Sky Regional?

[higherisbetter]

Senior VP, VP, CP and ACP are all from Sky Regional now.

[cjp]

Porter = Skyregional 2.0+

[rudder]

Porter = Skyregional 2.0+

Don’t forget to send a ‘thank you’ note to Jazz and AC.

AC could return the favour and start to hire a disproportionate number of PD pilots. Time will tell.

[cjp]

Porter = Skyregional 2.0+

Don’t forget to send a ‘thank you’ note to Jazz and AC.

AC could return the favour and start to hire a disproportionate number of PD pilots. Time will tell.

Thank you for the talent mismanagement Air Canada and Jazz

100%, once Air Canada sorts out their starting pay, and the flood gates open you'll see a hugely disproportionate number of new AC pilots coming from Porter.

[YC87DRVR]

That’s a good thing for Porter Pilots, Sky was always known for treating their pilots well

[cjp]

That’s a good thing for Porter Pilots, Sky was always known for treating their pilots well

Well, it's the former pilots who have joined Porter management, not the former managers. Small exception - S.R - but he's a pilot's Chief as far as I can tell.

Sky struggled to pay well because Air Canada put a ton of pressure on them by playing Jazz, Georgian and Sky against each other.

Some things same, some things very different.

[DanWEC]

The guys at Sky were great, (With the exception of the one utter shill in mgmt.) Besides that, everyone was on the same team knowing they were paid like garbage and stuck together like a family. I'd rest very easy if I were at PO knowing these dudes were in management and training. Boatloads of experience, and they're pilot's pilots.

[CaptDukeNukem]

The guys at Sky were great, (With the exception of the one utter shill in mgmt.) Besides that, everyone was on the same team knowing they were paid like garbage and stuck together like a family. I'd rest very easy if I were at PO knowing these dudes were in management and training. Boatloads of experience, and they're pilot's pilots.

+1

[MAX8 Driver]

.

[cjp]

All I can say is the new formula is likely going to be very effective growing this operation, but I liked J.G so it was difficult to see him go. The change is meant to solidify the E2 management side, as we are transitioning to becoming a significant North American jet operator with a Dash feeder.

As far as our Sky friends, I think they are doing significantly better than anything an Air Canada regional could offer - with the scheduled OT, most YR 1 Training Captains are going to be grossing not [clearing] 200k without breaking a sweat, and with any new benchmarking on the Captain's side to parallel Westjet in July - likely tickling 250-280k - possibly higher YR2. I would imagine also on the next benchmark, we'll see Dash crew and E2 FOs see some love as well.

Interesting times here at Porter.

Happy Canada Day

[Fidget]

That’s a good thing for Porter Pilots, Sky was always known for treating their pilots well

Well, it's the former pilots who have joined Porter management, not the former managers. Small exception - S.R - but he's a pilot's Chief as far as I can tell.

BS. I would be careful if I were you. He has told many pilots not to report defects because of how it will affect the next flight and fudging duty times to get the job done because AC called to complain that flight has to be cancelled, etc. Total bush league. Maybe he’s changed but I’m sceptical.

[rigpiggy]

call recorder on your phone, all calls get recorded.

[cjp]

That’s a good thing for Porter Pilots, Sky was always known for treating their pilots well

Well, it's the former pilots who have joined Porter management, not the former managers. Small exception - S.R - but he's a pilot's Chief as far as I can tell.

BS. I would be careful if I were you. He has told many pilots not to report defects because of how it will affect the next flight and fudging duty times to get the job done because AC called to complain that flight has to be cancelled, etc. Total bush league. Maybe he’s changed but I’m sceptical.

Haven't seen or heard of anything like that - S.R doesn't do a lot of line flying. Also, Porter isn't subjected to some toxic overlord, so I would imagine a lot less pressure to do illegal bullshit. In fact quite the opposite - new ooerations are typically under heavy TC scrutiny.

The E2 operation isn't perfect, by any stretch of the imagination - but it's finding it's groove.

[CaptDukeNukem]

That’s a good thing for Porter Pilots, Sky was always known for treating their pilots well

Well, it's the former pilots who have joined Porter management, not the former managers. Small exception - S.R - but he's a pilot's Chief as far as I can tell.

BS. I would be careful if I were you. He has told many pilots not to report defects because of how it will affect the next flight and fudging duty times to get the job done because AC called to complain that flight has to be cancelled, etc. Total bush league. Maybe he’s changed but I’m sceptical.

This is not the case. I’ve known him for years. Never once has he told me to fudge my times or not snag an item, nor have I heard of pilots being asked the same by him.

Edit: And I agree with cjp. TC is constantly watching this new operation. No one is screwing around. Things are real and done correctly. Just got ramped the other day. They were happy

[khedrei]

All I can say is the new formula is likely going to be very effective growing this operation, but I liked J.G so it was difficult to see him go. The change is meant to solidify the E2 management side, as we are transitioning to becoming a significant North American jet operator with a Dash feeder.

