WestJet "sets the record straight"

[thepoors]

https://www.westjet.com/en-ca/news/2023 ... d-straight

This is pure propaganda. What a f**ing embarrassment this company has become.

[Crewbunk]

At WestJet mainline, resignations have been relatively low, and the company has hired three times more pilots into WestJet mainline this year, than there have been resignations.

Doesn’t this mean that one out of every three Westjet pilots hired has quit. That’s not good!

[YC87DRVR]

At WestJet mainline, resignations have been relatively low, and the company has hired three times more pilots into WestJet mainline this year, than there have been resignations.

Doesn’t this mean that one out of every three Westjet pilots hired has quit. That’s not good!

No, not what they mean. They mean they’ve hired three times as many pilots than the amount that has left. I call bullsh*T though. Although everything in that article is complete bullsh*T and reeks of desperation.

[co-joe]

That's a pretty weird way of saying that 70 pilots a month are quitting and nobody will show up for groundschool.

[CanadaAir]

WestJet sets the record straight


By WestJet
|
May 8, 2023
|
4 min read

The WestJet Group of Companies is aware of today’s informational picketing events in Calgary, Toronto and Vancouver, being held by ALPA, the union representing WestJet mainline and Swoop pilots. WestJet respects the rights of our employees to participate in informational picketing, and we continue to listen to our pilots’ concerns.

WestJet management is committed to achieving an agreement that is competitive within Canada’s airline industry and acknowledges the importance of our pilots, while at the same time secures WestJet’s financial future and avoids unnecessary disruption for Canadian travellers and communities.

To set the record straight, WestJet is sharing some quick facts.

What does ALPA mean by a “North American standard contract"?

• There is no such thing as a standard contract that spans a continent in any industry; contracts need to reflect national labour laws, cost of living, economic environment and geography associated with the country a person is employed in.

• A WestJet contract equally needs to reflect the realities in which WestJet operates.
  WestJet mainline pilots are amongst the best paid pilots in Canada.
  ALPA is suggesting that Canadian pilots earn roughly half of what U.S. pilots earn and creating an expectation that wages should be doubled as part of a new agreement, to reflect the U.S. industry.
  WestJet’s 737 pilots are amongst the top Canadian income earners across all professions.
  To further contrast Canada’s aviation sector, the U.S. aviation sector is supported by tax money and saw strong financial support during the COVID-19 pandemic.
  ALPA’s expectations of wages, if realized, would pose a significant impact to WestJet’s ability to remain competitive and provide affordable air travel to Canadians.

Is there a risk of labour action?

• WestJet is committed to a reasonable contract that includes meaningful improvements to the current agreement.
  WestJet believes labour action can be avoided, as both parties continue to negotiate in earnestness at this time.
  In the unlikely circumstance of a work stoppage, WestJet is prepared with contingency planning to minimize what could be significant impacts to guest travel.
  WestJet is not willing to put the future of the company and 15,000 jobs at risk by agreeing to a contract that isn’t financially viable for the long-term future. With the endorsement of WestJet’s Board of Directors, WestJet is ready to financially weather labour action if required.

Is WestJet losing pilots? 

• At WestJet mainline, resignations have been relatively low, and the company has hired three times more pilots into WestJet mainline this year, than there have been resignations.
  Where WestJet is seeing the greatest pilot attrition is in its regional subsidiary, WestJet Encore. While Encore is not subject to the current bargaining, it is worth noting that WestJet management is committed to improving career perspective and job security for its valued Encore pilots.

Our focus remains at the bargaining table, as we are actively negotiating and are unwaveringly committed to achieving an agreement that is competitive within Canada’s airline industry. We believe with a commitment from both parties, an agreement is achievable.

WestJet’s primary focus remains unchanged: ensuring we have a long-term sustainable future so that we can continue to operate critical air service for millions of Canadians, while providing jobs for thousands at the WestJet Group.

[CanadaAir]

1) WestJet well behind on cost of living.
Experienced pilots starting at WestJet as 737 First Officer in 2023 would be accepting a salary of $47,500 if inflation adjusted back to 2013.
Or $35,000 US.

Minimum wage's almost $17/hr
" The Ontario government is increasing the minimum wage to $16.55 an hour on October 1, 2023. This 6.8 per cent pay raise for low-income workers builds on the government’s steady and predictable increases every year to help families offset the rising cost of living."

In 2013 Ontario minimum wage was close to $10.
Minimum wage has increase 60% in 10 years.
Pilot wages haven't increased, they've gone down with inflation.



2) "WestJet mainline pilots are amongst the best paid pilots in Canada" false

3) "ALPA is suggesting that Canadian pilots earn roughly half of what U.S. pilots earn and creating an expectation that wages should be doubled as part of a new agreement, to reflect the U.S. industry." No, Asking to triple some wages to align with US 737 pay, same as other US airlines & King Airs

viewtopic.php?t=182605

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4) "To further contrast Canada’s aviation sector, the U.S. aviation sector is supported by tax money and saw strong financial support during the COVID-19 pandemic" false, WestJet dropped out of the talks to get Covid aid

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/westje ... -1.6110250


5) "ALPA’s expectations of wages, if realized, would pose a significant impact to WestJet’s ability to remain competitive and provide affordable air travel to Canadians." false, WestJet has the ability to pay, ticket price impact is small & other carriers would have to raise wages to retain their pilots from moving to WestJet

[braaap Braap]

Very weird way to word the attrition. “Into mainline” “seeing attrition at Encore”???? Is flow still a thing? Theyre not actually attracting off the street but shuffling and “hiring” Encore people?

