Emirates after AC

[Bede]

⸻

It amazes me that people still take the CPI or the “2% inflation” narrative seriously. The only metric that really matters is purchasing power — what your income can actually buy you.

Isn't purchasing power tied to the CPI, or are you referring to another metric?

BTW excellent comments Red Comet, ****.

[thepoors]

Alright, I’m calling it here before this turns into another political circus starring our usual trio of RedComet, D¡as, and thepoors — the holy trinity of derailment. Every time there’s a halfway decent discussion, they show up like clockwork to turn it into a soapbox audition.

You’re in AC, you already know the conditions, and I’ve done my part giving the most accurate info I can about EK. The rest is up to you.

I’ll leave the stage to the performers, may their next act involve a little self-awareness.

I'm on your side dude. Who exactly is derailing? You're providing unbiased info on Emirates, and the I would NEVER live in Dubai crowd is trying to defend our "world class contract" while being completely tone deaf to Canadian living standards for the majority of people. With some hypocritical moral superiority sprinkled in.

[flying4dollars]

I’m sure the guy pulling in $200k - $350k a year can definitely afford to call up an accountant or lawyer to get everything sorted. It’s not exactly uncharted territory — thousands have done it before, plenty are doing it right now, and thousands more will keep doing it.

I don't want to turn this into a dick measuring contest, but is $350k (CAD?) all Emirates pilots earn? That's WJ NB CA money. If so, it would seem that the sole financial advantage is the low tax structure.

WJ NB CA money would have to be in the ballpark of $700k/year to claim parity with what you make at Emirates. Yes the tax structure is different, but that doesn't change the fact that you are still banking $350K a year. Let's also not forget you won't have a mortgage or tuition for the kiddos. So $350k/year effectively becomes what, $400k+ a year? And yes, you'll work more at Emirates, but there isn't enough OT here to even come close to putting $30k in your bank account, consistently. Yeesh the things I could do with that income

Living abroad isn't for everyone as much as living here isn't for everyone either. To each their own and there isn't a clear winner or one size fits all type deal here when comparing this career in Canada vs Dubai. User dependent. Good luck either way!

[Mr. North]

To each their own.

But I take exception to the usual detractors who never miss an opportunity to lament Canadian pay rates and by extension, Canadian society itself. The reason the Middle East pays so handsomely for skilled labour is simple, few would choose to live in an oligarchic petrostate otherwise. Nearly 90% of the UAE’s “population” consists of expatriates (mostly low income) with very limited rights.

Canadian wages can and should improve, but pretending they’ll ever rival what’s on offer in the Gulf is wishful thinking, detached from reality.

And I’ll say this: there’s a certain arrogance among some expats who return after a decade or two abroad, grumbling about taxes while readily availing themselves of the comforts of Canada — especially our healthcare system as they age into infirmity. As a life long taxpayer, I suppose that makes me the sucker — and them the ones who expect the benefits without the burden.

[thepoors]

And I’ll say this: there’s a certain arrogance among some expats who return after a decade or two abroad, grumbling about taxes while readily availing themselves of the comforts of Canada — especially our healthcare system as they age into infirmity. As a life long taxpayer, I suppose that makes me the sucker — and them the ones who expect the benefits without the burden.

I don't think a handful of wealthy expats are who you need to worry about mooching off of healthcare. We have millions of immigrants and refugees bringing in their elderly under family reunification schemes that are doing a much better job of exploiting what we're paying for.

[Jean-Pierre]

I wish I could pay for healthcare instead of dying on a gurney in a hallway like the boomer are going to.

[flying4dollars]

And I’ll say this: there’s a certain arrogance among some expats who return after a decade or two abroad, grumbling about taxes while readily availing themselves of the comforts of Canada — especially our healthcare system as they age into infirmity. As a life long taxpayer, I suppose that makes me the sucker — and them the ones who expect the benefits without the burden.

I don't think a handful of wealthy expats are who you need to worry about mooching off of healthcare. We have millions of immigrants and refugees bringing in their elderly under family reunification schemes that are doing a much better job of exploiting what we're paying for.

This

[MorePlates]

To each their own.

But I take exception to the usual detractors who never miss an opportunity to lament Canadian pay rates and by extension, Canadian society itself. The reason the Middle East pays so handsomely for skilled labour is simple, few would choose to live in an oligarchic petrostate otherwise. Nearly 90% of the UAE’s “population” consists of expatriates (mostly low income) with very limited rights.

Canadian wages can and should improve, but pretending they’ll ever rival what’s on offer in the Gulf is wishful thinking, detached from reality.

And I’ll say this: there’s a certain arrogance among some expats who return after a decade or two abroad, grumbling about taxes while readily availing themselves of the comforts of Canada — especially our healthcare system as they age into infirmity. As a life long taxpayer, I suppose that makes me the sucker — and them the ones who expect the benefits without the burden.

