Cornwall Aviation

[flyndad]

Anyone out there with any recent info on this school?

[TurkeyFarmYQX]

If three years ago counts as recent. I loved it, spent three weeks for my MIFR. Cost me about $14k if I remember with renting a room and food.

[Rubber Duck]

I found that my time at Cornwall was beneficial in that I got my MIFR in a short time for a reasonable price. Total cost for me was just under 15k including living expenses (I think a room in the house was $35 a day). This was back in fall 2021. The crew house is livable but not exactly clean, but you only have to live there for a couple weeks. It took me three weeks for the whole MIFR, including some delays for weather. Speaking of weather - you will not get any actual IMC experience. At least 2 years ago, they were not flying in any actual imc. You are also doing most of your instrument training while vfr, so the instructor will be acting as “atc” for most of the flight. The exception is the ILS into either mirabel or Ottawa, which are the only places you really go to. Maybe one more small airport for the xc portion. These are the sacrifices you make in order to get your rating in as little time as possible. They have streamlined the process and cut all the fat, so to speak. You may have a more comprehensive training at a different FTU, but it won’t be as fast or cheap. The aircraft are basic but serviceable and I felt that the maintenance was adequate.

The major plus side to Cornwall is the people you meet. Living with 4-6 other guys in the “Cornwall frat house” is a blast and I still keep in touch with a lot of the friends I made there. I don’t regret going to Cornwall at all, and I’d probably do it again if I needed to redo the MIFR rating.

Hope this helps!
Rubber Duck

P.S. I should clarify that I work on the floatplane end of things and I have no experience with an actual IFR operation. Perhaps the lack of imc time could be detrimental in your first IFR job? I don’t know. I do know that many people from Cornwall seem to be doing just fine in the IFR world

[Highbird]

Yes, I was there last year and this year to finish my Multi-IFR. The owner of the school is Dave, he is a farmer who lacks experience in aviation industry and treats you like crap. He will take things personal, for instance if you reject his accommodation and choose one of your own, you will be in trouble trouble. He won't priortize you for bookings and you will be there for way longer than u expected. Meanwhile, you will see people who come in and go within the 4 weeks if they stay at his accommodation, he would priortize them because he would have already promised people that would be coming in.

Talking about the accommodation he has, its horrible. There are two properties, one is walking distance and is the grossiest one of all, it smells like a rat house. You can actually hear the animals in the house from the ceiling- idk how. There is no stove, and its not clean at all. some people will be sleeping on the couches cos he would have given them a date to come in and expected the room to be available but the previous person would have not moved out yet.
Anyway, the second house is by the highway, about 30 mins walk, much cleaner. But you will get chased by the dog on the farm there while walking to school, so have a dog spray maybe.

Overall, I don't recommend this school to anyone.

The training is not in your control but in their hands, they book you when they feel like it. The information advertised on the website in regards to finishing quickly is false, I think it takes similar time to someone finishing elsewhere. A lot of people didn't finish and had to fly back, taking a different time slot to finish the training. Dave will also tell you that you have priority if you come back to finish, it is very much false. He won't get back to you for a long time, and he will be rude to you in person about it too, and possibly not book you for days if he ends up holding a grudge against you after the email exchange. It pretty much depends on his mood, but yeah good luck finishing in time with them. Its just a business like anywhere else.

They do try to make money on the simulator, which is more expensive than other schools. Even once you have finished all your 20 hours on sim, if they think you don't have it all, they might ask the CFI to test you, and he will take you on the sim. He will expect you to be super accurate on your "sim test," no altitude changes or heading changes, if off by more than the limits, you are a fail. In the end it will be the cdi's word, if he thinks you need more sim even after finishing 20, that's what they will do. They will put you in sim for more hours, and remember any of more sim than 20 hours is not counted by Transport Canada. So its a waste of your time and money. But money money for the school.

I recommend, Excel Flying school in Lethbridge and there are many others where you will be treated with respect and gain a lot better experience flying.
The other thing is at Cornwall, all the pilots are brand new, its a rotating door.

Good luck! Choose wisely!
Hope this helps someone.

[Highbird]

forgot to mention I spent $22K with accommodation.

