Emirates or Air Canada

[M. Essaie]

Primary consideration for joining Emirates is that it is a waste of time unless you plan on 25 years or so. If you have some idea you will likely leave earlier, don't go. An early departure will see you having to join someone else's seniority list and also discovering that many potential employers would prefer that you had some experience other than drowsing over the controls of an A380 for 4000 miles at a time.

Big plus with Emirates - on your retirement date from your 25 years at EK you may compare yourself to someone retiring that same day from AC. AC-man will be looking at being doled a pay check of a certain amount monthly until his breathing stops. That's nice. You, however, will have somewhere around
$1,5000,000 in cold hard assets that belong to you. These two financial situations are not even remotely comparable. Emirates-man wins big time.

[cdnavater]

Primary consideration for joining Emirates is that it is a waste of time unless you plan on 25 years or so. If you have some idea you will likely leave earlier, don't go. An early departure will see you having to join someone else's seniority list and also discovering that many potential employers would prefer that you had some experience other than drowsing over the controls of an A380 for 4000 miles at a time.

Big plus with Emirates - on your retirement date from your 25 years at EK you may compare yourself to someone retiring that same day from AC. AC-man will be looking at being doled a pay check of a certain amount monthly until his breathing stops. That's nice. You, however, will have somewhere around
$1,5000,000 in cold hard assets that belong to you. These two financial situations are not even remotely comparable. Emirates-man wins big time.

Is that a typo, 1.5 billion?
Because if it’s not, 1,500,000 is not a significant amount of money to retire with these days, I would say that’s the bare minimum you would want

[vanislepilot]

Primary consideration for joining Emirates is that it is a waste of time unless you plan on 25 years or so. If you have some idea you will likely leave earlier, don't go. An early departure will see you having to join someone else's seniority list and also discovering that many potential employers would prefer that you had some experience other than drowsing over the controls of an A380 for 4000 miles at a time.

Big plus with Emirates - on your retirement date from your 25 years at EK you may compare yourself to someone retiring that same day from AC. AC-man will be looking at being doled a pay check of a certain amount monthly until his breathing stops. That's nice. You, however, will have somewhere around
$1,5000,000 in cold hard assets that belong to you. These two financial situations are not even remotely comparable. Emirates-man wins big time.

Is that a typo, 1.5 billion?
Because if it’s not, 1,500,000 is not a significant amount of money to retire with these days, I would say that’s the bare minimum you would want

I think they meant 15 million

[altiplano]

15 million saved? In 25 years? You'd have to sock away/have your investments perform to a tune of an average of $600,000/yr in accumulation.

That doesn't sound realistic.

[TeePeeCreeper]

15 million saved? In 25 years? You'd have to sock away/have your investments perform to a tune of an average of $600,000/yr in accumulation.

That doesn't sound realistic.

I’ve a few friends currently at EK and 15 M doesn’t sound too outrageous with compound interest and if a very aggressively well managed group portfolio is taken into consideration…

TPC

[RB211]

Primary consideration for joining Emirates is that it is a waste of time unless you plan on 25 years or so. If you have some idea you will likely leave earlier, don't go. An early departure will see you having to join someone else's seniority list and also discovering that many potential employers would prefer that you had some experience other than drowsing over the controls of an A380 for 4000 miles at a time.

Big plus with Emirates - on your retirement date from your 25 years at EK you may compare yourself to someone retiring that same day from AC. AC-man will be looking at being doled a pay check of a certain amount monthly until his breathing stops. That's nice. You, however, will have somewhere around
$1,5000,000 in cold hard assets that belong to you. These two financial situations are not even remotely comparable. Emirates-man wins big time.

I wouldn’t say one needs to plan 25 years or forget Emirates. Most don’t stay that long in fact. Also, many airlines value the pilots, whether 380 or 777, because of their global experience and generally high standards. Many have gone to the US and Canada. As well as Europe and, before COVID, Korean and Chinese airlines.

1.5 million is likely the number intended. Although if one stayed a full 25 years it would be higher. I think 15 million is an overestimate. Keep in mind that is ‘after tax’ money so ‘worth more’ than an equivalent amount in an RRSP in Canada.

There are far more considerations than airplane type and money when looking at EK, or any expat gig. Both positive and negative. Really do the homework because the ‘new airplane’ fun wears off and no amount of money is worth feeling trapped in a place you don’t want to be.

[altiplano]

15 million saved? In 25 years? You'd have to sock away/have your investments perform to a tune of an average of $600,000/yr in accumulation.

That doesn't sound realistic.