As far as our Sky friends, I think they are doing significantly better than anything an Air Canada regional could offer - with the scheduled OT, most YR 1 Training Captains are going to be clearing 200k without breaking a sweat, and with any new benchmarking on the Captain's side to parallel Westjet in July - likely tickling 250-280k - possibly higher YR2. I would imagine also on the next benchmark, we'll see Dash crew and E2 FOs see some love as well.

Interesting times here at Porter.

Happy Canada Day

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k? And do you really expect a 130k raise in one year because of the westjet contract to get to that 280k you quote? These numbers don't make any sense.

Plus, these wages are ONLY for the E2 jet. What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

[Chaxterium]

with the scheduled OT

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k?

You missed the "with schedule OT" part. Overtime is quite lucrative and there's currently a lot of it.

What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

The company is currently nearing completion of another benchmarking for the pilots. I suspect there will be a slight bump for the E2 pilots but the majority of the gains will be on the Q. The most recent update we received stated that the new pay for the Q pilots will be "bold".

I suppose we'll see.

[CaptDukeNukem]

All I can say is the new formula is likely going to be very effective growing this operation, but I liked J.G so it was difficult to see him go. The change is meant to solidify the E2 management side, as we are transitioning to becoming a significant North American jet operator with a Dash feeder.

As far as our Sky friends, I think they are doing significantly better than anything an Air Canada regional could offer - with the scheduled OT, most YR 1 Training Captains are going to be clearing 200k without breaking a sweat, and with any new benchmarking on the Captain's side to parallel Westjet in July - likely tickling 250-280k - possibly higher YR2. I would imagine also on the next benchmark, we'll see Dash crew and E2 FOs see some love as well.

Interesting times here at Porter.

Happy Canada Day

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k? And do you really expect a 130k raise in one year because of the westjet contract to get to that 280k you quote? These numbers don't make any sense.

Plus, these wages are ONLY for the E2 jet. What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

Training pay isn’t a huge amount, but because every day is a training day for training pilots, it amounts to almost $2000 gross per month. Which is an extra $24000 a year on top of Yr1 salary. Which brings it to 179,000$ per year.

Plus they are blocking us training pilots at over 100 credits per month, and currently anything over 85, picked up GDO or grey day is double time.

So yea, 200k without breaking a sweat is accurate

[cjp]

All I can say is the new formula is likely going to be very effective growing this operation, but I liked J.G so it was difficult to see him go. The change is meant to solidify the E2 management side, as we are transitioning to becoming a significant North American jet operator with a Dash feeder.

As far as our Sky friends, I think they are doing significantly better than anything an Air Canada regional could offer - with the scheduled OT, most YR 1 Training Captains are going to be clearing 200k without breaking a sweat, and with any new benchmarking on the Captain's side to parallel Westjet in July - likely tickling 250-280k - possibly higher YR2. I would imagine also on the next benchmark, we'll see Dash crew and E2 FOs see some love as well.

Interesting times here at Porter.

Happy Canada Day

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k? And do you really expect a 130k raise in one year because of the westjet contract to get to that 280k you quote? These numbers don't make any sense.

Plus, these wages are ONLY for the E2 jet. What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

These magical numbers are coming from some of trainers I occasionally chat and fly with who have shown me their paycheques. Seeing is believing. Now - let's make one thing clear, they are absolutely working for those numbers. Typically minimal days off per month - and high credit, long duty days to keep up with SIM and L.I training. Hats off to that department. Speaking of hats - we may want to consider a redesign.

As far as Dash and FOs - I'm pretty sure I made it clear they need some love. The focus has been on Captains since launch, because you can run a ship with two Captains, but you can't with two FOs.

Porter is an LCC with legacy dreams. We've got a great team, we don't have the highest industry rates or best package, but we make the best of the situation. The E2 has definitely put a spotlight on disparity between props and jets within Porter. Hopefully, on the next few benchmarks, we can find numbers that keep everyone happy.

[cdnavater]

All I can say is the new formula is likely going to be very effective growing this operation, but I liked J.G so it was difficult to see him go. The change is meant to solidify the E2 management side, as we are transitioning to becoming a significant North American jet operator with a Dash feeder.

As far as our Sky friends, I think they are doing significantly better than anything an Air Canada regional could offer - with the scheduled OT, most YR 1 Training Captains are going to be clearing 200k without breaking a sweat, and with any new benchmarking on the Captain's side to parallel Westjet in July - likely tickling 250-280k - possibly higher YR2. I would imagine also on the next benchmark, we'll see Dash crew and E2 FOs see some love as well.

Interesting times here at Porter.

Happy Canada Day

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k? And do you really expect a 130k raise in one year because of the westjet contract to get to that 280k you quote? These numbers don't make any sense.

Plus, these wages are ONLY for the E2 jet. What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

Training pay isn’t a huge amount, but because every day is a training day for training pilots, it amounts to almost $2000 gross per month. Which is an extra $24000 a year on top of Yr1 salary. Which brings it to 179,000$ per year.