[jpilot77]

Yes, I was there last year and this year to finish my Multi-IFR. The owner of the school is Dave, he is a farmer who lacks experience in aviation industry and treats you like crap. He will take things personal, for instance if you reject his accommodation and choose one of your own, you will be in trouble trouble. He won't priortize you for bookings and you will be there for way longer than u expected. Meanwhile, you will see people who come in and go within the 4 weeks if they stay at his accommodation, he would priortize them because he would have already promised people that would be coming in.

Talking about the accommodation he has, its horrible. There are two properties, one is walking distance and is the grossiest one of all, it smells like a rat house. You can actually hear the animals in the house from the ceiling- idk how. There is no stove, and its not clean at all. some people will be sleeping on the couches cos he would have given them a date to come in and expected the room to be available but the previous person would have not moved out yet.
Anyway, the second house is by the highway, about 30 mins walk, much cleaner. But you will get chased by the dog on the farm there while walking to school, so have a dog spray maybe.

Overall, I don't recommend this school to anyone.

The training is not in your control but in their hands, they book you when they feel like it. The information advertised on the website in regards to finishing quickly is false, I think it takes similar time to someone finishing elsewhere. A lot of people didn't finish and had to fly back, taking a different time slot to finish the training. Dave will also tell you that you have priority if you come back to finish, it is very much false. He won't get back to you for a long time, and he will be rude to you in person about it too, and possibly not book you for days if he ends up holding a grudge against you after the email exchange. It pretty much depends on his mood, but yeah good luck finishing in time with them. Its just a business like anywhere else.

They do try to make money on the simulator, which is more expensive than other schools. Even once you have finished all your 20 hours on sim, if they think you don't have it all, they might ask the CFI to test you, and he will take you on the sim. He will expect you to be super accurate on your "sim test," no altitude changes or heading changes, if off by more than the limits, you are a fail. In the end it will be the cdi's word, if he thinks you need more sim even after finishing 20, that's what they will do. They will put you in sim for more hours, and remember any of more sim than 20 hours is not counted by Transport Canada. So its a waste of your time and money. But money money for the school.

I recommend, Excel Flying school in Lethbridge and there are many others where you will be treated with respect and gain a lot better experience flying.
The other thing is at Cornwall, all the pilots are brand new, its a rotating door.

Good luck! Choose wisely!
Hope this helps someone.

I used Cornwall aviation for my multi engine rating and my initial multi IFR (and a renewal). I have nothing but good things to say about them. In and out quickly. Although I did not use accommodations.

[Me262]

I recommend Adventure Aviation in Grande Prairie. Did it this past summer.

They finished my ME rating and MIFR in 1 week (with some credits I had and the fact I had a plane ticket booked from before I found out all other flight schools had months wait time)

Accomodation is 160 per week. The shacks were clean and had a nice big kitchen and study living room.

But you can't go wrong with Cornwall, 2 planes gets the job done and heard good things

[vfrguy]

Personally, I had an excellent experience with Dave and the team at Cornwall Aviation. They will not hold your hand and leave a lot of it up to you (and I do not mean this in a negative way). The more prepared you are when you arrive, the better it will go.

I was in and out in just over 2 weeks and finished with both the multi and group 1 IFR... and this was in March. We were flying twice a day with a sim session here and there in between.

Dave set me up at a house in town. $40 a day and it was a private room with a beautiful kitchen, laundry facilities etc. It was about a 15-20 minute drive from the airport.

All said and done, I spent about 15k.

[stef]

Dave Small is a good guy. If you had a hard time with him, maybe take a look in the mirror.

[Highbird]

Great school, Dave makes it worse.

[newlygrounded]

Great school, Dave makes it worse.

Why do you feel this way?

[rookiepilot]

He will expect you to be super accurate on your "sim test," no altitude changes or heading changes, if off by more than the limits, you are a fail. In the end it will be the cdi's word, if he thinks you need more sim even after finishing 20, that's what they will do.

As it should be!

This is a problem why exactly? And sounds like the real issue from my read.

