Midair at DCA

[encoread]

I have experienced the white screen issue as well. In my case, it was caused by a conflicting mod that affected the G3000 displays. Removing that mod fixed the problem and the screens returned to normal.white screenI suggest checking any recent mods you’ve installed, especially those related to the G3000 or flight dynamics, and disabling them one by one to identify the cause.

[atc_is_god]

Nothing wrong with ATC‘s actions and execution here, from one who knows.

Routing en route aircraft at glideslope height within the last mile of approach to a runway is an insane airspace structure approach though.

What's the minimum required distance if an aircraft says they'll maintain visual separation? And if there is such a minimum distance and it's getting busted, is ATC not supposed to intervene in class B airspace?

There are no required minimums -- it means don't trade paint.

[itsgrosswhatinet]

The NTSB is now reporting the helicopter pilot was flying 80-100 feet above their maximum altitude of 200 feet.

https://globalnews.ca/news/11311447/dc- ... -altitude/

[CpnCrunch]

The NTSB is now reporting the helicopter pilot was flying 80-100 feet above their maximum altitude of 200 feet.

https://globalnews.ca/news/11311447/dc- ... -altitude/

To clarify: it sounds like they were flying at the correct altitude as per their altimeter, but the altimeter was 80-100ft out due to errors in the altimeter and/or the altimeter setting was wrong.

[A346Dude]

The helicopter being above above max altitude is such a red herring.

If the difference between 200 and 300 feet is death, it was never a viable helicopter route.

[jpilot77]

And they didn’t take evasive action when told to by ATC

[Daniel Cooper]

The helicopter being above above max altitude is such a red herring.

If the difference between 200 and 300 feet is death, it was never a viable helicopter route.

It's not a cruising altitude of 200'. It's a hard cap altitude.

[CpnCrunch]

The helicopter being above above max altitude is such a red herring.

If the difference between 200 and 300 feet is death, it was never a viable helicopter route.

It's not a cruising altitude of 200'. It's a hard cap altitude.

Also they did quite a few things wrong, like going past the turnign point, not seeing the traffic, transponder turned off, etc. If they had just been 100ft high, they wouldn't have had this accident.

[digits_]

The helicopter being above above max altitude is such a red herring.

If the difference between 200 and 300 feet is death, it was never a viable helicopter route.

THIS!!

[A346Dude]

The helicopter being above above max altitude is such a red herring.

If the difference between 200 and 300 feet is death, it was never a viable helicopter route.

It's not a cruising altitude of 200'. It's a hard cap altitude.

I get that, but 100 feet is not separation. There needs to be a buffer, like there is everywhere else in the system. Altimeters have errors, pilots make errors, and 100 feet is not a very big one. Normal IFR-VFR separation is 500 feet, or 1,000 feet if it's a medium overflying a light. Even cruising altitudes give you 500 feet of separation from other traffic, so two pilots or their aircraft can be off by 200 feet each and you still won't hit. And that's in random airspace where you're less likely to meet someone than short final at DCA. Furthermore, a visual approach has no lower limit, so the RJ could have been even lower.

If there's no altitude separation other than "maybe" 100 feet, you might as well not have a hard cap because it can give a false sense of security that if you're at 200 feet, you're safe. But in reality that cap can put you 50-100 feet below an airliner that's almost in the flare, and that's ignoring wake turbulence concerns. The real separation here was supposed to be visual, not merely staying within the confines of a route that provides no built in separation. The helicopter is supposed to see the aircraft and pass behind; unfortunately it seems like they saw the wrong airplane.

[Daniel Cooper]

I would never feel "safe" being at a hard cap altitude.

[Dry Guy]

Capt. Lobach had difficulty keeping to the correct route and altitude.

The instructor repeatedly told her to keep to 200 feet, noticing that her altitude was higher than it should be. She agreed, but N.T.S.B. materials show that she was flying higher than that — sometimes by 100 or more feet — throughout the helicopter’s final leg. The crash occurred at roughly 300 feet above the river.

[Jean-Pierre]

I wonder if the pilot being an officer while the instructor was an enlisted played a part. The CVR is brutal to read. He keeps trying to correct her gently while calling her Ma-am. It wasn't just altitude bust too but also wrong turn. Her response are lackadaisical. Finally she say "Oh-kay fine." (drawn out okay), then bam, 67 people dead.

[5x5]

Here’s a proposed change that is being recommended to require ADS-B In along with the existing ADS-B Out.

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all ... dium=email

[digits_]

Here’s a proposed change that is being recommended to require ADS-B In along with the existing ADS-B Out.

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all ... dium=email

Ah FFS. Extra equipment and costs that won't help prevent accidents like these. Great! Perfect excuse to cram more traffic into that same area?

[goingnowherefast]

Here’s a proposed change that is being recommended to require ADS-B In along with the existing ADS-B Out.

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all ... dium=email

Ah FFS. Extra equipment and costs that won't help prevent accidents like these. Great! Perfect excuse to cram more traffic into that same area?

That's kinda the point of ADS-B. Better position accuracy means they can put planes closer together.

The issue is a corridor with 100ft separation, and altimeters that have an accuracy tolerance of +/-100ft.

It's kinda like going to the gun range, standing beside the target and being surprised when one gets shot. Sure the shooter missed the bullseye, but standing beside the target isn't an adequate safety margin.

[digits_]

The issue is a corridor with 100ft separation, and altimeters that have an accuracy tolerance of +/-100ft.

No, the issue is a corridor with 100ft separation, period.
Doesn't matter much how accurate your ADSB in or out is. You still have to fly it as well.

[goingnowherefast]

ADS-B allows for less lateral separation. 100ft vertical separation is completely ridiculous no matter how one looks at it.

[A346Dude]

I would never feel "safe" being at a hard cap altitude.

OK what are you going to do then, fly at 100 feet over the river? Would that make you feel safer?

It's a rock and a hard place, which is why this wasn't a viable helicopter route. If you still have to see and avoid, why complicate everything with a very low altitude cap?

The normal point of a route is to provide separation, with a buffer: a no man's land where no aircraft should be, but if one strays into it for whatever reason the result isn't catastrophic. This one had no buffer at all.