Plus they are blocking us training pilots at over 100 credits per month, and currently anything over 85, picked up GDO or grey day is double time.

So yea, 200k without breaking a sweat is accurate

I think there is a misunderstanding going on, the phrase “clear 200k” means after tax income.
To clear 200k you would need to earn a gross of 400kish, I believe this is where the problem lies.
I wish my company would pay me a training override of 2000/mth, it’s currently about 500 which has never been enough but now even more pathetic.
Anyone in the training department at Jazz knows you can make more on the line, unless you are an FO, but there are other “perks” that keep them there.

[rudder]

I wish my company would pay me a training override of 2000/mth, it’s currently about 500 which has never been enough but now even more pathetic.
Anyone in the training department at Jazz knows you can make more on the line, unless you are an FO, but there are other “perks” that keep them there.

Jazz needs to overhaul the training override or the only people left in the training dept will be FO’s who get top scale, pilots who want to sleep in their own bed every night, or pilots who want better vacation intervals.

Trainers are volunteers (no conscription). No airline can function without trainers and checkers. AC pays an extra $30-40k per year for line trainers. It is not an easy job and requires knowledge, effort, patience, and skill.

If this is not on the ‘fix it’ list, then things will back up badly at a time when training events are more frequent than ever (due to attrition and replacement).

[cjp]

Not sure where you are getting these magical numbers but the last pay scale I saw was YR1 captain making 150k ish. Is the training premium a 150k bonus to clear 200k? And do you really expect a 130k raise in one year because of the westjet contract to get to that 280k you quote? These numbers don't make any sense.

Plus, these wages are ONLY for the E2 jet. What is it 85%?? of the workforce is still working for poverty wages on the Q? I have heard Porter is a neat place to work, but I honestly can't see it.

Also, what are your thoughts on the abysmal pay for the FOs? They are only slightly ahead of Jazz for both FOs and Captains on the Q.

Training pay isn’t a huge amount, but because every day is a training day for training pilots, it amounts to almost $2000 gross per month. Which is an extra $24000 a year on top of Yr1 salary. Which brings it to 179,000$ per year.

Plus they are blocking us training pilots at over 100 credits per month, and currently anything over 85, picked up GDO or grey day is double time.

So yea, 200k without breaking a sweat is accurate

I think there is a misunderstanding going on, the phrase “clear 200k” means after tax income.
To clear 200k you would need to earn a gross of 400kish, I believe this is where the problem lies.
I wish my company would pay me a training override of 2000/mth, it’s currently about 500 which has never been enough but now even more pathetic.
Anyone in the training department at Jazz knows you can make more on the line, unless you are an FO, but there are other “perks” that keep them there.

My apologies, to those I may have confused or misled. No, they aren't earning an after tax income of over 200k, but they are earning gross incomes north of that with after tax in the mid 100s. Very healthy figures.

Slip of the tongue lads.

[rudder]

My apologies, to those I may have confused or misled. No, they aren't earning an after tax income of over 200k, but they are earning gross incomes north of that with after tax in the mid 100s. Very healthy figures.

Slip of the tongue lads.

One thing these trainers will learn is about marginal tax rates. ONT blended rate is 53.4% above $225k taxable (although the bracket adjusts annually based on inflation).

It is quite a shock to get that pay period summary with “tax deducted” of $10K+…….

One has to take a hard look at net vs gross when making decisions about selling days off.

[cjp]

My apologies, to those I may have confused or misled. No, they aren't earning an after tax income of over 200k, but they are earning gross incomes north of that with after tax in the mid 100s. Very healthy figures.

Slip of the tongue lads.

One thing these trainers will learn is about marginal tax rates. ONT blended rate is 53.4% above $225k taxable (although the bracket adjusts annually based on inflation).

It is quite a shock to get that pay period summary with “tax deducted” of $10K+…….

One has to take a hard look at net vs gross when making decisions about selling days off.

It certainly is challenging to see 53.5% stripped away. Nice thing is it stops there, so just keep upping that pre-tax.

[khedrei]

The net/clears point clears that part up.

That being said, I don't think Porters wages on the Jet for training captains/line captains are anything to brag about given that only a couple handfuls of people are collecting them. The BULK of the pilot group is stuck with shitty E2 FO pay or the joke of ALL pay on the Q. My entry level FO salary is almost as much as a first year captain on the Q and double the Q FO salary. To say they need some love is an understatement. The FOs need a 100% raise and I cant see a world where that would happen.

Don't think I'm trashing the company either. I know people who work there, and a VP. It seems like a really cool company and I was interested in it years ago when I saw a recruitment presentation from one of the training captains. But the wages are abysmal. For what they are paying, I wouldnt drive to the island even if I got to turn around and drive home right away not performing any work.

I do hope you guys get a HUGE raise. It will help everyone.

[Dyna]

There was a reference to J.G. moving on. Was there a change to DFO?