do you feel that 200k per year is being underpaid ?
What value have you added to the economy, country and to people’s lives to earn a wage increase ?

The pandemic was very positive to show that aviation is not needed. Want to see your relatives? Go on a business trip? Use zoom! You are literally all obsolete.

Hello Gabur, Nice to see your extremely dry personality continues here.

[GhostRider6]

Don’t worry pilots your time is coming to an end …
Why do you feel that 200k per year is being underpaid ?
What value have you added to the economy, country and to people’s lives to earn a wage increase ?

The pandemic was very positive to show that aviation is not needed. Want to see your relatives? Go on a business trip? Use zoom! You are literally all obsolete.

Yes, why hold a relative's newborn baby in your arms when you can see them on a ipad, that's way better. In fact, let's just dip an ipad in the holy water instead of baptising them. It's pretty much the same thing. Why go to an actual wedding? Just watch the video later, nobody really wants to dance and tell stories in person anyway.

I’m a big proponent of the digital age. I believe the pandemic showed that our carbon emissions can be curtailed by utilizing technology. Imagine how much our carbon footprints could be reduced by walking, using zoom and or taking public transit as opposed to driving and flying.

I think everything you mentioned above can be done as effectively on zoom. Also, creating carbon emissions and taxing the planet for your wedding? So you can see your relative ? so you can push the the planet to climate catastrophe?

Politicians, celebrities and CEO’s ( Kevin O’Leary) agree. Pilots are / will be obsolete. Transitioning you all to digital jobs is what’s best for our planet. The best thing possible is to keep working conditions in oil and gas, aviation, transportation low to drive people out of these carbon intensive professions.

Also, education for them will be critical … these are jobs not requiring significant education. Providing some form of education to tradespeople can help them transition .

What we pause today, can shape tomorrow .


Like it or not, this is coming:

https://www.weforum.org/communities/gfc ... ransitions

https://www.weforum.org/topics/climate-change

[MrMerth]

I don’t work for WJ. However, thanks for sticking up for working conditions in this industry.


This being said, after reading some of the commentary on the CBC articles. I think the public level of sympathy is zero to this cause.. here’s a snapshot of the commentary from the joe six pack peanut gallery.

- overpaid, glorified bus drivers.. trying to soak the poor public for more $$ before airplanes are all automated anyways

- pilots do nothing but sit there .. planes fly themselves

- another company ruined (westjet) by pure union greed

- WJ pilots are the worst.. we had to turn around once when trying to land ( assume go- around)

- greedy entitied people

- pilots trying to get more layovers in Jamaica

- fire em all..


It went downhill from there...


I DO NOT agree with any of the aforementioned statements.i found these statements extremely disheartening. Again, I appreciate everything you guys and gals are doing. However, I think the public needs to be educated as a whole on what YOU are fighting for and the working conditions in our industry.

For example, the food industry went all out on the “ buy local, buy small, buy organic” movement. Guess what? Things changed..people ( me included) started supporting local farmers.

Ignorance with respect to what we actually do/ the effort it takes to advance ( at least in the past) is PROLIFIC!!

However, As long as the public thinks we are replaceable “ bus drivers” requiring zero education or skill nothing will change. Moreover, that the magical computer does everything ..( no PDM nada) Change needs to happen at the consumer level as well as at the boardroom level.

In no way am I saying corporate greed does not exist and that changes need to happen higher up the food chain... .. The problem is, everyone thinks this career is glitzy and glamorous... and this feeds into the public’s thirst for cheaper wages at our expense.

I have yet to hear the union release a public statement as to what you folks are fighting for .. as well as what conditions are like.

Good luck !

[lostaviator]

The public doesn't understand the industry enough to making public statements beneficial. The general population has a tendency to love a good airline bashing story and can't seem to wrap their heads around the fact that the majority of our system failures in this country are a result of the regulatory bodies + Government.

The first step in any potential transition being referred to above will be one pilot ops. The public is going to have to ask themselves, is saving $5/seat on a ticket for a 5-hour flight really worth the reduced safety margins? The actual cost savings will probably be way less considering the remaining pilot will most likely be compensated more to make up for the "extra work".

I have been quite disappointed in our industry union(s) over the past few years in this area. The fact there has not been more public campaigns trying to change the "button pusher" narrative is quite alarming.

All that being said. I think we are a few decades away from seeing that change. Self driving cars were supposed to be all over the place by now, but that hasn't materialized. Big manufactures who spent billions on this technology have pulled out in recent years.

[Tigger]

The idea we are “overpaid, glorified bus drivers” is a little overblown but, infuriatingly, not helped one tiny little bit when passengers got used to seeing pilots from a certain un-named airline doing menial janitorial work grooming the cabin between flights - BIG embarrassment to the rest of us, but I digress… Anyway, as just one example, almost every single time I’ve ever missed due to crappy weather and then eventually managed to land, the folks are almost universally full of smiles, compliments, and “attaboys” for getting them home in one piece.

When push comes to shove, most of them know who’s flying the plane and whose hands their lives are in.

Our fingers are all crossed for you guys - fight the good fight!

[Unanswered topics]

I’m a big proponent of the digital age. I believe the pandemic showed that our carbon emissions can be curtailed by utilizing technology. Imagine how much our carbon footprints could be reduced by walking, using zoom and or taking public transit as opposed to driving and flying.

