Rejected after references checked, background checked and psych evaluation.

[altiplano]

The psych eval picks out people that misrepresent themselves. The secret is to tell the truth, not what you think you should say, or what you think they want to hear, or what makes you look good/bad. Read the questions carefully and be honest even if you think it makes you look bad. You're not smart enough to outsmart it.

[Jon_Doe]

The psych eval picks out people that misrepresent themselves. The secret is to tell the truth, not what you think you should say, or what you think they want to hear, or what makes you look good/bad. Read the questions carefully and be honest even if you think it makes you look bad. You're not smart enough to outsmart it.

That’s exactly what I did…Maybe that other guy is right and I just fell out the bottom.


Oh well, i’ll give it another shot in 6 months.

[Oxi]

don't worry even pilot d melo got hired eventually!

[rooster]

Title is pretty self explanatory, I im sitting here blindsided as @#$! after getting the pfo even tho my references were called, i did the background check and the psych evaluation.

My references obviously gave me good one, I have nothing on any background check, which only leaves somehow failing the psych evaluation?

Anyone have insight on getting the no this deep into the process? The rejection email said I was eligible to reapply in 6 months. Just really bummed out and shocked right now.

I'm going to play devil's advocate and it's not going to be a popular opinion. At what point do you or anyone else believe that just because references are called, you are ever entitled to a job offer? Any company can hire or reject you for any reason they see fit. It could even be your eyebrows for all you know. I get the frustration but never let it turn to entitlement.

I learned that lesson after 2 rejections in aviation after thinking I was a shoe in based on many factors. Anyways, the good news is that the 'rejection' includes an invitation to reapply in 6 months. That's better than "we wish you the best in your endeavours" email with no invitation. Take the temporary L and reapply in 6. Many have gotten this and been successful 6 months later. Be that statistic. Good luck!

[Jon_Doe]

Title is pretty self explanatory, I im sitting here blindsided as @#$! after getting the pfo even tho my references were called, i did the background check and the psych evaluation.

My references obviously gave me good one, I have nothing on any background check, which only leaves somehow failing the psych evaluation?

Anyone have insight on getting the no this deep into the process? The rejection email said I was eligible to reapply in 6 months. Just really bummed out and shocked right now.

I'm going to play devil's advocate and it's not going to be a popular opinion. At what point do you or anyone else believe that just because references are called, you are ever entitled to a job offer? Any company can hire or reject you for any reason they see fit. It could even be your eyebrows for all you know. I get the frustration but never let it turn to entitlement.

I learned that lesson after 2 rejections in aviation after thinking I was a shoe in based on many factors. Anyways, the good news is that the 'rejection' includes an invitation to reapply in 6 months. That's better than "we wish you the best in your endeavours" email with no invitation. Take the temporary L and reapply in 6. Many have gotten this and been successful 6 months later. Be that statistic. Good luck!

Appreciate the insight, but I never felt entitled to the job. I just genuinely thought they didnt bother with background checks or references unless they 100% planned on hiring you.

Lesson learned.

[co-joe]

Next time definitely answer yes that you've always wanted to be a florist.

[digits_]

I'm going to play devil's advocate and it's not going to be a popular opinion. At what point do you or anyone else believe that just because references are called, you are ever entitled to a job offer? Any company can hire or reject you for any reason they see fit. It could even be your eyebrows for all you know. I get the frustration but never let it turn to entitlement.

What on earth does this have to do with entitlement

I've been a reference for some pilots as well. If the prospective airline calls me, I most certainly hope they respect my time enough to only enquire about pilots they actually plan on hiring. If they don't like my answers and decide not to hire them because of that: fair. But spend 20 minutes talking to me and then decide that you won't hire them because you don't like the university where they got their degree for example is just a waste of time for everyone involved.

So no, people don't think they are entitled to a job when their references are called, but there's certainly an expectation that once you make it to that point, the decision pretty much hinges on said check.

I'm not entitled to a green light after waiting at a red light, but I'm cetainly expecting the light to change at some point.

[flying4dollars]

Title is pretty self explanatory, I im sitting here blindsided as @#$! after getting the pfo even tho my references were called, i did the background check and the psych evaluation.

My references obviously gave me good one, I have nothing on any background check, which only leaves somehow failing the psych evaluation?

Anyone have insight on getting the no this deep into the process? The rejection email said I was eligible to reapply in 6 months. Just really bummed out and shocked right now.

I'm going to play devil's advocate and it's not going to be a popular opinion. At what point do you or anyone else believe that just because references are called, you are ever entitled to a job offer? Any company can hire or reject you for any reason they see fit. It could even be your eyebrows for all you know. I get the frustration but never let it turn to entitlement.

I learned that lesson after 2 rejections in aviation after thinking I was a shoe in based on many factors. Anyways, the good news is that the 'rejection' includes an invitation to reapply in 6 months. That's better than "we wish you the best in your endeavours" email with no invitation. Take the temporary L and reapply in 6. Many have gotten this and been successful 6 months later. Be that statistic. Good luck!