If you aren’t prepared to be super accurate you don’t deserve the rating or to be a commercial pilot flying passengers in IMC conditions. Or maybe any conditions. IFR flying isn’t a joke.

This is a big problem when it becomes normalized — and it has — for people to look for pencil whipped training,( or university education for that matter,) — and then complain loudly when someone says “not here”.

When I trained I pushed myself hard for excellence— one or 2 degrees off heading, correct. 20 -30 feet altitude, correct. Inside real clouds, BTW, and in the sim. Yeah, its hard. Thats the point.

What is the problem with this expectation?

[Ruger Princess]

He will expect you to be super accurate on your "sim test," no altitude changes or heading changes, if off by more than the limits, you are a fail. In the end it will be the cdi's word, if he thinks you need more sim even after finishing 20, that's what they will do.

As it should be!

This is a problem why exactly? And sounds like the real issue from my read.

If you aren’t prepared to be super accurate you don’t deserve the rating or to be a commercial pilot flying passengers in IMC conditions. Or maybe any conditions. IFR flying isn’t a joke.

This is a big problem when it becomes normalized — and it has — for people to look for pencil whipped training,( or university education for that matter,) — and then complain loudly when someone says “not here”.

When I trained I pushed myself hard for excellence— one or 2 degrees off heading, correct. 20 -30 feet altitude, correct. Inside real clouds, BTW, and in the sim. Yeah, its hard. Thats the point.

What is the problem with this expectation?

+1 !!!!!

[DanWEC]

You got it Highbird! When I was teaching MIFR if a student couldn't stay within tolerances they're 100% ready for the flight test at that moment and then real-world IFR with pax for sure!!

I'd be so mad they weren't passing me. That's just horseradish!

[Ruger Princess]

"I recommend, Excel Flying school in Lethbridge"


I do agree with this statement though. Excel is amazing! They get you in and out, don't waste your time or money and their CFI is CRAZY knowledgeable.

Of course I'm biased as I did a decent amount of training there.

[Captain_Coward]

In my experience Dave and his wife are amazing people running an amazing business. From my interactions with them they have been nothing but the best and I would recommend them to anyone.

Highbird I think you need to take a look in the mirror and realize its not Dave who is the issue here.
Study hard, keep training and you'll get there.

[Highbird]

Cornwall is dog shit. Straight up. They don’t tell you what the expectations are from the sim until they have done 20 hours of it with you, and later they r like oh no actually all we taught so far isn’t right, we need u to be on point. And now you tell me that, after I spent 20 hours with you?! And you kept using autopilot to keep on altitude. Just another school after your money. Great if it worked for you!
There’s an equal amount of students who it also didn’t work for.

[Highbird]

Dave is the rudest person, all my friends had a hard time, let’s be honest, he’s a farmer. His accommodations suck, not even clean, he mints money like a business. Treats people bad.

[rookiepilot]

Cornwall is dog shit. Straight up. They don’t tell you what the expectations are from the sim until they have done 20 hours of it with you, and later they r like oh no actually all we taught so far isn’t right, we need u to be on point. And now you tell me that, after I spent 20 hours with you?! And you kept using autopilot to keep on altitude. Just another school after your money. Great if it worked for you!
There’s an equal amount of students who it also didn’t work for.

We got it the first time. You flunked out.

[Highbird]

lol you do you bro. This info isn’t hate info, it’s for someone who decides to go there, should know the pros and cons of the place. All reviews are welcome, good or bad. We get it, you’re a fan, good for you. Make a tshirt about it and wear it.

[Jiffy]

Removed.

[DanWEC]

Cornwall has been responsible for a significant percentage of all the annual MIFR ratings in Canada for years. Literally thousands of ratings for several decades.
I know many instructors who worked there, I even trained some, and have never heard anything negative from employees or customers.
But, there are all types out there, even those who complain about $35 a night accommodations. Strange how one person can find fault with literally everything, even someone's dog, (!?) when thousands haven't.
What a quandary. The issue must be with Cornwall.

[Bravomike33]

Hi !
I’ve been at Cornwall Aviation as international student.