[CanadaAir]

1) "WestJet is committed to a reasonable contract that includes meaningful improvements to the current agreement." Since when?

2) "as both parties continue to negotiate in earnestness at this time." false

3) " WestJet is prepared with contingency planning to minimize what could be significant impacts to guest travel." unlikely, based on how regular operations are managed

4) "WestJet is not willing to put the future of the company and 15,000 jobs at risk by agreeing to a contract that isn’t financially viable for the long-term future. "

The company or the jobs aren't at risk. Discussed in post on essential work

The pause in profit is what affects the shareholders, this is the pressure of a strike.
If the shareholders start losing profit, they start questioning the management & board running the airline.

If the shareholders don't see the management solving the issues, then the CEO, board and senior managers are replaced.



5) With the endorsement of WestJet’s Board of Directors, WestJet is ready to financially weather labour action if required."

WJ pilots ready and financed. ALPA ready. Supported by pilots across the country and states.

[CanadaAir]

Very weird way to word the attrition. “Into mainline” “seeing attrition at Encore”???? Is flow still a thing? Theyre not actually attracting off the street but shuffling and “hiring” Encore people?

May 8
"At WestJet mainline, resignations have been relatively low, and the company has hired three times more pilots into WestJet mainline this year, than there have been resignations."

2 weeks ago
"referring to pilots. “But what we are seeing is high attrition. That’s certainly an impact of the current situation.”

[330heavy]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

[Dronepiper]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

I heard they are offering $500

[BTD]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

I heard they are offering $500

Per day?

[CanadaAir]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

North American pilot wages the other airlines moving to.

“Delta is out there as a marker,” American Airlines Chief Financial Officer Devon May told Reuters. “That’s what we are looking towards as we are working with our pilots union to get a deal done.”


“I want to thank both negotiating teams and the National Mediation Board for their efforts in reaching this agreement that recognizes our pilots’ contributions to Delta,” said Delta Chief of Operations John Laughter. “From the beginning of the negotiations process, we set out to deliver the industry’s best pilot contract to the industry’s best pilots, one that keeps us as a top destination for U.S. aviation careers, and this contract is a reflection of that unwavering commitment.”

[accountant]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

North American pilot wages the other airlines moving to.

“Delta is out there as a marker,” American Airlines Chief Financial Officer Devon May told Reuters. “That’s what we are looking towards as we are working with our pilots union to get a deal done.”

The US is not a comparable. Get over it already. 10x the population, entirely different travel market, entirely different funding model as far as transportation, taxes, etc go, and massively financed operations that are hugely reliant on ancillary (card / ff) spend.

Meanwhile, you're asking for a massive raise from the Greyhound Air of Canada expecting they can pay Delta wages.

They aren't even part of an alliance or have any sort of semblance of a reasonable FF program that drives customers to take its flights.

You want to make US wages? Operate and pilot your airline like a top tier airline, not a bottom feeder. Even AC has you beat now and is crushing you on the business segment.

[Tbayer2021]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

North American pilot wages the other airlines moving to.

“Delta is out there as a marker,” American Airlines Chief Financial Officer Devon May told Reuters. “That’s what we are looking towards as we are working with our pilots union to get a deal done.”

The US is not a comparable. Get over it already. 10x the population, entirely different travel market, entirely different funding model as far as transportation, taxes, etc go, and massively financed operations that are hugely reliant on ancillary (card / ff) spend.

Meanwhile, you're asking for a massive raise from the Greyhound Air of Canada expecting they can pay Delta wages.

They aren't even part of an alliance or have any sort of semblance of a reasonable FF program that drives customers to take its flights.

You want to make US wages? Operate and pilot your airline like a top tier airline, not a bottom feeder. Even AC has you beat now and is crushing you on the business segment.

I wonder if AC or WJ tell Boeing and Airbus that they can't pay the same for parts and services because Canada is a completely different market.

[Canadaflyer46]

Does anyone even respond to this Accountant's trolling anymore? It is clear he has a disdain for pilots usually only seen at WJ management level. Five bucks says his wife ran off with a pilot.

[accountant]

I wonder if AC or WJ tell Boeing and Airbus that they can't pay the same for parts and services because Canada is a completely different market.

Parts are parts. They're fixed price. The airline knows what they're paying.

They're not paying more for the same part just because one was on the shelf longer than another.

Thanks for playing.

[digits_]

I wonder if AC or WJ tell Boeing and Airbus that they can't pay the same for parts and services because Canada is a completely different market.

Parts are parts. They're fixed price. The airline knows what they're paying.

They're not paying more for the same part just because one was on the shelf longer than another.

Thanks for playing.

