Run ups at CYQB

[digits_]

Hi all,

Recently I visited CYQB in a piston aircraft. As I was preparing for a run up at the line up point for runway 29, tower/ground asked me "C-XXXX, you're not planning on doing a runup there, are you?", in a tone of voice that made it clear I should not ask too many questions. So I didn't.

This made me wonder if I missed anything. I looked into every piece of documentation regarding CYQB on foreflight, and I could not find any information regarding run ups at CYQB.

Did I miss anything?

As background info:
- there was no traffic around me at all
- there was no rush to depart, I still had to wait 4 minutes for other aircraft to land/depart ahead of me
- I was very close to the treshold, so noise shouldn't have been an issue either (?)

Any thoughts?

[CaptDukeNukem]

How did he know you were planning to do a run up? Did he issue you a take off clearance prior to them asking? Anyone behind you? There’s a lot of questions at play here. Maybe a run up would have been better suited at your original start up point? Not saying you were wrong.

As pilots, we only have the small picture.

[digits_]

How did he know you were planning to do a run up? Did he issue you a take off clearance prior to them asking? Anyone behind you? There’s a lot of questions at play here. Maybe a run up would have been better suited at your original start up point? Not saying you were wrong.

As pilots, we only have the small picture.

I was turning into the wind and was increasing engine rpm.
No takeoff clearance issued, no traffic around, nobody behind me.

Better suited somewhere else? Perhaps, but how would I know that if it isn't written anywhere?

[dustyroads]

Hi all,

Recently I visited CYQB in a piston aircraft. As I was preparing for a run up at the line up point for runway 29, tower/ground asked me "C-XXXX, you're not planning on doing a runup there, are you?", in a tone of voice that made it clear I should not ask too many questions. So I didn't.

This made me wonder if I missed anything. I looked into every piece of documentation regarding CYQB on foreflight, and I could not find any information regarding run ups at CYQB.

Did I miss anything?

As background info:
- there was no traffic around me at all
- there was no rush to depart, I still had to wait 4 minutes for other aircraft to land/depart ahead of me
- I was very close to the treshold, so noise shouldn't have been an issue either (?)

Any thoughts?

During RVOP conditions, runups will not be authorized on the maneuvering areas.

[digits_]

Hi all,

Recently I visited CYQB in a piston aircraft. As I was preparing for a run up at the line up point for runway 29, tower/ground asked me "C-XXXX, you're not planning on doing a runup there, are you?", in a tone of voice that made it clear I should not ask too many questions. So I didn't.

This made me wonder if I missed anything. I looked into every piece of documentation regarding CYQB on foreflight, and I could not find any information regarding run ups at CYQB.

Did I miss anything?

As background info:
- there was no traffic around me at all
- there was no rush to depart, I still had to wait 4 minutes for other aircraft to land/depart ahead of me
- I was very close to the treshold, so noise shouldn't have been an issue either (?)

Any thoughts?

During RVOP conditions, runups will not be authorized on the maneuvering areas.

Weather was VMC. Blue skies.

[5x5]

Curious what your plan was if you encountered an issue during your run-up?

[BGH]

Is it possible that you were going to do your run up in a noted airport hotspot?

Daryl

[I WAS Pez]

There's an area at the north end of apron III (or is that a taxiway?? diagram seems to indicate just apron III) by the FTUs and AvJet where runups are typically done there... Not sure about aircraft coming from the other side of the airport. Nothing seems to be in writing though...

[digits_]

There's an area at the north end of apron III (or is that a taxiway?? diagram seems to indicate just apron III) by the FTUs and AvJet where runups are typically done there... Not sure about aircraft coming from the other side of the airport. Nothing seems to be in writing though...

That's possible, there were some piston planes moving around there, but no signs or procedures that mention this.

[digits_]

Is it possible that you were going to do your run up in a noted airport hotspot?

Daryl

No, no marked hotspots there.

[digits_]

Curious what your plan was if you encountered an issue during your run-up?

Taxi back to the FBO?

[CpnCrunch]

Some airports that don't have dedicated run-up areas have preferred places to do run-ups which cause the least impact to operations, e.g. YYJ rw 27. (I've forgotten where the spot is, so I'd need to hunt around for the info, but I see it's not mentioned anywhere in the CFS).

Anyway, it's not a big deal. I would just have told tower yes I need a run-up, where am I supposed to do it, and taxied to that spot.

[dustyroads]

Is it possible that you were going to do your run up in a noted airport hotspot?

Daryl

No, no marked hotspots there.

Confirm you’re talking about Quebec City CYQB? I’m thinking you’re not as you said you read nothing about runups but it’s published, runups aren’t authorized during RVOP conditions, now you’re saying no Hotspots there when in fact there are 3 Hotspots.

[digits_]

Is it possible that you were going to do your run up in a noted airport hotspot?

Daryl

No, no marked hotspots there.

Confirm you’re talking about Quebec City CYQB? I’m thinking you’re not as you said you read nothing about runups but it’s published, runups aren’t authorized during RVOP conditions, now you’re saying no Hotspots there when in fact there are 3 Hotspots.

Cyqb yes. Yes there are hotspots but to my knowledge I was not near a hotspot.
Weather was cavok. Rvop was not in effect. Most traffic was using 24. I was waiting for takeoff on 29.

[dustyroads]

No, no marked hotspots there.

Confirm you’re talking about Quebec City CYQB? I’m thinking you’re not as you said you read nothing about runups but it’s published, runups aren’t authorized during RVOP conditions, now you’re saying no Hotspots there when in fact there are 3 Hotspots.