Sure, companies can hire who they like but as already mentioned, what would the point of calling references be if the interview itself wasn't satisfactory to the interviewers. Also, nobody will list references that won't be helpful to them. So yeah if references are getting called, then there should be an expectation that your interview went well and you reasonably expect to make it to the next step.

The only way I can see otherwise, is if something was alerted to the company that caused concern about the individual in question, or another scenario I can't right now think of.

[Eric Janson]

No hiring procedure is 100% effective. It's a snapshot at best.

Good people don't make it through and idiots get hired. Seen it over and over again.

I've dodged a couple of bullets over the years by not getting hired - it can take a few years sometimes to realise that they did you a favour!

[bobcaygeon]

Don't worry about it and try again. The pool continues to fill and you likely did get pushed out. Others can say there were lower time new hires in recent PIT's but nepotism can always be a factor as well for them. There's endless photos of Dad/Mom flying with a kid out there and while they will meet the minimum requirements and they may get the nod over others unless their mom/dad is an d#$k and it may hurt them.

[Daniel Cooper]

I don't believe direct nepotism exists anymore but the advantage of inside information from their parent allows them to do well with the hiring process. You don't need a parent for that though. Having a friend at AC can guide you through the process just as well. I feel having an internal reference and knowing what to expect in the interview is a big reason I got the job.

[jpilot77]

Bottom line like others have posted, hiring has slowed compared to a couple years ago. Back then bare minimums and a good interview would get you hired. Now that the company has more experienced pilots to choose from your file will be closer to the bottom of the pile. The good news is you got the reapply and not the good luck in your career email. Get your times up and get ready for your next interview. I know a ton of guys who got hired after their second interview. It only comes in to play at the hiring board but do you have an internal reference?

[MrAviator19]

Title is pretty self explanatory, I im sitting here blindsided as @#$! after getting the pfo even tho my references were called, i did the background check and the psych evaluation.

My references obviously gave me good one, I have nothing on any background check, which only leaves somehow failing the psych evaluation?

Anyone have insight on getting the no this deep into the process? The rejection email said I was eligible to reapply in 6 months. Just really bummed out and shocked right now.

AC has the below information on their website. Were you able to click Yes to any of the associated specific questions they ask on the job application form?....

Air Canada actively recruits visible minorities and other underrepresented groups through inclusive hiring practices and dedicated community outreach partnerships. As a federally regulated employer subject to the Employment Equity Act, the airline is committed to building a workforce that reflects Canadian demographics.

Being able to answer Yes can make a huge difference.

Ah yes, here comes the anti-DEI warrior. I had a feeling something (someone) was missing from this thread.

The new hire bios from the PIT courses going back, well as far as I can remember, seems to suggest contrary to the "point" you were trying to make.

[pelmet]

Title is pretty self explanatory, I im sitting here blindsided as @#$! after getting the pfo even tho my references were called, i did the background check and the psych evaluation.

My references obviously gave me good one, I have nothing on any background check, which only leaves somehow failing the psych evaluation?

Anyone have insight on getting the no this deep into the process? The rejection email said I was eligible to reapply in 6 months. Just really bummed out and shocked right now.

AC has the below information on their website. Were you able to click Yes to any of the associated specific questions they ask on the job application form?....

Air Canada actively recruits visible minorities and other underrepresented groups through inclusive hiring practices and dedicated community outreach partnerships. As a federally regulated employer subject to the Employment Equity Act, the airline is committed to building a workforce that reflects Canadian demographics.

Being able to answer Yes can make a huge difference.

Ah yes, here comes the anti-DEI warrior. I had a feeling something (someone) was missing from this thread.

The new hire bios from the PIT courses going back, well as far as I can remember, seems to suggest contrary to the "point" you were trying to make.

Air Canada's own statements speak for themself.

Looking elsewhere, notice this statement....

https://readywillingable.ca/leading-wit ... ir-canada/

"“Inclusion isn’t just about having a diversity quota; it’s about well-being and creating a supportive environment for everyone.” – Hans Dupuis, Air Canada."

First time I have heard an AC rep admitting the truth....... a quota.

Sometimes, there can be a slip of the lip, in an interview that reveals the truth.

[Dry Guy]

When one team member found their work environment too noisy, Hans, provided noise-canceling headphones.

Think they'll buy noise canceling headsets for pilots?

[pelmet]

When one team member found their work environment too noisy, Hans, provided noise-canceling headphones.

Think they'll buy noise canceling headsets for pilots?

I just wore earplugs. Works well.

[Launchpad1]

Appreciate the insight, but I never felt entitled to the job. I just genuinely thought they didnt bother with background checks or references unless they 100% planned on hiring you.

Are you 100% sure that it wasn't one of your references that did you over, maybe on purpose or accidentally. If you're not sure you could try different references next time.

[ohio_19]

It happened to me too back in 2023.

They offered me to do another interview in 6 months, just the interview.

My answers to the questions were exactly the same as the first one.

I got the offer in couple weeks.

It could be the timing that did not work out for you but who knows.

Wait for your second interview and do what you can now to be more competitive.