Hehe, you're funny. Airplane parts prices go up and down all the time. How long they stay in the shelf is a major factor. And contrary to what one would think, prices do seem to go up when they stay on the shelf longer.

[Tbayer2021]

I wonder if AC or WJ tell Boeing and Airbus that they can't pay the same for parts and services because Canada is a completely different market.

Parts are parts. They're fixed price. The airline knows what they're paying.

They're not paying more for the same part just because one was on the shelf longer than another.

Thanks for playing.

Um no, they're not a fixed price. They go up to keep up with market demands, supply and cost of production. Just like replacing your cars windshield doesn't cost the same year after year. WJ, and every other airline, isn't paying the same for its tires (and everything else) year after year. If a Canadian airline can afford to pay regular prices when it comes to literally everything else, I'm confident they can afford substantial increases in pilot compensation. After all, the cost of maintaining these birds far outstrips total pilot compensation.

Gotta love an accountant saying that part prices are always the same.

Thanks for playing.

[Yowdriver]

I wonder if AC or WJ tell Boeing and Airbus that they can't pay the same for parts and services because Canada is a completely different market.

Parts are parts. They're fixed price. The airline knows what they're paying.

They're not paying more for the same part just because one was on the shelf longer than another.

Thanks for playing.

Don’t mind accountant.

A pilot took his wife and he’s been trolling on almost every single avcanada forums since . Better to ignore him

[hithere]

I’m starting to think “accountant” is not management at all but is the wingsuit guy and is obviously one of the few WestJet pilots that voted against the strike

[RippleRock]

I hear 2 differnt pay increases being floated around. 30% increase to match what most got in % in the US, and double to finally being on par with the US, so which is it?

North American pilot wages the other airlines moving to.

“Delta is out there as a marker,” American Airlines Chief Financial Officer Devon May told Reuters. “That’s what we are looking towards as we are working with our pilots union to get a deal done.”

The US is not a comparable. Get over it already. 10x the population, entirely different travel market, entirely different funding model as far as transportation, taxes, etc go, and massively financed operations that are hugely reliant on ancillary (card / ff) spend.

Meanwhile, you're asking for a massive raise from the Greyhound Air of Canada expecting they can pay Delta wages.

They aren't even part of an alliance or have any sort of semblance of a reasonable FF program that drives customers to take its flights.

You want to make US wages? Operate and pilot your airline like a top tier airline, not a bottom feeder. Even AC has you beat now and is crushing you on the business segment.

You are a troll, and likely a management hack.

Unfortunately you are in the wrong department to actually understand parts procurement or retention, so commenting on it makes you look uneducated. Commenting on the perceived cross-border value of pilots makes you look even dumber.

Underpaid and under appreciated makes one a bit bitter doesn't it. Lashing out because you likely make 60k or less and have formed some form of hate on for those self entitled sky-jockeys? One of us probably stole your last girl, which would explain why you have so much time to spend on your computer.

If it's not that, don't blame your failed medical because of your "Bubbles style" glasses, childhood afflicted asthma or any other shortcoming that make you "unworthy for the role" on us.

Which is it? Because it's obviously something.

FWIW....not one of us owes you an explanation for our actions in negotiating, and not one of us is asking your permission to proceed.

[hithere]

I’m starting to think “accountant” is not management at all but is the wingsuit guy and is obviously one of the few WestJet pilots that voted against the strike

[accountant]

North American pilot wages the other airlines moving to.

“Delta is out there as a marker,” American Airlines Chief Financial Officer Devon May told Reuters. “That’s what we are looking towards as we are working with our pilots union to get a deal done.”

The US is not a comparable. Get over it already. 10x the population, entirely different travel market, entirely different funding model as far as transportation, taxes, etc go, and massively financed operations that are hugely reliant on ancillary (card / ff) spend.

Meanwhile, you're asking for a massive raise from the Greyhound Air of Canada expecting they can pay Delta wages.

They aren't even part of an alliance or have any sort of semblance of a reasonable FF program that drives customers to take its flights.

You want to make US wages? Operate and pilot your airline like a top tier airline, not a bottom feeder. Even AC has you beat now and is crushing you on the business segment.

You are a troll, and likely a management hack.

Unfortunately you are in the wrong department to actually understand parts procurement or retention, so commenting on it makes you look uneducated. Commenting on the perceived cross-border value of pilots makes you look even dumber.

Underpaid and under appreciated makes one a bit bitter doesn't it. Lashing out because you likely make 60k or less and have formed some form of hate on for those self entitled sky-jockeys? One of us probably stole your last girl, which would explain why you have so much time to spend on your computer.

If it's not that, don't blame your failed medical because of your "Bubbles style" glasses, childhood afflicted asthma or any other shortcoming that make you "unworthy for the role" on us.

Which is it? Because it's obviously something.

FWIW....not one of us owes you an explanation for our actions in negotiating, and not one of us is asking your permission to proceed.

Nope you owe no explanation. Nor does the public when it chooses to vote with its feet and switch airlines.

Any goodwill WS pilots had has been lost. Good luck earning it back when you strike coming into summer season.

[hithere]

Yup… it’s the wingsuit guy