Cyqb yes. Yes there are hotspots but to my knowledge I was not near a hotspot.
Weather was cavok. Rvop was not in effect. Most traffic was using 24. I was waiting for takeoff on 29.

Correct the hotspots are nowhere near threshold 29.

Maybe next time don’t make it obvious you’re doing one by turning into the wind towards the grass when the taxiways aren’t wide. They don’t want you to have a mishap and end up in the grass

[digits_]

Confirm you’re talking about Quebec City CYQB? I’m thinking you’re not as you said you read nothing about runups but it’s published, runups aren’t authorized during RVOP conditions, now you’re saying no Hotspots there when in fact there are 3 Hotspots.

Cyqb yes. Yes there are hotspots but to my knowledge I was not near a hotspot.
Weather was cavok. Rvop was not in effect. Most traffic was using 24. I was waiting for takeoff on 29.

Correct the hotspots are nowhere near threshold 29.

Maybe next time don’t make it obvious you’re doing one by turning into the wind towards the grass when the taxiways aren’t wide. They don’t want you to have a mishap and end up in the grass

It was a 30 degree turn, well clear of any grass. "Don't make it obvious" sounds as if I was doing something I wasn't supposed to do. A run up in a piston aircraft just before departure should not be considered odd IMO.

[‘Bob’]

Curious what your plan was if you encountered an issue during your run-up?

What’s your plan if you reject a takeoff?

Seriously.. what kind of dumb question is this?

[SE7EN]

There’s a hotspot on B off R29, but hot spots are just areas where a risk of collision exists & demand heightened awareness & mitigation strategies. They don’t explicitly prohibit run-ups, thought it wouldn’t be a good idea if the airport was busy. Either way, sounds like you were on C.

Sounds like ATC was stretching their assertiveness legs, might be a good time to stretch yours..

[digits_]

There’s a hotspot on B off R29, but hot spots are just areas where a risk of collision exists & demand heightened awareness & mitigation strategies. They don’t explicitly prohibit run-ups, thought it wouldn’t be a good idea if the airport was busy. Either way, sounds like you were on C.

Just looked it up and yes I was holding at C.

Sounds like ATC was stretching their assertiveness legs, might be a good time to stretch yours..

Now that I know I didn't miss anything, absolutely! I feel like just flying there and taxi to do a run up at the holding point

[DanWEC]

Digits, dustyroads is troll account, don't give it any regard.

[Flight94]

Phone the tower and ask, then report back. I'm curious.

[A346Dude]

I don't have an answer for you, but if it was me I would just say "yes I need to do a run up... where should I do it?" and punt the issue back to Ground. If a controller gets mad at you for needing a runup, but there is no guidance on this matter in the CFS, ATIS, or when receiving taxi instructions, that's not on you.

As a controller I expect pistons may need to do a runup before departure, and if that's a problem due to taxiway width I'll ask them. If they do and that might cause them to block other traffic, I'll specify where they can do it.

That being said, if you're departing from a large ramp with lots of open space you can just do it there and avoid the whole issue.

[TeePeeCreeper]

Digits,

YQB is a strange strange place. I flew out of there for a couple of years. Not that long ago really.

What really pissed me off was canceling the IFR and still being expected to fly the STAR even though they weren’t sequencing any other traffic! No rhyme or reason what so ever.

A new friend of mine that I met golfing turned out to be a recently retired as a tower supervisor. While playing a round of virtual golf at his place one winter I asked him… why the STAR all the f’ing time.

“They are being lazy”.

I suspect that this kind of attitude may have contributed your ops. Sounds like you were dealing with the shortest controller on the YQB roaster.

Take care,

TPC

[digits_]

Digits,

YQB is a strange strange place. I flew out of there for a couple of years. Not that long ago really.

What really pissed me off was canceling the IFR and still being expected to fly the STAR even though they weren’t sequencing any other traffic! No rhyme or reason what so ever.

A new friend of mine that I met golfing turned out to be a recently retired as a tower supervisor. While playing a round of virtual golf at his place one winter I asked him… why the STAR all the f’ing time.

“They are being lazy”.

I suspect that this kind of attitude may have contributed your ops. Sounds like you were dealing with the shortest controller on the YQB roaster.

Take care,

TPC

Thank you for this background info! Do you know how a run up would increase a controller's workload or why it would piss them off?

[cdnavater]

There’s a hotspot on B off R29, but hot spots are just areas where a risk of collision exists & demand heightened awareness & mitigation strategies. They don’t explicitly prohibit run-ups, thought it wouldn’t be a good idea if the airport was busy. Either way, sounds like you were on C.

Just looked it up and yes I was holding at C.

Sounds like ATC was stretching their assertiveness legs, might be a good time to stretch yours..

Now that I know I didn't miss anything, absolutely! I feel like just flying there and taxi to do a run up at the holding point

For reference, the RJ and other jet aircraft need to do a post de-icing run up, we ask ground every time where they would like us to do that.
If I were flying at a controlled airport in a piston, 100% I would ask where they want me to do that, just because it doesn’t specify something doesn’t mean you have carte blanche to do whatever you want.
If I were flying at an uncontrolled airport, I would advertise that I was about to run up, you may see that no one is around when you start the run up but you will be somewhat distracted and ground needs to know to not taxi anyone behind you.
Further to the point, you could have been at an area that has noise restrictions and lastly, it says in the CFS during RVOP engine run ups and towing will not be “authorized”, let’s focus in on that word for a second, auhthorized; having official permission or approval.
This seems to me a no brainer, you need permission to do a run up, not sure why you thought you didn’t!