No no no, say it all you want, Mr. North, it’s still nonsense. Pilots (and other skilled workers) in the UAE get paid better because they’ve got something our pilots here seem to have lost. It’s called self-respect.

[Bede]

No no no, say it all you want, Mr. North, it’s still nonsense. Pilots (and other skilled workers) in the UAE get paid better because they’ve got something our pilots here seem to have lost. It’s called self-respect.

No they don't get paid better- they operate in a jurisdiction with a lower tax structure. Even after the housing allowance, schooling, bonuses, etc., I'd be willing to bet that the cost per block hour that Emirates pays their pilots is less than the cost/block hour that a Canadian, let alone an American, carrier pays their WB captains.

[MorePlates]

No they don't get paid better- they operate in a jurisdiction with a lower tax structure. Even after the housing allowance, schooling, bonuses, etc., I'd be willing to bet that the cost per block hour that Emirates pays their pilots is less than the cost/block hour that a Canadian, let alone an American, carrier pays their WB captains.

They pay that number because they know it all goes straight into your pocket. If there were 10, 20, 30% income taxes, that number would shoot way up but sure, keep telling yourself otherwise. Like I told Mr. North, same goes for you: maybe if you repeat it enough times, it’ll start sounding true.

Honestly, having these chats here beats just shrugging and accepting that most pilots around here don’t value themselves. Might actually help us next time there’s a contract on the table.

And hey, instead of dodging it, how about replying to what I said earlier about your “no middle class in Dubai” theory? That one’s gold.

Like I said before, you’re speaking out of bias, maybe because it took you a few decades to get that little airplane, while EK pilots do it in a fraction of the time? But hey, whatever floats your plane.

[Bede]

Dude you're a flight instructor who's spent some time on the internet.

You're closer to being a student than an airline pilot.

[The Brantford Boomer]

A lot of people complaining would be a lot further ahead if they rejected consumerism and instead extrapolated the lost investment earnings on every $10 starbucks trip

AND CANCELLED THEIR DISNEY PLUS ON THE BOOB TUBE

Dude you're a flight instructor who's spent some time on the internet.

You're closer to being a student than an airline pilot.

JUST ANOTHER ENTITLED RENTER

[daedalusx]

A lot of people complaining would be a lot further ahead if they rejected consumerism and instead extrapolated the lost investment earnings on every $10 starbucks trip

AND CANCELLED THEIR DISNEY PLUS ON THE BOOB TUBE


JUST ANOTHER ENTITLED RENTER

YOU'RE OKAY BOOMER.

ON THE DAY OF THE PILLOW, YOU'LL BE SPARED

[Mr. North]

Pilots (and other skilled workers) in the UAE get paid better because they’ve got something our pilots here seem to have lost. It’s called self-respect.

Let’s be clear, it’s not “self-respect” that drives higher pay in the UAE - it’s compensation for instability.

Pilots there are paid more because the system has to make up for everything else that’s missing. No citizenship, no job security, no pension, and the constant risk of termination and deportation. It’s hazard pay for a transient life, not a badge of professional pride. You may draw a handsome salary, but in the eyes of local Emiratis, you are no different than the man digging a ditch on the side of the road — scum masquerading in a white shirt and tie.

Canadian pilots, for all our frustrations, work in a society of equals, under enforceable contracts, with due process, benefits, and democratic oversight. If anything, our self-respect shows in our insistence on rights — not just pay.

You sold yourself out to fly the big iron for cash. No shame in that — but don’t lecture me on self-respect.

[Dry Guy]

There's no shortage of flying jobs with all of that but without the millions $$.

[MorePlates]

Let’s be clear, it’s not “self-respect” that drives higher pay in the UAE - it’s compensation for instability.

Pilots there are paid more because the system has to make up for everything else that’s missing. No citizenship, no job security, no pension, and the constant risk of termination and deportation. It’s hazard pay for a transient life, not a badge of professional pride. You may draw a handsome salary, but in the eyes of local Emiratis, you are no different than the man digging a ditch on the side of the road — scum masquerading in a white shirt and tie.

Canadian pilots, for all our frustrations, work in a society of equals, under enforceable contracts, with due process, benefits, and democratic oversight. If anything, our self-respect shows in our insistence on rights — not just pay.

You sold yourself out to fly the big iron for cash. No shame in that — but don’t lecture me on self-respect.

Oh here we go again, the “Canada = rights, UAE = sellouts” sermon.

Self respecting professionals don’t have to stand outside with signs, hoping they’ll get enough to cover housing, I’m talking teachers, pilots, flight attendants, postal workers… and that’s just the start.

[MorePlates]

Dude you're a flight instructor who's spent some time on the internet.

You're closer to being a student than an airline pilot.

Oh, I see.

