ATF vs. MF for UNICOM?

[linecrew]

I was under the impression that UNICOM at an uncontrolled airport was always an ATF. Does anyone know (non-anecdotally) what the criteria is for a UNICOM to be an MF?

[redlaser]

Are the MF's not listed in the CFS, canadian flight supplement,

[Red_Comet]

Pretty sure MF is distinct from the ground station in use. For example, even MFs with an FSS on site will still remain MFs when the FSS closes for the day and pilots are expected to follow the exact same procedures, except calls will be addressed to "traffic". As for UNICOMS, although the procedure is to contact UNICOM in an ATF, every one I've flown to is treated as an ATF as the UNICOM operator is often not at his desk and/or not particularly interested in acting as a traffic controller.

If I see a UNICOM frequency, I treat it as an ATF and make all my calls to "traffic" addressed to other pilots in the area. As a general rule, fellow pilots care more about not hitting another plane than anyone on the ground.

Also, I've never seen an MF with a UNICOM, but if one does exist, I would still treat it as an MF and make all my calls to "traffic" aimed at other pilots. A UNICOM operator is not trained by NAVCANADA and it would be foolish to expect them to direct traffic for pilots who are capable of it themselves.

EDIT: Looks like I may have been wrong about MFs staying MFs when the tower/FSS closes, all my local examples become ATFs. Time to brush up on my ground school...

[khedrei]

Not all MFs stay MF when the FSS closes. CYSN is an example.

Don't overthink it. UNICOM is just a person behind a desk that you can call for weather, traffic or parking information. They are NOT traffic coordinators and should never be treated as such. Some are just the girl behind the desk at the FBO.

Approach charts do specify some UNICOMs as approach unicoms (AU) who can be relied on to give you AWOS that you can rely on to shoot an IFR approach. If they don't have that specification, you need to obtain your info from the source before shooting the approach to landing.

CYPQ is an example of a unicom in a MF airport. Previous poster explained pretty good. But to summarize:

Unicom = person (maybe) behind a desk. Can be at any airport.
MF = rules for communication at the airport
ATF = rules for communication at the airport. Less restrictive than MF.

Clear as mud?

[rookiepilot]

Not all MFs stay MF when the FSS closes. CYSN is an example.

Don't overthink it. UNICOM is just a person behind a desk that you can call for weather, traffic or parking information. They are NOT traffic coordinators and should never be treated as such. Some are just the girl behind the desk at the FBO.

Approach charts do specify some UNICOMs as approach unicoms (AU) who can be relied on to give you AWOS that you can rely on to shoot an IFR approach. If they don't have that specification, you need to obtain your info from the source before shooting the approach to landing.

CYPQ is an example of a unicom in a MF airport. Previous poster explained pretty good. But to summarize:

Unicom = person (maybe) behind a desk. Can be at any airport.
MF = rules for communication at the airport
ATF = rules for communication at the airport. Less restrictive than MF.

Clear as mud?

Unicom doesn’t mean someone answers the call when looking for winds and weather. Maybe nobody there.

Sometimes if your lucky, the fuel guy will answer and say how cloudy it looks.

[khedrei]

Not all MFs stay MF when the FSS closes. CYSN is an example.

Don't overthink it. UNICOM is just a person behind a desk that you can call for weather, traffic or parking information. They are NOT traffic coordinators and should never be treated as such. Some are just the girl behind the desk at the FBO.

Approach charts do specify some UNICOMs as approach unicoms (AU) who can be relied on to give you AWOS that you can rely on to shoot an IFR approach. If they don't have that specification, you need to obtain your info from the source before shooting the approach to landing.

CYPQ is an example of a unicom in a MF airport. Previous poster explained pretty good. But to summarize:

Unicom = person (maybe) behind a desk. Can be at any airport.
MF = rules for communication at the airport
ATF = rules for communication at the airport. Less restrictive than MF.

Clear as mud?

Unicom doesn’t mean someone answers the call when looking for winds and weather. Maybe nobody there.

Sometimes if your lucky, the fuel guy will answer and say how cloudy it looks.

Absolutely. I didn't mean to imply that they would. That's why I put (maybe). If the unicom is a AU and IF they answer, the info can be relied on to do the approach. If it's not a AU you're technically on your own. If no one answers, you're on your own anyway. ATF and MF are the rules of the airport. UNICOM is a person who might answer for you to order fuel or maybe get other info.

[BTD]

Just to add. ATF may have Nordo aircraft in the vicinity. Technically an MF should not.

[linecrew]

Are the MF's not listed in the CFS, canadian flight supplement,

Yes, but that wasn't my question. When i saw a bunch of MF's at airports with UNICOM in the CFS that's when I started wondering why they weren't ATFs.

[khedrei]

Are the MF's not listed in the CFS, canadian flight supplement,

Yes, but that wasn't my question. When i saw a bunch of MF's at airports with UNICOM in the CFS that's when I started wondering why they weren't ATFs.

I think the response you're looking for is "thank you".

[pelmet]

As an interesting note, there are "unicom's" at busy US airports as well(but more for FBO communication). JFK has a unicom frequency.

It appears that pilots of all levels can get things mixed up. The Southwest jet that recently took off from Bangor on a runway that was notamed as closed was broadcasting on the Bangor Unicom frequency instead of the proper frequency at the airport, which was uncontrolled at that time because the tower had not opened yet. I would suspect that he has a small airport background.

[linecrew]

Are the MF's not listed in the CFS, canadian flight supplement,

Yes, but that wasn't my question. When i saw a bunch of MF's at airports with UNICOM in the CFS that's when I started wondering why they weren't ATFs.

I think the response you're looking for is "thank you".

Well no actually. The point is that I found a bunch of instances of MFs tied to UNICOM in the CFS (the only place you can find that intel) and was wondering what the criteria was. The CFS provides no information correlating MFs or ATFs to a UNICOM and that was why I created this post. I apologize that this wasn't clear.

[pelmet]

Yes, but that wasn't my question. When i saw a bunch of MF's at airports with UNICOM in the CFS that's when I started wondering why they weren't ATFs.

I think the response you're looking for is "thank you".

Well no actually. The point is that I found a bunch of instances of MFs tied to UNICOM in the CFS (the only place you can find that intel) and was wondering what the criteria was. The CFS provides no information correlating MFs or ATFs to a UNICOM and that was why I created this post. I apologize that this wasn't clear.

Most airports in the Arctic are MF. They are neither unicom or ATF, they are a CARS. Therefore, an MF can be associated with a Unicom, FSS, or CARS ground station or nothing at all. It can also be associated(but not necessarily matching in size) with a class D control zone(such as CYAM).

[khedrei]

Yes, but that wasn't my question. When i saw a bunch of MF's at airports with UNICOM in the CFS that's when I started wondering why they weren't ATFs.

I think the response you're looking for is "thank you".

Well no actually. The point is that I found a bunch of instances of MFs tied to UNICOM in the CFS (the only place you can find that intel) and was wondering what the criteria was. The CFS provides no information correlating MFs or ATFs to a UNICOM and that was why I created this post. I apologize that this wasn't clear.

I'm pretty sure in my responses as well as others it has been clarified that Unicom has nothing to do with ATF, MF etc. It is just someone you can talk to who may or may not answer and may or may not give you useful info.
They can be at any airport or no airports. If your question still has not been answered I think you'll have to ask it in another way.

I wouldnt be surprised if the term unicom is explained either in the AIM or CFS somewhere. I don't have pge numbers off hand but either COM section of AIM or general section of CFS.

[CaptDukeNukem]

Who’s flying NORDO still? Make the required broadcasts and go land.