I think everything you mentioned above can be done as effectively on zoom. Also, creating carbon emissions and taxing the planet for your wedding? So you can see your relative ? so you can push the the planet to climate catastrophe?

When you speak of "carbon emissions", are you speaking of actual carbon emissions, as in soot, as in the stuff we wash off of the airplanes, or are you using "carbon" as the incorrect chemical nomenclature for (CO2)? Do you use incorrect and misleading chemical nomenclature for other compounds? If you see an H2O leak, do you talk about hydrogen leaks?

Ever read an IPCC report? Not the summary for policy makers. Not the press release. The actual IPCC report. Actually, I'll withdraw that question. You've already answered it.

[Mach1]

Always entertaining when the people who don't understand an industry have such well formed opinions.

Don't engage the pamphlet warrior. They've read a pamphlet and hence know everything about a complex and nuanced issue. What effect could everyone working from home and using giant server farms ever have on the environment? Once Captain Hindsight comes onto the scene everything is super easy, barely an inconvenience.

This would be an example of the effect of the internet, just one effect, but you know... https://www.whitehouse.gov/ostp/news-up ... %20States.

[‘Bob’]

Always entertaining when the people who don't understand an industry have such well formed opinions.

Don't engage the pamphlet warrior. They've read a pamphlet and hence know everything about a complex and nuanced issue. What effect could everyone working from home and using giant server farms ever have on the environment? Once Captain Hindsight comes onto the scene everything is super easy, barely an inconvenience.

This would be an example of the effect of the internet, just one effect, but you know... https://www.whitehouse.gov/ostp/news-up ... %20States.

You do realize that crypto mining and working from home are two completely different topics… right?

And whether you are in an office or at home you are using the same amount of computing power to do your job.

The difference is the massive reduction of carbon emissions to go and do it somewhere else

[BTD]

is super easy, barely an inconvenience.

He said the thing….Nice.

[Mach1]

You do realize that crypto mining and working from home are two completely different topics… right?

And whether you are in an office or at home you are using the same amount of computing power to do your job.

The difference is the massive reduction of carbon emissions to go and do it somewhere else

I'm going to need you to get all the way off my back about this.

https://www.iea.org/commentaries/the-ca ... -headlines

[BTD]

You do realize that crypto mining and working from home are two completely different topics… right?

And whether you are in an office or at home you are using the same amount of computing power to do your job.

The difference is the massive reduction of carbon emissions to go and do it somewhere else

I'm going to need you to get all the way off my back about this.

https://www.iea.org/commentaries/the-ca ... -headlines

He said the other thing.

Saying things is Tight.

[Mach1]

He said the other thing.

Saying things is Tight.

Thank you for bringing joy to my life today, so that the aviation can happen.

[billhill]

I’m a big proponent of the digital age. I believe the pandemic showed that our carbon emissions can be curtailed by utilizing technology. Imagine how much our carbon footprints could be reduced by walking, using zoom and or taking public transit as opposed to driving and flying.

I think everything you mentioned above can be done as effectively on zoom. Also, creating carbon emissions and taxing the planet for your wedding? So you can see your relative ? so you can push the the planet to climate catastrophe?

Politicians, celebrities and CEO’s ( Kevin O’Leary) agree. Pilots are / will be obsolete. Transitioning you all to digital jobs is what’s best for our planet. The best thing possible is to keep working conditions in oil and gas, aviation, transportation low to drive people out of these carbon intensive professions.

Also, education for them will be critical … these are jobs not requiring significant education. Providing some form of education to tradespeople can help them transition .

What we pause today, can shape tomorrow .


Like it or not, this is coming:

Well lets see here. Quite a mouthful.Politicians, celebrities and Kevin O'Leary. What do they all have in common? Think they know everything and the opposite is true. Kevin O'Leary??? Wow. Isn't that the guy whose wife was over .08 blood alcohol and driving Kevie's boat with him also in same boat and they had a fatal accident and tried to cover it up? Got away with it too. Isn't he the guy who was in cahoots with Bankman Fried on that mammoth crypto fraud? Yeah I thought so. Now let's see. If only: society was built around pedestrians we could walk everywhere local... never happen in North America, we would ride bicycles everywhere...never going to happen in North America. Using Zoom?? Have you ever conducted a business meeting on Zoom?? LMAO. Unicorn farts..

[Canadaflyer46]

Well the conciliation period has now come and gone, we’ve entered the 21 day cool-off period at which time job action can be announced. Still a total of 22 outstanding items to agree to, which is insane and shows the vast chasm between the union and management. Buckle up for May Long.

[TheLastonetoknow]

Well the conciliation period has now come and gone, we’ve entered the 21 day cool-off period at which time job action can be announced. Still a total of 22 outstanding items to agree to, which is insane and shows the vast chasm between the union and management. Buckle up for May Long.

22 outstanding items. Not good at all.

[Tgertzen]

If anyone on here is a junior YVR FO, would you be able to send me a private message please? Just a question or two for you. Thanks in advance.

[Canadaflyer46]

If anyone on here is a junior YVR FO, would you be able to send me a private message please? Just a question or two for you. Thanks in advance.

"Junior" as a YVR FO will still be 6 years in! At that point you would *almost* be off reserve and be able to hold a block.