I didn’t even speak English at this time (still don’t ).
The fly school run constantly multi and single engine aircraft.
If you can hear about one flight school that has the most dynamic and reliable fleet of aircraft. It’s Cornwall. Maintenance is the best. They are on top of preventive and corrective maintenance. Reliable fleet. They work on the conservative side so it’s pretty good. I’d say as well regarding flying limit that they are conservative and that’s a good point over time. They would prefer seeing a student pilot taking the decision to cancel a flight rather than pushing their own limit in a crosswind and gusty icy wind. Safety first. You’ll have your whole life to enjoy the different aspect of flying.

Family business located in an uncontrolled airspace, so you will learn to fly uncontrolled right at the beginning. Ottawa and Montreal are 15/20 minutes flying away from it. So you’ll learn both. But you’ll be on the cheap side as you won’t have to pay fee because you won’t land or take off from there.
Some pilot may say that you won’t learn what it is to take-off and land in a controlled airport. If you want do to so, discuss to a responsible person at the flight school about your concern. I am not sure about Ottawa or Montreal landing fees. CFS and phone call. I’m not saying that they will let you to do so, but rather that they would listen to you and find a solution. They are human. That’s the good part from the school.

The better you are prepared, the better the experience will be for you. I’ve seen students that were truly committed and had zero experience before. Cornwall did allow them to move safely faster without letting other student behind. They have instructors to provide you support and occasional ground school to you, which is great. You still need to commit to open the book, do the flying chair, ask questions, study and repeat. Best advise: Target someone that has commitment regarding his flying career/hobbies, so you can build study, flying and responsible challenge (pushing each other to write the exam for instance). When I arrived as international student, they found me a local student around my age and at the same phase of training ish. We had great time, good study and memorable cross country. Experience couldn’t have been better.

Yes I did enjoy Cornwall. It was hard sometimes because I wasn’t speaking properly English and what I wanted to say could have been interpreted differently, but that’s on me and that what is like to immigrate and learn a new langage. Nevertheless they have been one the best moment I had in my life, which I would never forget.

The area is quit nice, especially around the airport and the waterfront. We are now in 2024 and I still believe that I had a training that was very cost efficient overtime. And.. I’ve meet wonderful and true friendship there. They have clients coming from everywhere and at different stages of their flying career. From the Ab initio student to the 5000h Float Beaver pilot deciding to get the MEIR or even the instrument pilot refreshing his skill with some IR PCC.

International student 1 years and half at Cornwall
Flight Instructor for 2 years at Cornwall.
Medevac King Air pilot for a year
Airline Q400 for a year
Airline 737 for a mainline in Canada.

Time went fast. Enjoy your training !
Thanks Cornwall, thanks to the Small family which has a big heart.

[flying_in_bc18]

I did my multi-IFR at cornwall, and the accommodation is far from good, BUT I was a 5 min walk from the airport and it's convenient. They booked me 2-3 lessons a day and ground sessions so that the information is still relevant and fresh. Instructors are knowledgeable, as they would be doing so many ratings, they really have it dialled in. You get to do your 100nm xc flight into Montreal or Ottawa control zones which is neat experience.

I came in with no expectations, and it was a pretty good experience, completing your MIFR in 3 weeks is a sweet perk, saves you time and money in the long run! Everyone here is lovely, no complaints about the ppl who run the school or work for it

Would recommend doing multi-IFR training here...ppl and cpl training seems a bit like a second thought however, but that's not their main focus I don't think.

[TRex0615]

Hey guys....

I wish to renew my MIFR soon...maybe at Cornwall. I haven't decided yet. But since I've been away from aviation for a while, I wanted to spend some time practicing at home on the SIM before I head there. Hopefully it will save me some time and money.
My question is: if I want to have a home set up to practice, what type of hardware/software do you guys recommend? Since it's MIFR and most schools have either a Seminole or a Seneca what would be my options? I was looking to see if I could incorporate a Garmin device commonly used for IFR training to load approaches etc. Any help from you guys would be appreciated.
I was thinking a set up with Microsoft SIM with a control column and rudder with a throttle quadrant for twins would work? Any recommendations in terms of brands? Not looking for anything fancy....but something reliable to do the job.
If this is not the thread to post this query, please let me know where I must post it. Thanks!