Starting Pay?

[Launchpad1]

Does flat pay still exist at Air Canada? I believe it used to be for 5 years. I'm getting some conflicting info on the subject.

[Chelsea Handler]

Flat pay existed until 2020. The governments inflation policy to destroy average people has made them rebrand the first four years working at Air Canada. They call the first four years the volunteers because it's like a not for profit where you make just enough to cover some expenses like maintaining your vehicle, gas etc.

Volunteer pay ends after four years, and you graduate into North America shit pay.

[Launchpad1]

Haha got you. At least volunteer pay increases every year from PT McDonalds to FT Red Lobster.

Apparently ALPA is going to get you guys $100000 per hour though so you'll be good

[Blueontop]

I was wondering how long has flat pay been around? Was it brought in under the previous 10 year CBA or has it been around longer? How was it sold to the membership? I am pretty sure ACPA has their dirty hands all over it but with it affecting so many people detrimentally how did it pass the members vote?

[thepoors]

Does flat pay still exist at Air Canada? I believe it used to be for 5 years. I'm getting some conflicting info on the subject.

Yes it does, here's a thorough explanation from an old thread:

Once upon a time, “flat pay” at AC was as you describe… you got paid the same regardless of how much or little you flew. (I believe you still received per diems, so not quite as bad as your description). This lasted for 2 years (3 if you were an RP, iirc).

The modern “flat pay” which was increased to 4 years after FOS, is not truly flat, as it is an hourly rate after 75 hours, or more simply an hourly rate with a 75 hour guarantee.

The difference is that pilots on formula pay receive a base amount, plus a weight factor, plus a speed factor, plus a different hourly rate for day or night flying. The “flat” pay is just a single rate, only changing with years of service, not all this other complexity, and the same regardless of day or night (the day/night split is based on time of day, not actual darkness… so 12 hours of any day attract night rates, and the other 12 get day rates)

Formula pay pilots also receive additional pay for overseas and/or “navaid” pay, if your flight leaves Canada/USA/Mexico. There is a minimum monthly guarantee of these, depending on aircraft type. Flat pay pilots do not receive either of these OVS or NAV pay.

So FLAT pay is a bit of a misnomer, but there is some truth to it. The term is a carryover from when pay was truly flat.

[thepoors]

I was wondering how long has flat pay been around? Was it brought in under the previous 10 year CBA or has it been around longer? How was it sold to the membership? I am pretty sure ACPA has their dirty hands all over it but with it affecting so many people detrimentally how did it pass the members vote?

At the time AC was a "more senior" company if you will, with not much hiring happening thus less guys on the lower end. ACPA and senior membership basically said - @#$! you, I got mine. And proceeded to screw a generation of new hires. There was also a bunch of fear mongering about the company's finances going on post-2008 recession that lead to the dumpster fire that was the 2014 agreement. When in reality AC was highly profitable and hit record profits in 2017. With excellent profits continuing right up until covid hit.

Only now, with a bunch of new blood joining the company in this recent hiring wave, and seeing how US pilots have transformed their compensation, is the rhetoric shifting. But I'm sure the greedy old boomer fucks will continue to vote contrary to what would benefit everyone else at the company.