I’ve a few friends currently at EK and 15 M doesn’t sound too outrageous with compound interest and if a very aggressively well managed group portfolio is taken into consideration…

TPC

If you invested $26,500 a month, every month, for 25 years and realized an average return of 5% compounding through that whole 25 years, you would have $15million.

That's investing $320K/year from year 1 with a market that only goes up. Never a market down turn, never a missed investment.

Sounds like roughly an entire EK CA salary plus profit share more or less for 25 years. Maybe if you didn't eat or clothe yourself? or have a family? or spend a nickel for your whole life? and saved and invested every penny you could have $15million...

Doesn't sound too realistic...

[ant_321]

15 million saved? In 25 years? You'd have to sock away/have your investments perform to a tune of an average of $600,000/yr in accumulation.

That doesn't sound realistic.

I’ve a few friends currently at EK and 15 M doesn’t sound too outrageous with compound interest and if a very aggressively well managed group portfolio is taken into consideration…

TPC

If you invested $26,500 a month, every month, for 25 years and realized an average return of 5% compounding through that whole 25 years, you would have $15million.

That's investing $320K/year from year 1 with a market that only goes up. Never a market down turn, never a missed investment.

Sounds like roughly an entire EK CA salary plus profit share more or less for 25 years. Maybe if you didn't eat or clothe yourself? or have a family? or spend a nickel for your whole life? and saved and invested every penny you could have $15million...

Doesn't sound too realistic...

I agree $15 million sounds unlikely, but I would hope you could get a better return than 5%. If you could get 8-10% you could get to the $15 million ball park from about $15k per month but I doubt many people are squirrelling that much away.

[altiplano]

I’ve a few friends currently at EK and 15 M doesn’t sound too outrageous with compound interest and if a very aggressively well managed group portfolio is taken into consideration…

TPC

If you invested $26,500 a month, every month, for 25 years and realized an average return of 5% compounding through that whole 25 years, you would have $15million.

That's investing $320K/year from year 1 with a market that only goes up. Never a market down turn, never a missed investment.

Sounds like roughly an entire EK CA salary plus profit share more or less for 25 years. Maybe if you didn't eat or clothe yourself? or have a family? or spend a nickel for your whole life? and saved and invested every penny you could have $15million...

Doesn't sound too realistic...

I agree $15 million sounds unlikely, but I would hope you could get a better return than 5%. If you could get 8-10% you could get to the $15 million ball park from about $15k per month but I doubt many people are squirrelling that much away.

Whole market S&P 500 past 25 years real returns are 6.8%. If you went an aggressive all equity portfolio maybe you could expect that. Then again, we've been in a QE cycle for the past 15 years... I think that's become the norm for people's expectations, but really it isn't the norm historically.

8-10% for 25 years on an entire portfolio? I think that's probably a higher risk tolerance than I would take on for my whole portfolio... particularly into your later years/career you'd transition into more balance.

[vanislepilot]

If you invested $26,500 a month, every month, for 25 years and realized an average return of 5% compounding through that whole 25 years, you would have $15million.

That's investing $320K/year from year 1 with a market that only goes up. Never a market down turn, never a missed investment.

Sounds like roughly an entire EK CA salary plus profit share more or less for 25 years. Maybe if you didn't eat or clothe yourself? or have a family? or spend a nickel for your whole life? and saved and invested every penny you could have $15million...

Doesn't sound too realistic...

I agree $15 million sounds unlikely, but I would hope you could get a better return than 5%. If you could get 8-10% you could get to the $15 million ball park from about $15k per month but I doubt many people are squirrelling that much away.

Whole market S&P 500 past 25 years real returns are 6.8%. If you went an aggressive all equity portfolio maybe you could expect that. Then again, we've been in a QE cycle for the past 15 years... I think that's become the norm for people's expectations, but really it isn't the norm historically.

8-10% for 25 years on an entire portfolio? I think that's probably a higher risk tolerance than I would take on for my whole portfolio... particularly into your later years/career you'd transition into more balance.

Too much adult talk

You are far more likely to befriend a Sheikh working at Emirates than Air Canada

Suddenly 15 million seems low habibi

[SHMILER]

Quite a few rather defensive posts here.

There are reasons you'll want to go to AC. Money isn't one of them. For me I couldn't take the 85-90% pay cut.

There are reasons you'll want to go to EK. Being home with friends and family isn't one of them. Expat life is not for everyone, and once you've left home for any reasonable amount of time then it's hard to go back and expect things to be the way they were before you left.

You will have a far higher disposable income at EK, far sooner.
Year 1 Fo at Air Canada clears what ? $4000 a month?
Year 1 FO at Emirates clears $16000 a month.