Good luck!

[rooster]

I'm going to play devil's advocate and it's not going to be a popular opinion. At what point do you or anyone else believe that just because references are called, you are ever entitled to a job offer? Any company can hire or reject you for any reason they see fit. It could even be your eyebrows for all you know. I get the frustration but never let it turn to entitlement.

What on earth does this have to do with entitlement

I'm not entitled to a green light after waiting at a red light, but I'm cetainly expecting the light to change at some point.

What kind of analogy is this? An expectation of a light to change green and red is a GIVEN. Barring an anomaly, those are GUARANTEED. An interview is NOT. Reference checks are NOT. An offer of employment, regardless of a references being called is NOT.

Therefore, expecting an offer after a reference check is born from a sense of entitlement, especially when you have to come on an internet forum to vent about being 'blindsided' by not getting an offer after the said check. If that isn't entitlement, what would you say exactly is?

[digits_]

Therefore, expecting an offer after a reference check is born from a sense of entitlement, especially when you have to come on an internet forum to vent about being 'blindsided' by not getting an offer after the said check. If that isn't entitlement, what would you say exactly is?

It's a logical expectation. Not a guarantee, not a demand, just an expectation. It is/should be the last step in an interview process. Both in aviation jobs and other sectors I have never had a job fall through based on a reference check with people you select yourself. It doesn't make much sense you would fail that part if you managed to pass the other stages. You hear it from time to time, but it is quite rare.

And if an expectation isn't met, one can be surprised and curious. That's not being entitled. That's how the job process at most companies works.

[Daniel Cooper]

I've been told applicant's references cook them more often than you'd think. The jealousy is pretty bad in this industry when there is only one job that is considerably better than any other one.

[Nick678]

Therefore, expecting an offer after a reference check is born from a sense of entitlement, especially when you have to come on an internet forum to vent about being 'blindsided' by not getting an offer after the said check. If that isn't entitlement, what would you say exactly is?

It's a logical expectation. Not a guarantee, not a demand, just an expectation. It is/should be the last step in an interview process. Both in aviation jobs and other sectors I have never had a job fall through based on a reference check with people you select yourself. It doesn't make much sense you would fail that part if you managed to pass the other stages. You hear it from time to time, but it is quite rare.

And if an expectation isn't met, one can be surprised and curious. That's not being entitled. That's how the job process at most companies works.

I’m not sure AC does this but I know other companies do. A point system gathered from the total recruitment process. The unfortunate part is you need to complete the whole process to get a your total score and that might not be high enough. Frustrating though.

[jpilot77]

Therefore, expecting an offer after a reference check is born from a sense of entitlement, especially when you have to come on an internet forum to vent about being 'blindsided' by not getting an offer after the said check. If that isn't entitlement, what would you say exactly is?

It's a logical expectation. Not a guarantee, not a demand, just an expectation. It is/should be the last step in an interview process. Both in aviation jobs and other sectors I have never had a job fall through based on a reference check with people you select yourself. It doesn't make much sense you would fail that part if you managed to pass the other stages. You hear it from time to time, but it is quite rare.

And if an expectation isn't met, one can be surprised and curious. That's not being entitled. That's how the job process at most companies works.

I’m not sure AC does this but I know other companies do. A point system gathered from the total recruitment process. The unfortunate part is you need to complete the whole process to get a your total score and that might not be high enough. Frustrating though.

Yes every applicant gets points for various things. Post secondary education, PIC hours, jet PIC, 705 PIC, bilingual, total time, certain college flight schools, military, visible minority etc… Some are worth more more than others. So for example if you meet the bare minimum of hours and you have very little PIC time, no jet, no 705 you’ll would get less points then someone who has all of these. A couple years ago having low points wasn’t an issue cause the hiring was at a very fast rate. Now that hiring has slowed a little it’s harder to get hired with the bare minimum.

[flying4dollars]

I can certainly see why one would be stunned after having references called only to be rejected. This tells me one of two things. 1) One of your reference's peer reviews of you triggered a red flag for the recruitment team. 2) The references checked out, but you simply weren't as competitive vs other candidates at that given time. I also think there may be a misconception or expectation that references get check AFTER reviewing the resume, the test and interview results; which may be the case but references can get checked before everything has been evaluated too. So rooster, while overly blunt may also have a point. A reference check, while promising, is not indicative of a pending offer of employment. I will however say I have personally flown with a LOT of new hires who themselves or a friend was PFO'd but made it passed a second application.

I am also one of those pilots myself. Though I never even got a PFO. I was just ignored for a number of years . So keep your chin up, keep building the resume and reapply when you're ready. The hiring has slowed but not stopped. Good luck!

[Eric Janson]

I see one thing that hasn't been mentioned is Social Media.

Don't think for one moment a company doesn't put a candidates name into a search engine as part of their screening procedures.

Don't put anything on your Social Media that can get you into trouble - just ask Mostafa Ezzo!

I've been called by my employer and asked to remove what I thought were innocuous photos.

My employer had people actively monitoring Social Media - I'm guessing that's the case at most companies these days.