So because you’ve spent more time in the air, that magically makes whatever you say the truth? That’s cute.

Experience doesn’t automatically erase bias, and apparently it doesn’t automatically make you right either. Just because you’ve logged more hours doesn’t mean the rest of us can’t call out nonsense when we see it.

[Tanker299]

⸻

It amazes me that people still take the CPI or the “2% inflation” narrative seriously. The only metric that really matters is purchasing power — what your income can actually buy you.

Isn't purchasing power tied to the CPI, or are you referring to another metric?

BTW excellent comments Red Comet, ****.

Let’s use a simple, everyday example.

Back in 2016, a Two-Can-Dine meal at Rotten Ronnie’s was $10.99. Nine years later, even if you apply a steady 2.5 % CPI increase per year, the price should be around $13.70.

But the real price today is $18.79 — that’s a 6.1 % annual increase, not 2.5 %.
That’s more than 70 % higher than the “official” inflation rate would suggest.

Housing tells the same story. My one house that my grandfather built in the 50s has appreciated at 7.85 % per year. Another property I sold just after the pandemic returned 9.8 % annually over eight years.

Meanwhile, the CPI keeps insisting inflation is “under control.” It’s not. Real-world prices — for food, housing, and almost everything people actually need — have been rising far faster than the official numbers admit.

[Dry Guy]

They cook the books here so their inflation numbers stay low. They are now planning to pre-exclude mortgage interest costs and say things like there is “potentially some distortion” that could be “exaggerating” inflation or “there is some unusual volatility". That's Bank of Canada Governor Macklem that I'm quoting.

[Bede]

⸻

It amazes me that people still take the CPI or the “2% inflation” narrative seriously. The only metric that really matters is purchasing power — what your income can actually buy you.

Isn't purchasing power tied to the CPI, or are you referring to another metric?

BTW excellent comments Red Comet, ****.

Let’s use a simple, everyday example.

Back in 2016, a Two-Can-Dine meal at Rotten Ronnie’s was $10.99. Nine years later, even if you apply a steady 2.5 % CPI increase per year, the price should be around $13.70.

But the real price today is $18.79 — that’s a 6.1 % annual increase, not 2.5 %.
That’s more than 70 % higher than the “official” inflation rate would suggest.

Housing tells the same story. My one house that my grandfather built in the 50s has appreciated at 7.85 % per year. Another property I sold just after the pandemic returned 9.8 % annually over eight years.

Meanwhile, the CPI keeps insisting inflation is “under control.” It’s not. Real-world prices — for food, housing, and almost everything people actually need — have been rising far faster than the official numbers admit.

Yeah, I get it. I have this conversation often. There's not really any published metric that supports the argument, but it seems that nearly everyone, including me feels the effects. The best explanation that I can come up with is that the basket of goods that StatsCan uses for the CPI calculation is not reflective of how a large number of Canadians allocate their resources. For example, I pay nothing for housing. A 25 year old has to pay 70% of their income to housing. The result: StatsCan allocates 35% of the basket to housing. This underweights the effect of rising housing prices for a young person and overweights it for a person who has their house paid off. Same goes for food, transportation, etc. The percentage that older, richer Canadian spend on these items is a far lower percentage of total income than younger Canadians pay distorting the CPI for different demographics.

[The Brantford Boomer]

I pay nothing for housing.

I CAN DO YOU ONE BETTER BUB MY HOUSE PAYS ME WITH A CHIP REVERSE MORTGAGE YOU CAN ACCESS THE VALUE OF YOUR HOME IN TAX FREE CASH WITHOUT HAVING TO SELL IT CALL NOW FOR YOUR FREE NO OBLIGATION GUIDE 55+ ONLY REMEMBER YOU CANT SPEND IT WHEN YOURE GONE

[daedalusx]

I pay nothing for housing.

I CAN DO YOU ONE BETTER BUB MY HOUSE PAYS ME WITH A CHIP REVERSE MORTGAGE YOU CAN ACCESS THE VALUE OF YOUR HOME IN TAX FREE CASH WITHOUT HAVING TO SELL IT CALL NOW FOR YOUR FREE NO OBLIGATION GUIDE 55+ ONLY REMEMBER YOU CANT SPEND IT WHEN YOURE GONE

It works for Tom Selleck

[Tanker299]

..

[bcflyer]

Yes, that's what I meant. Your $350k CAD salary is meaningless today because its buying power is less than the median Canadian income in the 90s.

Where exactly do you get those numbers from? The salary’s in the 90’s were not good in Canada. Recession hurt wages a lot. I can’t see any data that points to needing $350,000 to have the buying power of the median salary in the 90’s.

[Dry Guy]

Do you really need the data? A median salary in the 90s would afford you a detached house and a couple cars in the driveway. Now you'd need at least $350k/year to afford that.