If these contract negotiations go well and you get paid what you should, then I'd personally stick with Air Canada. If not, then I'd be looking elsewhere, as I did 20 years ago. Whether that's emirates or another airline. If the market in Canada won't change then you're going to have to change something yourself.

The high cost of living, high taxes and low wages are a horrible combination, so let's all hope that at least one of those elements changes for the better.

PS 15 million from the provident fund is way too aggressive. Yes some people probably have made that, but I think around 3-5 USD is more realistic across a career here and will of course require you to be putting in extra payments. You can play around with compound interest calculators and figure it out for yourself. I'd use a 6% return personally...

[Ash Ketchum]

Exactly, I'm starting to realize that even if we get a massive raise at AC, the cost of living and taxes in Canada will still make it a difficult country to have a comfortable life in. This isn't the same country I grew up in that's for sure.

I am personally looking to move to the US however my visa application was recently denied so I am trying other options like maybe doing an MBA in the US and getting employer sponsorship for a green card that way.

[Blueontop]

Anyone know the upgrade times/process at EK?

[DanWEC]

One thing to note is that an upgrade carrot isn't regarded as the only way to start making a livable wage and an excuse to depress FO wages into poverty, so the necessity for the all-important upgrade we're clamoring for here doesn't exist.

Capts make about 40% more than FO's at Emirates, not more than double as per the historical norm in Canada. Same goes for the YOS, it's nowhere near as drastically top-end weighted. You start doing a job and you get paid well right from the start. YOS are a little bonus, not a countdown to when you can finally pay bills and get out of debt while performing the exact same role. What a concept.

[RB211]

For those wondering about EK as an opportunity, here is the company page. Answers some of the questions:

https://www.emiratesgroupcareers.com/pilots/

Then best to find someone there to get first hand info of life and career in the sandbox.

[Vanguard]

Go to Emirates.

We’ve got too many issues here and glory holes are now one of them.


Amazing how quiet they kept this one. Haha

[Upgradeable]

Edited

[Vanguard]

https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/toro ... 4.amp.html


Can’t do this in Dubai. That’s all I’ll say.

[Canadianpilot2024]

Any idea what the schedules are like at emirates/fly dubai?

Is it a rotational type gig or is it similar to the airlines in canada?

[CaptDukeNukem]

You’re gonna be an expat. Be prepared to work max days allowable, first one to get laid off during next world event. Money is good of course.

Go skiing indoors, Dubai is cool. For a certain limited amount of time.

[tupues]

Any idea what the schedules are like at emirates/fly dubai?

Is it a rotational type gig or is it similar to the airlines in canada?

If you think AC is bad think you"ll be in for a surprise in the middle east as far as scheduling goes. Get ready to fly maximum amount of days, have reserve sprinkled on your schedule and have very little influence on the schedule as such. Yes, you get to bid days off and certain preferences. But thats where it ends. Also its social bidding, so seniority means nothing, except maybe for staff travel.
There is zero transparency in scheduling or god forbid reserve (none of that having access to everyones schedule etc). You always left wondering why some schedulers boyfriend got a better schedule than you.. you will never know. You're completely at the mercy of scheduling and they mess you around as they please as long as it is legal. No such thing as a CBA or indeed a union to fall back onto if you're displeased. You're sick? Better get a doctors note within 1 day from the company doctor (forget medical confidentiality), or these days will be unpaid and you'll likely be given some sort of warning... I could go on for hours. But the fact that long time EK cpts are here now as NB captains and FOs speaks for itself...

So, NO, it is in no shape or form similar to any airline in Canada

[Eric Janson]

Perhaps some of you should go and visit Dubai and see for yourself..

July/August is the best time - nothing beats arriving at 0530 when the low temperature for the day is 39c.

Personally I can't stand the place - everything is artificial (even the people!). I've never been able to picture myself living/working there.

I'll keep saying it - Do not give up a stable job in your home country to become an Expat.

[rookiepilot]

Curious as an outsider, has anyone flown for CX out of HK (I love HK as a visitor), is it different?

[jpilot77]

Curious as an outsider, has anyone flown for CX out of HK (I love HK as a visitor), is it different?

My buddy was a longtime Captain there. It’s not the job it once was. He left after 30 years. He used to be LA based. Now he’s at American and is very happy.

[Tbayer2021]

Curious as an outsider, has anyone flown for CX out of HK (I love HK as a visitor), is it different?

There is a book called "the 49ers The true story" that details the decline of the pilot job at Cathay. From being the golden standard throughout the world to a place you only goto if you have no other choice essentially.